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Thread: Unapologetic Church Advertising...

  1. #286
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    Re: Unapologetic Church Advertising...

    [QUOTE=traderumor]
    Quote Originally Posted by James B.
    If you remember, James, one of the first things you mentioned in this thread was directed at me, and you quoted James when he said "You believe in one God? Good, so do the demons and tremble." So does that mean you were comparing me to demons? Regardless, there is no need to be melodramatic, Christ spoke to Peter once and said "get behind, thee, Satan" and false teaching is referred to as "doctrines of demons" elsewhere in Scripture.

    The last part, you must have changed your position, because you have said throughout that one needs to be baptized to be saved, perhaps even baptized in a Church of Christ depending on how far you take it, that the atonement was not enough.

    Traderumor I was not comparing you to demons. I was just trying to show that it takes more than belief to be saved or the demons would be saved. I did not change my position. I just said you had to accept Christ. Being baptized is just part of accepting Christ.

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  3. #287
    Unsolicited Opinions traderumor's Avatar
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    Re: Unapologetic Church Advertising...

    [QUOTE=James B.]
    Quote Originally Posted by traderumor


    Traderumor I was not comparing you to demons. I was just trying to show that it takes more than belief to be saved or the demons would be saved. I did not change my position. I just said you had to accept Christ. Being baptized is just part of accepting Christ.
    Exactly, nor was I comparing you to Satan. I was saying that your concept was similar to the one the serpent used in the temptation of Eve.

    As for the other stuff, we're going in circles. I've enjoyed the discussion and doing the homework to respond to you with answers that I hope were faithful to what the Scriptures say.
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  4. #288
    You're soaking in it! MartyFan's Avatar
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    Re: Unapologetic Church Advertising...

    Quote Originally Posted by WVRed
    Im all too familiar with KCU. Its in Grayson(where I used to live), which is around 30 minutes outside of Ashland. They also are known for producing the Christian rock band Audio Adrenaline, which is suprising since KCU is a Church of Christ college.

    While PCC is noted for its strictness(a college that has elevators for men and women, for example), I have found KCU to be the other extreme. However, I believe that we are saved by grace, through faith, and not by water.
    You are right...They are in Grayson where a lot of my family lives...in fact...I thought about building a home in beautiful Olive Hill, KY!!! We have some acreage down there and spend a ton of time...I have met a few people who have gone therough KCC, not because of a church affiliation but because I do comedy in a ton of churches...and I used to work in the Christian Music Industry...so...a lot of people move around and through that school...everyone I met seemed pretty solid.
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  5. #289
    THAT'S A FACT JACK!! GAC's Avatar
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    Re: Unapologetic Church Advertising...

    [QUOTE=James B.]
    Quote Originally Posted by traderumor


    Traderumor I was not comparing you to demons. I was just trying to show that it takes more than belief to be saved or the demons would be saved. I did not change my position. I just said you had to accept Christ. Being baptized is just part of accepting Christ.
    the word for "believe, belief, faith, trust" and a few others in scripture come from the same family of the Greek word "pistis", meaning "full persuasion". Biblical faith has two main components... 1) trust or acceptance, that Jesus is Lord with acknowledgement of his resurrection. 2) intellectual content, the revealed truth that is firmly believed and is reflected in the life of the believer. It's a faith that can be seen. It has nothing to do with external sacraments (works). it's a faith in action.

    Again- look at the example held up to all N.T. believers in Abraham. He believed God (was fully persuaded that God would do what he promised) and then Abraham acted (stepped out in faith IN that promise...His faith was credited to him as righteousness.

    Intellectual and mental assent is an empty faith/belief if there is no corresponding action/change in life in line with that belief. The passage in James is a confirmation of that type of faith that is "dead". Even the demons give affirmation/acknowledge at the oneness of God and tremble at it's implications.

    The disciples left all to follow Jesus. Why? Their faith of being fully persuaded in the person of Jesus Christ. They put their faith to action.

    Hebrews 11 is the supreme example of people's faith in action.
    Last edited by GAC; 07-19-2005 at 09:21 AM.
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  6. #290
    THAT'S A FACT JACK!! GAC's Avatar
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    Re: Unapologetic Church Advertising...

    I think the bottomline (or question), when it comes to one's participation in sacraments is where is your trust placed? In your participation in the sacrament, or in the person of Jesus Christ and what he accomplished for us? I participate in certain sacraments. They are symbolic and are a consistent reminder of the spiritual and eternal significance of what Christ did for all men. For instance - the Lord's Supper (communion). Jesus said "Do this in remembrance of me".

    Jesus was very critical of the external religion that had evolved within Judaism with all of it's ceremonies, rituals, and observances. All these are fine if they are kept in their right setting, and one realizes why they were instituted by God. Many of them where instituted by God in the O.T. to be "tutors" or to educate the Jews to the "reality" that was to come in Jesus Christ. They were "types" of Christ. The book of Hebrews tells us alot about this in chapters 6-10, and the superiority of the new covenant instituted by Christ over the old.

    And again, all this leads into Hebrews 11, where we examples of the the faith that saves.
    "panic" only comes from having real expectations


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