Turn Off Ads?
Page 2 of 4 FirstFirst 1234 LastLast
Results 16 to 30 of 48

Thread: Tom Cruise's recent behavior putting Mission Impossible III at risk

  1. #16
    Unsolicited Opinions traderumor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Right Down Broadway
    Posts
    18,606

    Re: Tom Cruise's recent behavior putting Mission Impossible III at risk

    No offense at all, jaycint, from my perspective. My purpose is to show the folly of a position that says one should keep religious views private. Of course, I would never encourage shoving one's views down another's throat about anything, whether it be musical tastes, sports, politics, or religion. However, if one can present one's case for their belief system, where's the harm, even if they try to convince one that their view is superior? Where is the threat? If you think Scientology is ridiculous, then what threat is Tom Cruise trying to shove it down your throat? Unless he has special powers that enables him to take over your mind, he is no threat whatsoever, nor is anyone else "evangelizing" their cause. So what's the harm in them expressing their opinion, even if it is persuasive in nature?
    Can't win with 'em

    Can't win without 'em

  2. Turn Off Ads?
  3. #17
    Member ochre's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Posts
    4,266

    Re: Tom Cruise's recent behavior putting Mission Impossible III at risk

    Scientology is a scary scary thing.
    4009



  4. #18
    The Mad Monk Jaycint's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Northern Kentucky
    Posts
    1,283

    Re: Tom Cruise's recent behavior putting Mission Impossible III at risk

    TR, I guess that's just where we will have to agree to disagree. I don't like the idea of "evangelizing" in the manner that it was being done by Cruise or in most cases to be quite honest. I think there is a difference between stating your beliefs and stating your beliefs with the intent to shape someone else's belief system.

    BTW, I didn't mean to single out Scientology, that's why I threw in a couple other religions as well in my original post, it just happens to be the religion of the guy in question that we are discussing. I haven't studied Scientology and don't even know enough about it to have formed an opinion.

  5. #19
    breath westofyou's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2000
    Location
    PDX
    Posts
    42,389

    Re: Tom Cruise's recent behavior putting Mission Impossible III at risk

    Quote Originally Posted by ochre
    Scientology is a scary scary thing.
    Would you like to take a personality test?

    That's the common call I'd get from the one down the street from me as I walked by.

    "No thank you I'd reply... I'm too busy maximizing my potential to take the time."

  6. #20
    Joe Oliver love-child Blimpie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    Lexington
    Posts
    4,893

    Re: Tom Cruise's recent behavior putting Mission Impossible III at risk

    Quote Originally Posted by westofyou
    Would you like to take a personality test?

    That's the common call I'd get from the one down the street from me as I walked by.

    "No thank you I'd reply... I'm too busy maximizing my potential to take the time."
    I've gotta try to remember that one...
    "Booing on opening day is like telling grandma her house smells like old lady."--WOY

  7. #21
    Unsolicited Opinions traderumor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Right Down Broadway
    Posts
    18,606

    Re: Tom Cruise's recent behavior putting Mission Impossible III at risk

    I think there is a difference between stating your beliefs and stating your beliefs with the intent to shape someone else's belief system.
    It isn't about intent, it's about effect. Take for instance discussions about the Reds. As folks provided evidence that proved my convictions wrong and theirs right, then I had to make a decision about what I would believe. I could continue to believe something I knew to be false or I could change my convictions to match what I now believed to be the truth. None of those folks were guilty of "evangelizing," they were simply providing opinions based on evidence and relating that to a belief. I believe matters such as religious belief can and should be approached in the same manner--provide the evidence for the belief and let the person seeking the truth examine the evidence. Then, the evidence does the persuading. But I don't know how one can provide evidence without verbalizing, either spoken or written. It's just a necessity, and suggesting that be thwarted is doing little more than suppressing the free flow of ideas and promoting the religion of secularism (which sounds like an oxymoron, but is a religion in this context). Just because one doesn't like a belief system doesn't mean they should not be allowed to speak about it publicly.
    Can't win with 'em

    Can't win without 'em

  8. #22
    A Little to the Left Redsfaithful's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Location
    Bexley, OH
    Posts
    7,463

    Re: Tom Cruise's recent behavior putting Mission Impossible III at risk

    Just because one doesn't like a belief system doesn't mean they should not be allowed to speak about it publicly.
    I'm fine with people speaking about whatever they want publically. But it can be annoying, and Scientologists (along with quite a few other flavors of religious belief) are usually pretty grating.

    Telling people you know well about your belief system is one thing, accosting people you don't know at all is another. I think people have the most problem when individuals they don't know try to pass along their religious beliefs.

    Then there are politicians who try to legislate their religious beliefs, which is arguably quite dangerous, but I don't want to pull this thread too far off topic.
    We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars.
    --Oscar Wilde

  9. #23
    Member The Baumer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    New York
    Posts
    1,295

    Re: Tom Cruise's recent behavior putting Mission Impossible III at risk

    Quote Originally Posted by Jaycint
    I haven't studied Scientology and don't even know enough about it to have formed an opinion.
    Let's just say it was formed by a science fiction writer (L. Ron Hubbard) who was quoted as once saying "The quickest way to become a millionaire is to start your own religion". Also the future leader of the church disbanded while he was being groomed because he felt like it was a huge lie and a scam.

    Who was this future leader? Why L. Ron Hubbard's very own son.

    No offense to anyone, those are just two facts.

  10. #24
    Man Pills
    Join Date
    Dec 2000
    Location
    Philadelphia
    Posts
    24,913

    Re: Tom Cruise's recent behavior putting Mission Impossible III at risk

    The Scientologists around where I live offer to give you an IQ test. I would LOVE to see Tom Cruise's IQ results.

    He strikes me as dumber than a packet of saccharine.

  11. #25
    The Mad Monk Jaycint's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Northern Kentucky
    Posts
    1,283

    Re: Tom Cruise's recent behavior putting Mission Impossible III at risk

    Quote Originally Posted by traderumor
    Just because one doesn't like a belief system doesn't mean they should not be allowed to speak about it publicly.
    Again, I'm not saying people shouldn't be allowed to speak openly about their beliefs. I really think we are arguing two different points here. If people want to speak about what they believe to others of like mind then fine, I have no issue with that. What I have issue with is someone criticizing someone else about what they believe and flat out judging that other person based on those beliefs (i.e. Cruise and Shields).

    By the way, I do believe in a higher power, I just don't think he attaches his name to one religion.

  12. #26
    Maple SERP savafan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2000
    Location
    Cincinnati, Ohio
    Posts
    17,564

    Re: Tom Cruise's recent behavior putting Mission Impossible III at risk

    Quote Originally Posted by The Baumer
    Let's just say it was formed by a science fiction writer (L. Ron Hubbard) who was quoted as once saying "The quickest way to become a millionaire is to start your own religion". Also the future leader of the church disbanded while he was being groomed because he felt like it was a huge lie and a scam.

    Who was this future leader? Why L. Ron Hubbard's very own son.

    No offense to anyone, those are just two facts.
    I've always found it quite humorous that so many would follow a "religion" created by a science fiction novelist. A lifestyle perhaps, or a belief system, but it should hardly be a religion.

    It's insulting to so many of us who are practicing Jedi.
    My dad got to enjoy 3 Reds World Championships by the time he was my age. So far, I've only gotten to enjoy one. Step it up Redlegs!

  13. #27
    Unsolicited Opinions traderumor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Right Down Broadway
    Posts
    18,606

    Re: Tom Cruise's recent behavior putting Mission Impossible III at risk

    Quote Originally Posted by Jaycint
    Again, I'm not saying people shouldn't be allowed to speak openly about their beliefs. I really think we are arguing two different points here. If people want to speak about what they believe to others of like mind then fine, I have no issue with that. What I have issue with is someone criticizing someone else about what they believe and flat out judging that other person based on those beliefs (i.e. Cruise and Shields).

    By the way, I do believe in a higher power, I just don't think he attaches his name to one religion.
    Pray tell how folks would find each other of like mind if they only speak these things among those who are likeminded? And that is not allowing folks to speak openly about their beliefs if you limit it to private meetings. Your ideas are exactly why the freedom of speech and the freedom or religion are so important.
    Can't win with 'em

    Can't win without 'em

  14. #28
    The Mad Monk Jaycint's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Northern Kentucky
    Posts
    1,283

    Re: Tom Cruise's recent behavior putting Mission Impossible III at risk

    Quote Originally Posted by traderumor
    Pray tell how folks would find each other of like mind if they only speak these things among those who are likeminded? And that is not allowing folks to speak openly about their beliefs if you limit it to private meetings. Your ideas are exactly why the freedom of speech and the freedom or religion are so important.
    Sigh, apparently I am quite terrible at getting across my point.

    1. I am not advocating censoring anybody's right to speak whether publicly or privately about what they believe. Believe me I am a firm believer in the first ammendment. When I said that they should be able to speak openly with others of like mind about their beliefs I didn't mean behind closed doors and at a low whisper. The implication that "my" ideas are the reason freedom of speech and freedom of religion are so important is WAY off base.

    2. What I don't like is agressive "evangelizing" and telling others with a straight face that what they believe is wrong because it doesn't fall in line with what you believe.

    I don't really know how else I can say it.

  15. #29
    Maple SERP savafan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2000
    Location
    Cincinnati, Ohio
    Posts
    17,564

    Re: Tom Cruise's recent behavior putting Mission Impossible III at risk

    I get what you're saying Jaycint, I just don't know how to say it any better either.
    My dad got to enjoy 3 Reds World Championships by the time he was my age. So far, I've only gotten to enjoy one. Step it up Redlegs!

  16. #30
    The Mad Monk Jaycint's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Northern Kentucky
    Posts
    1,283

    Re: Tom Cruise's recent behavior putting Mission Impossible III at risk

    Thanks Sava, I thought I was being pretty clear about it but I can see how sometimes on a message board it is a little harder to convey what you mean. Especially considering that I'm not quite the wordsmith that some on here are.


Turn Off Ads?

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Board Moderators may, at their discretion and judgment, delete and/or edit any messages that violate any of the following guidelines: 1. Explicit references to alleged illegal or unlawful acts. 2. Graphic sexual descriptions. 3. Racial or ethnic slurs. 4. Use of edgy language (including masked profanity). 5. Direct personal attacks, flames, fights, trolling, baiting, name-calling, general nuisance, excessive player criticism or anything along those lines. 6. Posting spam. 7. Each person may have only one user account. It is fine to be critical here - that's what this board is for. But let's not beat a subject or a player to death, please.

Thank you, and most importantly, enjoy yourselves!


RedsZone.com is a privately owned website and is not affiliated with the Cincinnati Reds or Major League Baseball


Contact us: Boss | GIK | BCubb2003 | dabvu2498 | Gallen5862 | LexRedsFan | Plus Plus | RedlegJake | redsfan1995 | The Operator | Tommyjohn25