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Thread: Report Says Muslims Largely Anti-American; Perceive US Population as 85% Jewish

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    RZ Chamber of Commerce Unassisted's Avatar
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    Report Says Muslims Largely Anti-American; Perceive US Population as 85% Jewish

    http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20050519/...slim_attitudes
    Report: Muslim World Largely Anti-American

    By KAREN MATTHEWS, Associated Press Writer 1 hour, 21 minutes ago


    NEW YORK - Anti-American feelings are widespread in the Muslim world and extend to U.S. consumer brands, according to a report released Wednesday. It suggested the U.S. burnish its image with a change in tone and by publicizing aid programs.

    The United States should emphasize its development aid to Muslim countries rather than try to persuade Muslims to support U.S. policies in Iraq or in the Israeli-Palestinian conflict, according to the Council on Foreign Relations report.

    The report, by Charney Research, is based on 14 focus groups conducted last December and January among college-educated men and women in Egypt, Morocco and Indonesia.

    Anger at U.S. foreign policy and at the U.S. government dominated spontaneous reactions in all three countries.

    Many young Muslims said they admired Osama bin Laden, while views of President Bush were uniformly negative. All focus group members rejected U.S. views of the war in Iraq, saying the United States invaded on a false premise to further its own regional goals.

    Anti-Semitic stereotypes also were noted. Focus group members saw the United States and Israel as synonymous and estimated the proportion of Jews in the U.S. population at up to 85 percent; it is 2 percent.

    The report found negative opinions of the United States are taking a toll on U.S. companies, and that amounts of U.S. aid were massively underestimated; not one person in any focus group knew the U.S. is the world's largest donor by dollar amount.

    "Most Egyptians and Indonesians put U.S. support for their countries over 10 years in millions; the correct figures were $7.3 billion and $1 billion, respectively," the authors said.

    When asked what they wanted from the United States, focus group members said respect and aid to develop as their countries choose.

    The Council on Foreign Relations, founded in 1921, is a nonpartisan center for scholars dedicated to helping members and policy-makers better understand the world and governmental policy choices, according to its Web site. The council has headquarters in New York and an office in Washington, D.C.

    Charney Research is a private consulting firm in New York that offers opinion polling and market research.


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    The Mad Monk Jaycint's Avatar
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    Re: Report Says Muslims Largely Anti-American; Perceive US Population as 85% Jewish

    When asked what they wanted from the United States, focus group members said respect and aid to develop as their countries choose.
    Here's a good start then, quit treating women like cattle. Quit killing people because they have the audacity to be Jewish, or Christian, or any other religion that isn't Islam. Quit teaching hatred in your elementary schools. That's a good start.

    Then when you are done with that get a hold of the fact that Israel isn't going anywhere. Learn to live next to your fellow man in peace. I know Israel isn't innocent of violence, there is plenty of blood on their hands as well but for the most part it is in response to having buses full of women and children blown up. Both sides need to learn to coexist which is hard to do when one sides (Hamas) stated intent is the absolute destruction of the Jewish state.

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    Just The Big Picture macro's Avatar
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    Re: Report Says Muslims Largely Anti-American; Perceive US Population as 85% Jewish

    When asked what they wanted from the United States, focus group members said respect and aid to develop as their countries choose.
    Jaycint, I'm going to quote the same sentence, but put the bold on two other words. Am I reading that right? They hate the U.S. but want aid anyway?

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    Re: Report Says Muslims Largely Anti-American; Perceive US Population as 85% Jewish

    Quote Originally Posted by Jaycint
    Here's a good start then, quit treating women like cattle. Quit killing people because they have the audacity to be Jewish, or Christian, or any other religion that isn't Islam. Quit teaching hatred in your elementary schools. That's a good start.

    Then when you are done with that get a hold of the fact that Israel isn't going anywhere. Learn to live next to your fellow man in peace. I know Israel isn't innocent of violence, there is plenty of blood on their hands as well but for the most part it is in response to having buses full of women and children blown up. Both sides need to learn to coexist which is hard to do when one sides (Hamas) stated intent is the absolute destruction of the Jewish state.
    Very, very true, I don't disagree with any of this.

    But you can provide a respect for their culture while not agreeing with certain aspects of it. U.S. foreign policy has been very one-sided with regards to the Israeli-Palestinian conflict, our military presence in the region is to protect our oil interests, we have consistently supported and propped up dictatorships and authoritarians with atrocious human rights records when it has suited our interests, etc.

    I agree that the Muslim world is largely in need ot a giant kick in the rear. They're living, culturally, in the stone age, particularly with their treatment of women and religious fanaticism. But the best way to see improvement in these areas is by offering humanitarian and economic aid, supporting truly democratic movements, providing money and assistance for education and cultural institutions (and tie that money directly to assurances that women will be allowed to participate actively), etc.

    The fact that they view the U.S. as 85% Jewish is a remarkable figure.

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    The Mad Monk Jaycint's Avatar
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    Re: Report Says Muslims Largely Anti-American; Perceive US Population as 85% Jewish

    Quote Originally Posted by registerthis
    Very, very true, I don't disagree with any of this.

    But you can provide a respect for their culture while not agreeing with certain aspects of it. U.S. foreign policy has been very one-sided with regards to the Israeli-Palestinian conflict, our military presence in the region is to protect our oil interests, we have consistently supported and propped up dictatorships and authoritarians with atrocious human rights records when it has suited our interests, etc.

    I agree that the Muslim world is largely in need ot a giant kick in the rear. They're living, culturally, in the stone age, particularly with their treatment of women and religious fanaticism. But the best way to see improvement in these areas is by offering humanitarian and economic aid, supporting truly democratic movements, providing money and assistance for education and cultural institutions (and tie that money directly to assurances that women will be allowed to participate actively), etc.

    The fact that they view the U.S. as 85% Jewish is a remarkable figure.
    I agree with everything you said as well, hopefully I didn't come off as too one-sided in the Israeli-Palestinian thing. It's just when I step back from the situation a little bit and try to look at it in a completely neutral way I see one side trying a lot harder than the other. That being said I think Mahmoud Abbas has done an outstanding job of trying to swing things in the right direction since Arafat passed away and hopefully he can curtail most if not all the militant activity that goes on daily such as firing rockets into Jewish settlements. The hard-line Jewish settlers that are demonstrating and protesting about having to move are not helping the situation either.

    As for the US, I agree we have propped up brutal dictatorships(Iraq) in the past and continue to prop up shady ones(Saudi Arabia) to this day. We need to take our hands off the puppet strings and let the people of those countries decide their own fate. If that involves violent civil uprisings then so be it, but we shouldn't be saying who runs countries half a world away. By the way, I don't hold this position for Afghanistan, I believe we needed to go in there and take care of business for what happened on 9/11. I think if we would have concentrated our manpower and all of our efforts there instead of jumping into another conflict a couple countries over, the world would be a much better place for it.

    As for aid, I don't have the exact numbers in front of me but after Israel I believe I read that Egypt is the second largest recipient of US aid in the entire world. So a largely Muslim country is getting the second most aid dollars that we spend every year. Now the common guy on the street in Cairo may not see that as all that great because he may view Egypt's government as yet another puppet that we control the strings of but it's not like we aren't offering aid to any Muslim countries.

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    Re: Report Says Muslims Largely Anti-American; Perceive US Population as 85% Jewish

    The report, by Charney Research, is based on 14 focus groups conducted last December and January among college-educated men and women in Egypt, Morocco and Indonesia.
    I think that is the most telling part, these people are college educated and they still believe that the US is 85% jewish. I know I learned a lot of worthless crap in college but come on that is just being ignorant about another country.
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    Re: Report Says Muslims Largely Anti-American; Perceive US Population as 85% Jewish

    Quote Originally Posted by LincolnparkRed
    I think that is the most telling part, these people are college educated and they still believe that the US is 85% jewish. I know I learned a lot of worthless crap in college but come on that is just being ignorant about another country.
    Or it shows how perception fits reality.

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    Re: Report Says Muslims Largely Anti-American; Perceive US Population as 85% Jewish

    Quote Originally Posted by Jaycint
    I agree with everything you said as well, hopefully I didn't come off as too one-sided in the Israeli-Palestinian thing. It's just when I step back from the situation a little bit and try to look at it in a completely neutral way I see one side trying a lot harder than the other. That being said I think Mahmoud Abbas has done an outstanding job of trying to swing things in the right direction since Arafat passed away and hopefully he can curtail most if not all the militant activity that goes on daily such as firing rockets into Jewish settlements. The hard-line Jewish settlers that are demonstrating and protesting about having to move are not helping the situation either.
    No, they're not. Abbas has an unenviable and extremely difficult task ahead of him. I wouldn't want to be him right now, that's for sure.

    As for the US, I agree we have propped up brutal dictatorships(Iraq) in the past and continue to prop up shady ones(Saudi Arabia) to this day. We need to take our hands off the puppet strings and let the people of those countries decide their own fate. If that involves violent civil uprisings then so be it, but we shouldn't be saying who runs countries half a world away. By the way, I don't hold this position for Afghanistan, I believe we needed to go in there and take care of business for what happened on 9/11. I think if we would have concentrated our manpower and all of our efforts there instead of jumping into another conflict a couple countries over, the world would be a much better place for it.
    I completely agree. My biggest problem with the Afghanistan war was that we diverted our interests and efforts entirely too quickly. Then again, reports have now come out that the Bush administration spoke with Tony Blair abou an Iraq invasion as early as January 2002, so it'snot particularly surprising that we ended up doing it.

    As for aid, I don't have the exact numbers in front of me but after Israel I believe I read that Egypt is the second largest recipient of US aid in the entire world. So a largely Muslim country is getting the second most aid dollars that we spend every year. Now the common guy on the street in Cairo may not see that as all that great because he may view Egypt's government as yet another puppet that we control the strings of but it's not like we aren't offering aid to any Muslim countries.
    true, we do give a significant amount to Egypt, but it's not just in the amount you give, it's where it goes. Mubarak's government is as corrupt as they come, and though I haven't performed adequate research on the topic, my hunch tells me that a sizeable maount of aid which the U.S. provides goes into Mubarak's government's coffers.

    It's a difficult situation, to be sure. The one thing I pretty much know for certain is that it's very difficult to win over the "hearts and minds" of a people while throwing a gun in their face. This war in Iraq is going to haunt this country for years to come, both militarily and diplomatically.

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    Re: Report Says Muslims Largely Anti-American; Perceive US Population as 85% Jewish

    Quote Originally Posted by registerthis
    Very, very true, I don't disagree with any of this.

    But you can provide a respect for their culture while not agreeing with certain aspects of it. U.S. foreign policy has been very one-sided with regards to the Israeli-Palestinian conflict, our military presence in the region is to protect our oil interests, we have consistently supported and propped up dictatorships and authoritarians with atrocious human rights records when it has suited our interests, etc.

    I agree that the Muslim world is largely in need ot a giant kick in the rear. They're living, culturally, in the stone age, particularly with their treatment of women and religious fanaticism. But the best way to see improvement in these areas is by offering humanitarian and economic aid, supporting truly democratic movements, providing money and assistance for education and cultural institutions (and tie that money directly to assurances that women will be allowed to participate actively), etc.

    The fact that they view the U.S. as 85% Jewish is a remarkable figure.
    The West needs a kick in the rear too, though. Their imperialist model (borrowed basically unchanged from the English and Dutch of two or three centuries ago) needs to be revamped and rethought. They need to stop listening to scumbag hawks like Kissinger, Wolfowitz, and Sharon. They need to adopt an incentive model, not a "shoot first, ask questions later" model the U.S. has been operating under since WWII.

    And the great thing about the West is, they have the money, the resources, and the *secular* democracies to effect change and BE the model.

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    The Mad Monk Jaycint's Avatar
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    Re: Report Says Muslims Largely Anti-American; Perceive US Population as 85% Jewish

    Quote Originally Posted by registerthis
    I completely agree. My biggest problem with the Afghanistan war was that we diverted our interests and efforts entirely too quickly.
    Absolutely. In my opinion if we ever even considered invading Iraq (which I wouldn't have) it should have been well after business was taken care of in Afghanistan. If we had even half of the troops in Afghanistan in the beginning that we have committed to Iraq right now I think it would be in a lot better shape and with a lot more governmental control outside of Kabul. Not to mention the extra manpower to root out remnants of the Taliban as well as Al-Qaeda. Afghanistan could have been the poster child for US goodwill, instead it is a job half-done.

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    Re: Report Says Muslims Largely Anti-American; Perceive US Population as 85% Jewish

    Quote Originally Posted by Jaycint
    Afghanistan could have been the poster child for US goodwill, instead it is a job half-done.
    Exceptionally well put.
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