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Thread: Jayson Starks Top 10 to watch as the trade deadline approaches

  1. #46
    Let's ride BRM's Avatar
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    Re: Jayson Starks Top 10 to watch as the trade deadline approaches

    Quote Originally Posted by FreelFanatic
    You can't win with a power-filled lineup and no pitching, especially when the power comes in the Rob Deer form of home run or strikeout.
    Or a double (Reds are 1st in NL) or a walk (4th in NL). Believe it or not, the Reds are actually 7th in the NL in everyone's favorite stat - batting average.

    The Reds are not simply a HR or strikeout team.
    Last edited by BRM; 07-18-2005 at 05:38 PM.

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  3. #47
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    Re: Jayson Starks Top 10 to watch as the trade deadline approaches

    Quote Originally Posted by BRM
    The Reds are not simply a HR or strikeout team.
    Again, you guys seem to be missing my point. As I said 1st, in reply to...

    Quote Originally Posted by Centralchamps05
    While the offense would miss Dunn's homers, the team still has a number of guys who can hit 30 dingers--but there is no one who can come close to winning 20 games.
    ...it doesn't matter how many runs our lineup can score if our pitchers can't shut down the other team. Anyone here heard of humor? Rob Deer to me is funny. I like Adam Dunn, but I don't like his 96 strikeouts or his .242 batting average. Yes, he's only below Freel on the team in OBP (.391 to .406). And yes, I believe OBP is much more important than Average. But, like Centralchamps05 clearly stated, we can make up the home runs, hell we have a monster power hitter lighting up AAA as we speak. But we can't produce 20 wins, let alone 15 (and possibly this year, let alone 10...considering the team lead is 5) from within the organization. I would much rather have three 15-game winners and three 30-home run hitters than 0 and 6.
    Quote Originally Posted by Natty Redlocks
    I'm convinced Jay Bruce could homer every single time up the rest of the spring and cure cancer in his spare time and still not make the team.

  4. #48
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    Re: Jayson Starks Top 10 to watch as the trade deadline approaches

    Quote Originally Posted by FreelFanatic
    Again, you guys seem to be missing my point. As I said 1st, in reply to...



    ...it doesn't matter how many runs our lineup can score if our pitchers can't shut down the other team. Anyone here heard of humor? Rob Deer to me is funny. I like Adam Dunn, but I don't like his 96 strikeouts or his .242 batting average. Yes, he's only below Freel on the team in OBP (.391 to .406). And yes, I believe OBP is much more important than Average. But, like Centralchamps05 clearly stated, we can make up the home runs, hell we have a monster power hitter lighting up AAA as we speak. But we can't produce 20 wins, let alone 15 (and possibly this year, let alone 10...considering the team lead is 5) from within the organization. I would much rather have three 15-game winners and three 30-home run hitters than 0 and 6.
    Mr. Obvious said, "Wins are a poor way to judge a pitcher."
    "My mission is to be the ray of hope, the guy who stands out there on that beautiful field and owns up to his mistakes and lets people know it's never completely hopeless, no matter how bad it seems at the time. I have a platform and a message, and now I go to bed at night, sober and happy, praying I can be a good messenger." -Josh Hamilton

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    Re: Jayson Starks Top 10 to watch as the trade deadline approaches

    I like Kearns alot, but I don't know what you're smoking thinking that he can fill the void Adam Dunn would leave offensively.

  6. #50
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    Re: Jayson Starks Top 10 to watch as the trade deadline approaches

    Quote Originally Posted by FreelFanatic
    Again, you guys seem to be missing my point. As I said 1st, in reply to...



    ...it doesn't matter how many runs our lineup can score if our pitchers can't shut down the other team. Anyone here heard of humor? Rob Deer to me is funny. I like Adam Dunn, but I don't like his 96 strikeouts or his .242 batting average. Yes, he's only below Freel on the team in OBP (.391 to .406). And yes, I believe OBP is much more important than Average. But, like Centralchamps05 clearly stated, we can make up the home runs, hell we have a monster power hitter lighting up AAA as we speak. But we can't produce 20 wins, let alone 15 (and possibly this year, let alone 10...considering the team lead is 5) from within the organization. I would much rather have three 15-game winners and three 30-home run hitters than 0 and 6.
    Kearns has been called many things, but a 'monster power hitter' probably isn't one of them...
    "Booing on opening day is like telling grandma her house smells like old lady."--WOY

  7. #51
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    Re: Jayson Starks Top 10 to watch as the trade deadline approaches

    Randa is the other third baseman on the menu for teams that don't want Lowell's price tag. But despite all that talk of a bidding frenzy building around the eminently available Randa, clubs that have spoken with the Reds say he's been insanely overpriced. The White Sox, Indians and Twins have had some degree of interest. But all those teams are believed to view Randa as no more than a secondary priority. "We're just lukewarm about him," said an official of one team that at least checked in on Randa. "He's had a nice year. But he's never played on a winning team. And he's not the kind of player you overpay for."
    My take is these other clubs doth protest too much. Insanely overpriced probably means the Reds are asking for a quality primary prospect and a solid secondary one in the deal. Frankly, if I'm the Twins and I can get Randa for Scott Baker and Travis Bowyer, I jump on that. That's not overpaying. That's filling a gaping wound in your lineup with a veteran playing real good baseball for some of the depth you've built up in your minors. That's how it's supposed to work.

    IMO, if the White Sox don't want to be done in three or four games in October they ought to be willing to make a serious offer on anybody who doesn't completely suck at the plate and can play the left side of the IF.

    What you've got right now is teams that want something for nothing. More power to them, but all DanO should have to do is ask them whether they actually want to win something before the inevitable day they get fired. Honestly, I don't see how Terry Ryan can turn him away. The ChiSox have pitched out of the their minds this season and the Twins are probably going to have to beat out the Yankees or Red Sox if they want to make the playoffs.

    If I'm DanO, I'm shooting him e-mails that say "Hey Terry, some of us midwest GMs were thinking of getting together to watch the playoffs. Melvin's got high-def at his place on Lake Michigan and Baird's bringing up some authentic KC barbecue. I figured I should mention it to you since your team's stuck in neutral and those monsters in the east are heating up and you don't seem inclined to do anything about it. Anyway, see you there."
    Baseball isn't a magic trick ... it doesn't get spoiled if you figure out how it works. - gonelong

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    Re: Jayson Starks Top 10 to watch as the trade deadline approaches

    If I'm DanO, I'm shooting him e-mails that say "Hey Terry, some of us midwest GMs were thinking of getting together to watch the playoffs. Melvin's got high-def at his place on Lake Michigan and Baird's bringing up some authentic KC barbecue. I figured I should mention it to you since your team's stuck in neutral and those monsters in the east are heating up and you don't seem inclined to do anything about it. Anyway, see you there."


    I really do think there is merit behind contenders parting with a prospect or 2 in order to get much needed help to shore up weaknesses. I remember when the Reds gave up B.J. Ryan in 1999 for Juan Guzman at the deadline. I know alot of you here disagree, but I feel that trade was worth it from the standpoint that the Reds nearly made the playoffs that year & Guzman pitched oustanding for us. On a normal year, our record would have cruised into the playoffs, sadly the Mets got us in the end. But my feeling is that the Orioles were fortunate that Ryan panned out & turned into a great reliever, but Guzman's performance for the Reds made that trade worth it.

  9. #53
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    Re: Jayson Starks Top 10 to watch as the trade deadline approaches

    Quote Originally Posted by OSURedLeg
    I really do think there is merit behind contenders parting with a prospect or 2 in order to get much needed help to shore up weaknesses. I remember when the Reds gave up B.J. Ryan in 1999 for Juan Guzman at the deadline. I know alot of you here disagree, but I feel that trade was worth it from the standpoint that the Reds nearly made the playoffs that year & Guzman pitched oustanding for us. On a normal year, our record would have cruised into the playoffs, sadly the Mets got us in the end. But my feeling is that the Orioles were fortunate that Ryan panned out & turned into a great reliever, but Guzman's performance for the Reds made that trade worth it.
    I completely agree. I've never once pined for Ryan. Guzman kept the Reds in one of the most exciting pennant races I've ever seen. Ryan was a good prospect who took four seasons to come around. A starting pitcher who helps drive your club to 96 wins is worth that.
    Baseball isn't a magic trick ... it doesn't get spoiled if you figure out how it works. - gonelong

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  10. #54
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    Re: Jayson Starks Top 10 to watch as the trade deadline approaches

    I'm not against that trade, but it still irks me that the pitcher we dealt ends up being a left handed K-machining stud. I'd be trying to hire the scout that suggested the O's get Ryan in return.
    'When I'm not longer rapping, I want to open up an ice cream parlor and call myself Scoop Dogg.'
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  11. #55
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    Re: Jayson Starks Top 10 to watch as the trade deadline approaches

    Quote Originally Posted by OSURedLeg
    Other GMs annoyed with O'Brien's incompetence? I'm absolutely SHOCKED!
    Cheap shot that is pandering to the board :thumbdown ...c'mon, would you rather they LOVE what he is asking for? Think it through...I am happy the other GM's are thinking any of our players are overpriced...lets them know they have to give up something to get something.
    "Sometimes, it's not the sexiest moves that put you over the top," Krivsky said. "It's a series of transactions that help you get there."

  12. #56
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    Re: Jayson Starks Top 10 to watch as the trade deadline approaches

    Quote Originally Posted by FreelFanatic
    I like Adam Dunn, but I don't like his 96 strikeouts or his .242 batting average.
    Oh come on! Those two stats are moot when you consider all the other, more meaningful stats, that he excels in.

    Adam Dunn is the least of the Reds problems. Why can't people see this?

    I hate people hitting into double plays... a strikeout is a whole lot better than making two outs with one swing of the bat, plus robbing the team of a baserunner. Much worse.
    "Enjoy this Reds fans, you are watching a legend grow up before your very eyes" ... DoogMinAmo on Adam Dunn

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    Re: Jayson Starks Top 10 to watch as the trade deadline approaches

    Quote Originally Posted by MartyFan
    Cheap shot that is pandering to the board :thumbdown ...c'mon, would you rather they LOVE what he is asking for? Think it through...I am happy the other GM's are thinking any of our players are overpriced...lets them know they have to give up something to get something.
    I shouldn't have phrased it so strongly MartyFan I agree. But to bring it down to the simplest terms of how I fear the situation is, it sounds like O'Brien is trying to trade a Railroad property for Park Place straight up, & I am very concerned that his rebuttles will irritate other GMs to the extent that they will go somewhere else to fill their needs. I don't disagree at all with what you're saying, but as I've asserted - I'm not at all convinced that DanO has the intelligence & creativity to make beneficial trades for the Cincinnati Reds. It is simply my opinion, and next time I will avoid such strong language when conveying it.

  14. #58
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    Re: Jayson Starks Top 10 to watch as the trade deadline approaches

    Randa for Baker/Bowyer sounds good, Baker throws the low 90's sinker O'brien craves, I even would throw in Richie Gardner if there was a holdup. If I was O'brien, I would be dealing all Bowden era pitching draftee's for other teams talent.

    Plus it isn't like Baker's the most talented pitcher in the world, he probably will be a moderately better pitcher than Harang if it works out. If the Twins can't do that, they have a problem I can't solve.

  15. #59
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    Re: Jayson Starks Top 10 to watch as the trade deadline approaches

    keep kearns or dunn long term, and I'll be happy....I'd like to see kearns return to the ML level though sometime this year, jeeze

  16. #60
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    Re: Jayson Starks Top 10 to watch as the trade deadline approaches

    What I'm afraid of is that DanO will end up trading Dunn and will get less than he is asking for Randa.


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