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Thread: Non-Baseball Forum Political and Religious Thread Changes

  1. #61
    Member redsrule2500's Avatar
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    Re: Non-Baseball Forum Political and Religious Thread Changes

    That stinks, man I wish this place had unlimited funding
    redsrule2500
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  3. #62
    Titanic Struggles Caveat Emperor's Avatar
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    Re: Non-Baseball Forum Political and Religious Thread Changes

    I don't feel like reading through this entire thread, so don't kill me if this has already been brought up...

    Boss/GIK: How have the bandwidth issues been doing? I know this was a major problem a while back, and I've noticed a couple of times in the last few weeks that logging in has been tough on here, some database errors or something.

    On a similar thought, how is the financial aspect of the board doing? Is there a need for funds at all to keep things going?

    Thanks for all you guys do!
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  4. #63
    THAT'S A FACT JACK!! GAC's Avatar
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    Re: Non-Baseball Forum Political and Religious Thread Changes

    The issue is not about people having "thick skin". Most of us have been on this forum since it's inception. And the people on here, on both sides, have been differing and arguing for just about as long. So IMO, it's not an issue of having thick skin. We all got it, or else we wouldn't have been arguing all this time and keep coming back

    It's an issue of the mods not being able to "babysit" and moderate at a consistent/efficient level -and not wanting to! And I respect that. They gave us ALL fair warning a few months ago, and we never learned from it.

    Blame ourselves - not the mods.
    "panic" only comes from having real expectations

  5. #64
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    Re: Non-Baseball Forum Political and Religious Thread Changes

    Quote Originally Posted by MWM
    Thicker skin? Who needs thick skin? It's an internet message board that exists to talk Reds baseball. That's all it is. I stopped reading the political threads a few months ago because there was nothing to be learned from them anymore. Seriously, I can hardly think of any enlightening conversation on politics in a long time that wasn't like watching 2nd graders bicker over who's baseball card collection was better. Sure, there were lots of people with great articulation skills who can make it look like it's well-reasoned debate, but underneath it all it was nothing more than "I'm smart, you're dumb", basically reciting verbatim what can be found at worldnetdaily or The New Republic (of which I am a loyal reader). And it came from BOTH sides, so I'm not trying to single anyone out. It was almost everyone involved, from my perception.

    You mentioned earlier that people need to understand the difference between personal attacks and attacks on a position. I think people probably just have different definitions, so what might not be personal to you, might be very personal to others and I don't think anyone can marginalize that or try to tell others what they should take personally. Watching how some folks behave in those "debates" was disappointing to watch for me personally, which was the main reason I stopped reading them altogether (except for two threads I unknowingly wandered into), and I don't blame the mods for not wanting to put up with it anymore. At leat that's my take....probably not worth much.

    Personally, I don't see what anyone gains from these discussions. They can't possibly be enjoyable, can they? I've seen well-reasoned, intelligent, yet heated political debate before, and what we've had on the non-BB side of RedsZone ain't it.
    I happen to think a number of the debates on here have been brilliantly argued, thoughtfully handled, and incredibly educational. Sure you've got to sift through some empty regurgitation of talking points and unthoughtful voluminousness, but I, for one, am consistently educated and excited by posts from guys and gals like registerthis, SteelSD, Rojo, M2, SunDeck, RosieRed and I know I'm leaving some out.

    But as I said earlier, it's not my house.

  6. #65
    The Mad Monk Jaycint's Avatar
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    Re: Non-Baseball Forum Political and Religious Thread Changes

    Quote Originally Posted by MWM
    Thicker skin? Who needs thick skin? It's an internet message board that exists to talk Reds baseball. That's all it is. I stopped reading the political threads a few months ago because there was nothing to be learned from them anymore. Seriously, I can hardly think of any enlightening conversation on politics in a long time that wasn't like watching 2nd graders bicker over who's baseball card collection was better. Sure, there were lots of people with great articulation skills who can make it look like it's well-reasoned debate, but underneath it all it was nothing more than "I'm smart, you're dumb", basically reciting verbatim what can be found at worldnetdaily or The New Republic (of which I am a loyal reader). And it came from BOTH sides, so I'm not trying to single anyone out. It was almost everyone involved, from my perception.

    You mentioned earlier that people need to understand the difference between personal attacks and attacks on a position. I think people probably just have different definitions, so what might not be personal to you, might be very personal to others and I don't think anyone can marginalize that or try to tell others what they should take personally. Watching how some folks behave in those "debates" was disappointing to watch for me personally, which was the main reason I stopped reading them altogether (except for two threads I unknowingly wandered into), and I don't blame the mods for not wanting to put up with it anymore. At leat that's my take....probably not worth much.

    Personally, I don't see what anyone gains from these discussions. They can't possibly be enjoyable, can they? I've seen well-reasoned, intelligent, yet heated political debate before, and what we've had on the non-BB side of RedsZone ain't it.

    Post of the month. Very well put.

  7. #66
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    Re: Non-Baseball Forum Political and Religious Thread Changes

    Did you ever think maybe instead of taking potshots at basically every poster on the non-BB side that you might instead *add* something to the debate? After all, a debate is as good as its participants. I find the haughtiness and imperiousness a little dull and offensive myself.

    A guy like RFS62 almost always, by himself, helps raise the bar for discussion through his evenhandedness and fairmindedness; he alone can often change the tenor of a discussion, guiding it towards civility. And that's just one example.

    By the way, I happen to think getting rid of the non-bb side is cutting Redszone's nose off to spite its face. Just take a gander at the activity level of Old Red Guard--freakin' tumbleweeds are blowing through the place. The Reds are the height of uninteresting, so much so that the most active thread on that side is about the most underrated player in history, not even germane to the Reds themselves. I like to think of the non-bb side as the id we Reds fans can dip into as each season goes belly-up by June 1st. I think killing this non-bb side will do one thing, and one thing only: reduce interest in the whole site.
    Last edited by Falls City Beer; 09-03-2005 at 10:34 AM.

  8. #67
    SERP Emeritus paintmered's Avatar
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    Re: Non-Baseball Forum Political and Religious Thread Changes

    Quote Originally Posted by Falls City Beer
    Did you ever think maybe instead of taking potshots at basically every poster on the non-BB side that you might instead *add* something to the debate?
    Not to single you out FCB, you are just the lastest example of this.

    Comments like these are why there will be no more politcal discussions on redszone. While not overly flammatory by itself or against the rules, these comments are often followed by a snide comment in return causing discussions to snowball downhill.

    I've seen it time and time again. People simply refuse to lose a single battle/argument, no matter how arcane or petty it might be. And there's no way to moderate this kind of stuff consistently.
    What if this wasn't a rhetorical question?

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  9. #68
    The Mad Monk Jaycint's Avatar
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    Re: Non-Baseball Forum Political and Religious Thread Changes

    Quote Originally Posted by Falls City Beer

    By the way, I happen to think getting rid of the non-bb side is cutting Redszone's nose off to spite its face. Just take a gander at the activity level of Old Red Guard--freakin' tumbleweeds are blowing through the place. The Reds are the height of uninteresting, so much so that the most active thread on that side is about the most underrated player in history, not even germane to the Reds themselves. I like to think of the non-bb side as the id we Reds fans can dip into as each season goes belly-up by June 1st. I think killing this non-bb side will do one thing, and one thing only: reduce interest in the whole site.
    I completely agree with this assessment. However the fact that I gotta click through one more link to talk politics with these guys really isn't that big of a deal to me.

  10. #69
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    Re: Non-Baseball Forum Political and Religious Thread Changes

    My belief has always been that your posts should favor the baseball side at least 3-1.

    If ones time reflects that they spend more time on the non baseball side arguing politics than the baseball side then I'd have to ponder why you choose to argue these issues on a Reds centric baseball board and expect someone who is there because of the Reds and baseball to take care of policing it.

    As for the board being dead on a labor day weekend during a losing season, que sera, sera you reap what you sow I guess, the fact is the people who run the place think that the Reds should be the farmers of discontent for the board not coastal world views vs. midwestern world views (and that's pretty much what ends up being the locales of the participants of the nastiest exchanges)

  11. #70
    Member ochre's Avatar
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    Re: Non-Baseball Forum Political and Religious Thread Changes

    I would like to point out here, not that it has happened yet, but I would like people to try to use the same(ish) screen name on the other board as they use here. I'll need to discuss it with Boss, et al, but I plan on banning people that try to steal someone else's identity for the purposes of mischief. Again it hasn't happened yet, but lets keep it that way. I am just trying to anticipate problems here.
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  12. #71
    Pre-tty, pre-tty good!! MWM's Avatar
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    Re: Non-Baseball Forum Political and Religious Thread Changes

    Hey, I thought I'd just add my perception of the political discussions overall without trying to single anyone out and showing support to the mods for their decision. Obviously a bad idea. Sorry if it offended you, but I was just giving an honest viewpoint of how I saw it. I wish I would have followed my first instinct and just kept my mouth shut. And your response is a perfect example of why some people prefer not to "add to the debate", the second they do they become the target of ridicule in a haughty and imperous manner from either the right or left. It's just not worth it. You mentioned RFS62, and I agree with your sentiments on him. But why do you think he rarely, if ever, posts on a political thread? I have very strong opinions on politics and take them very seriously. I stay well read on current issues and feel like I'm well-informed on my opinions. Heck, I fall on your side of most issues. But if "adding to the debate" means I have to deal with some of the foolishness and belittling I saw over there, then I'm happy to stay away. And I was happy donig so and would have been happy to continue to do so. I wouldn't have cared if the mods would have let them continue as they didn't affect me. But as a long-time member of the board, I thought I'd support the mods and let them know I understood where they came from and supported the decision. My bad for not adding anything.
    Last edited by MWM; 09-03-2005 at 12:52 PM.
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  13. #72
    Member Reds4Life's Avatar
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    Re: Non-Baseball Forum Political and Religious Thread Changes

    Quote Originally Posted by MWM
    Hey, I thought I'd just add my perception of the political discussions overall without trying to single anyone out and showing support to the mods for their decision. Obviously a bad idea. Sorry if it offended you, but I was just giving an honest viewpoint of how I saw it. I wish I would have followed my first instinct and just kept my mouth shut. And your response is a perfect example of why some people prefer not to "add to the debate", the second they do they become the target of ridicule in a haughty and imperous manner from either the right or left. It's just not worth it. I have very strong opinions on politics and take them very seriously. I stay well read on current issues and feel like I'm well-informed on my opinions. Heck, I fall on your side of most issues. But if "adding to the debate" means I have to deal with some of the foolishness and belittling I saw over there, then I'm happy to stay away. And I was happy donig so and would have been happy to continue to do so. I wouldn't have cared if the mods would have let them continue as they didn't affect me. But as a long-time member of the board, I thought I'd support the mods and let them know I understood where they came from and supported the decision. My bad for not adding anything.
    FWIW I thought your post was excellent. I can assure you that you aren't alone. I've been getting a lot of PM's over the last few days and members feel the exact same way you do but are afraid they will be attacked if they post.
    Pessimists are well informed optimists

  14. #73
    Please come again pedro's Avatar
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    Re: Non-Baseball Forum Political and Religious Thread Changes

    Could you guys add a link to new forum on Ochre's site? Like you did with the Last Thread? (http://lastperson.suncircle.org/index.php?board=6.0)

    Thanks!

    I'd just like to add that I'm in favor of this change if for no other reason that I don't think the Mods here should have to wade through these discussions in order to be assured that the content of the posts is up to the standards set out in the RZ mission statement. It's just too much work.
    Get your nunchucks and the keys to your dad's car. I know where we can get a gun

  15. #74
    CELEBRATION TIME RBA's Avatar
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    Re: Non-Baseball Forum Political and Religious Thread Changes

    People in glass houses shouldn't throw stones.
    Last edited by RBA; 09-03-2005 at 01:29 PM.

  16. #75
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    Re: If you want to talk politics or religion

    I fear a liberal echo chamber. To be blunt, the ones applauding the decision to shut down political threads are on the right side of the aisle. I don't blame them. I won't forever excuse the inexcusable.
    The widow is gathering nettles for her children's dinner; a perfumed seigneur, delicately lounging in the Oeil de Boeuf, hath an alchemy whereby he will extract the third nettle and call it rent. ~ Carlyle


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