Pope John Paul II dead

[RBA]

Just for the record, I didn't change the title of the thread.

[CbusRed]

Just for the record, I didn't change the title of the thread.

Yeah, some of the mods think its cool to go around editing things that they didnt write...




For the record, the rueters story I read simply said that the Italian Media is reporting that the pope has died. Sounds like a big game of telephone to me. Im sure it will all get worked out shortly.

[Chip R]

Just for the record, I didn't change the title of the thread.

I did because I thought it'd be more accurate to reflect his current condition - or lack thereof.

[M2]

Not a big fan of this Pope but I wish him the best. I grew up Catholic and the passing of Paul IV was a big deal and the passing of John Paul I was a shocker.

Personally I hope they get someone as good as John XXIII.

I read something a while back on papal succession that suggested the church tends to react to the last Pope. Paul VI, who literally almost saw the Americas chuck the church because he was such a twit, was the conservative reaction to John XXIII (though my dad makes a good argument that Mass should be held mostly in Latin with the priest facing in the same direction as the congregation). JPI supposedly was looking to make headway on issues like birth control, divroce, female clergy and allowing priests to marry. On the plus side, JPII did manage to quell the brewing anti-Rome rebellion that had formed during Paul's papacy and he made extraordinary efforts to reach out to the billion-plus worldwide Catholics. Yet obviously he also put the lid on one of the church's finest traditions, debate, and in his later years it created a knee-jerk, I'd argue Protestant, papacy. Hopefully the church reacts to that and elects someone willing to tackle the modern world (someone from South or Central America ideally).

[Unassisted]

Vatican is denying that he has died.

[RedFanAlways1966]

Vatican is denying that he has died.

Evidently they tap his forehead with a silver hammer. They ask, "Are you dead?" If they tap and he does not answer three times in a row, then he is declared dead. I just heard this on the radio.

[traderumor]

Evidently they tap his forehead with a silver hammer. They ask, "Are you dead?" If they tap and he does not answer three times in a row, then he is declared dead. I just heard this on the radio.

[paintmered]

It's tradition. It was probably the most effective tool they had for determining this kind of thing over a thousand years ago.

[Johnny Footstool]

Death is one thing that we all share in common. Death is not a tragedy in and of itself; tragedy occurs when lives are wasted -- cut short before people have a chance to accomplish all they could. While we are sad to lose someone, we should remember all the good they were able to accomplish in their lives.

[Big Donkey]

The latest via the news feed I have at work says that the news reporting his death originated from Sky Italia TV who said his electrocardiogram had gone flat, and that he had no heart or brain activity. A Vatican official responded by saying, "there is no such machine in the papal apartments." A Vatican spokesperson has said that his condition is "noticeably compromised", and that he is breathing shallowly and suffering from worsening blood pressure, as well as heart and kidney problems. There are Cardinals at his bedside now, preparing their final goodbyes.

[Rojo]

JPI supposedly was looking to make headway on issues like birth control, divroce, female clergy and allowing priests to marry. On the plus side, JPII did manage to quell the brewing anti-Rome rebellion that had formed during Paul's papacy and he made extraordinary efforts to reach out to the billion-plus worldwide Catholics.

I've always wondered about JPI's short reign and analogized the Papal ascendency with that of the Kremlin's: Brezhnev's conservative reign was followed by the reformer Andropov, who, in turn was followed by the Brezhnev-disciple Chernenko. Chenenko lasted less than a year and was followed by Andropov-protege Gorbachev. The reformers won out in Moscow, the reactionaries in the Vatican.

JPII, IMO, could have embraced liberation theology in Central America without giving up moral clarity on the Church's attitude toward the Soviet Union. World communism was dying anyhow.

[Chip R]

It's official now.

[SandyD]

Death is one thing that we all share in common. Death is not a tragedy in and of itself; tragedy occurs when lives are wasted -- cut short before people have a chance to accomplish all they could. While we are sad to lose someone, we should remember all the good they were able to accomplish in their lives.

I agree, JF. Very healthy view, in my mind.

As for the Pope, he's earned his rest. Go in peace, JPII.

[KronoRed]

RIP Pope

[RosieRed]

I am not Catholic, and disagree with some aspects of the religion. But I have a lot of respect for John Paul II and what he accomplished in his life. I hope he rests in peace, as he certainly deserves to do.