Amen!!! I just hope they realize this before the Reds become the Bengals of the 90's! But with DanO and Uncle Carl, it looks oh so possible!
Amen!!! I just hope they realize this before the Reds become the Bengals of the 90's! But with DanO and Uncle Carl, it looks oh so possible!
I understand where your coming from here Red Leader. If we are going to rebuild for two to three years, than we need to be completely serious about it. However, pitching is a prized jewel these days. Look around the league, almost everyone has two to three good starters, cept for probably the bottom feeders like us (TB and Col) Everyone else is not going to give up pitching prospects. Espcially, so called studs like Chad Billingsley. Not gonna happen. We have Harang. He's relatively young. He will only improve. I would like to see some stats to see how far he is up on strikeouts this year in compared to this time last year?!? Why not keep him around, continue to see him get better and let him mentor pitching prospects that are traded to us for our big power guys. Harang can only get better barring any arm injuries. Adam Dunn will never get any better. He will be a great home run hitter all his career but he has already. He has proven he will hit over 40 HR consistently. He is a daunting figure many pitchers are intimidated to pitch too with RISP. He has the most value and we have home run hitters already, ie Wily Mo and Griffey. Not to mention even Edwin coming up from AAA soon hits alot of long balls.Originally Posted by Red Leader
Harang is the closest thing to an ace that we'd had in awhile. He's doing well KEEP HIM. HE'S CHEAP. Think about some of the previous pitchers they've brought in to try to solve our pitching woes-
Dempster
Wilson
Milton
Haynes
Only guys who have done as well as Harang in the past 6 or 7 years are Neagle and Dessens and they've done comparably.
The Mets dealt Kazmir. The A's have dealt Jeremy Bonderman, and the player we're talking about, Harang, among others in deadline deals.Originally Posted by forfreelin04
If the Reds would make Aaron Harang available, he would immediately shoot to the top of the list of pitchers available. Meaning at that point, the Reds basically dictate what they want in return for him. Some stupid team will give in and give us a real good return for him. That's the way it should work. With DanO in charge, I'd probably side with you and say keep Harang because DanO will sell short of what we need. He'd end up sending Harang to the Dodgers for Edwin Jackson and Olmedo Saenz or something like that.
Last edited by Red Leader; 06-16-2005 at 03:36 PM.
'When I'm not longer rapping, I want to open up an ice cream parlor and call myself Scoop Dogg.'
-Snoop on his retirement
Your Mom is happy.
I wouldn't mind some of the Mets minor leaguers for Casey. I watch their single A affiliate sometimes and they have some great young guys- Mike Carp, Grant Psomas, Jose Sanchez. I wouldn't mind some of those guys at all.
I would want AAA or AA prospects regardless of who is traded. I don't realistically see the fans waiting 4-5 years for a winner. The management of this team must produce in the next year or two.
I don't want DanO trading away pitching.
Harang's an honest to goodness, meat and potatoes, middle of the rotation starter.
As good as he seems to us, he's pretty much two nothces above last year's Paul Wilson in the grand scheme of things. He's actually the type pitcher that DanO tried to convince us Paul Wilson was last season. He's the guy who'll take the ball every fifth day and give a club a reasonable shot at winning. He's healthy, he's effective, and he's cheap.
I'm usually all for trading guys away, but hold onto Harang, unless of course, DanO could throw himself into the deal for DePodesta in return.
"Baseball players are smarter than football players. How often do you see a baseball team penalized for too many men on the field?" ~ Jim Bouton
Update on LA's Edwin Jackson- he was demote to Double A today to find his groove according to there GM. H e being passed by there otreh prospect like Billingsley and Miller. he might need a change of team to get him back on the right road.
I'd say he needs more than a change of secenery to get back on track. The guy's stock is falling quicker than one of those dot com's you'd hear about on Super Bowl Sunday....Or something like that.Originally Posted by Royals Fan
Good thing DanO wouldn't trade Dunn for him a couple of years ago.
"Baseball players are smarter than football players. How often do you see a baseball team penalized for too many men on the field?" ~ Jim Bouton
A lot of people wanted that trade to be made. There is nothing more volatile, unpredictable and injury prone that young pitching.Originally Posted by wheels
It's really hard to say this, but let's be honest... would a change to the Reds and their history with pitchers be the best thing to get him back on the right road?Originally Posted by Royals Fan
For his sake you hope he's traded somewhere that they develop pitchers, lately, that's NOT the Reds.
Not me, at I don't think I did.Originally Posted by Ricardo Cabesa
"Baseball players are smarter than football players. How often do you see a baseball team penalized for too many men on the field?" ~ Jim Bouton
Maybe you could embellish on why you think he's having a flukish year and don't think he can continue at this level for the next 5... because at this point in his career, I don't understand how you can possibly make that determination.Originally Posted by buckeyenut
As you say, he's young. He's taken a giant step up this year. Why is there more reason to think he's a fluke then there is to think he's a promising young pitcher with a whole lot of upside?
Personally, I don't think anyone can truly answer that question at this point in time. Thus, shouldn't he be given some time to continue to develop... with the Reds? Do you really think they should rid themselves of a promising young pitcher based on conjecture? Especially when they do enough of that already.
For once, I hope they do it right and wait long enough to make an informed decision based on facts. Only hindsight will tell for sure, but trading him now is foolish in my opinion. They could easily be giving away a really promising future to another team just as easily as not. And for what? Another unknown who may not be as promising in the long run?
When pitching is a team's weakness, to me, you just don't take that chance based on an uneducated guess that his performance in 2005 may be a fluke.
Last edited by TeamBoone; 06-16-2005 at 04:56 PM.
"Enjoy this Reds fans, you are watching a legend grow up before your very eyes" ... DoogMinAmo on Adam Dunn
Hmmm, I agree with forfreelin. Harang just turned 27 in May... young for a pitcher. In five more years, he'll still only be 32.Originally Posted by Red Leader
How many good pitchers continue to be productive beyond that ? Quite a few actually.
Aaron Harang could be helping the Reds out for a long time if he continues to do well.
"Enjoy this Reds fans, you are watching a legend grow up before your very eyes" ... DoogMinAmo on Adam Dunn
Harang is the one Reds pitcher who does not pitch to contact. He actually K's people. Somehow I fear this will influence Dan O's decision in some sick and twisted negative way. Couple this with his innate lack of intelligence and we will see a fleecing on par with selling Manhattan for some shiney beads.
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