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Thread: Bengals v. Vikings

  1. #16
    GR8NESS WMR's Avatar
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    Re: Bengals v. Vikings

    Quote Originally Posted by Sea Ray
    I agree and that's evidence that they're not there yet but isn't nice that they're now so talented that they don't have to play a perfect game to win?

    Remember the saying "We're not good enough to win if we're making mistakes because our margin for error is so small"?

    Well they're past that point now
    Yep. Important thing is to get that stuff squared away ASAP.

    Bengals ended the day having committed 17 penalties, a new franchise record.

    How amazing, with so many inept performances in Bengal history, such a resounding victory is the one where they set their all-time penalty record!

    The good thing about that is that it will ensure that these guys won't get complacent b/f Chicago next week. Marvin has got PLENTY to work on with these guys, and you can bet he'll be harping at them all to clean it up.

    But yeah, to be able to basically shrug off such a huge amount of penalties and kick the Vikings butt so soundly is a credit to what Marvin has done with this team.

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  3. #17
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    Re: Bengals v. Vikings

    Quote Originally Posted by Chip R
    Moss would have tanked it by halftime.
    If they were done like they were then you very well may be right.

    HOWEVER: If Randy Moss was still with the Vikings, I think you're looking at a close ballgame.

    When Randy Moss is on the field, you are playing with some serious fire if you try and pull up a safety for some extra run protection. You fail to double-team Randy Moss on every possession at your own peril.

    Which opens up the running game... Which forces them to overload for the run... Which opens up the passing game... LOL, you get the idea.

    Which makes things much simpler and easier for Daunte Culpepper. It's like he's had his security blankey rudely snatched away and he simply does not know how to react or play the game w/o Randy Moss.

  4. #18
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    Re: Bengals v. Vikings

    Quote Originally Posted by WilyMoROCKS
    LOL, yeah, Vikings don't miss Randy Moss. Sure.
    It doesn't matter if you have Randy Moss if you don't have any time to throw the football. The offensive line is a mess and Culpepper is under fire almost every play. He's put all the pressure on himself and trying to force things. The biggest loss this offseason was not Moss, but offensive coordinator Scott Linehan. He was Culpepper's guru and one of the top O.C.'s in the NFL. Too bad that the ownership changeover occured when it did and Linehan was able to be snatched up.

    The Bengals played a good game and the Vikings tanked. I'm a Viking fan so I speak from experience here: don't get too high on your team just yet. They're good, but fast starts can just as quickly turn into slides. Things are never as bad as they seem, and usually never as good.

    If I'm Culpepper I'm begging to be traded to a team with some talent.
    The sad part is that this is probably as talented a team as Culpepper has been on. Look up and down that roster and you see lots of talented, Pro-Bowl caliber players. For whatever reason they seem to be playing tight, like they're trying not to lose instead of trying to win.
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  5. #19
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    Re: Bengals v. Vikings

    Quote Originally Posted by WilyMoROCKS
    If they were done like they were then you very well may be right.

    HOWEVER: If Randy Moss was still with the Vikings, I think you're looking at a close ballgame.

    When Randy Moss is on the field, you are playing with some serious fire if you try and pull up a safety for some extra run protection. You fail to double-team Randy Moss on every possession at your own peril.

    Which opens up the running game... Which forces them to overload for the run... Which opens up the passing game... LOL, you get the idea.

    Which makes things much simpler and easier for Daunte Culpepper. It's like he's had his security blankey rudely snatched away and he simply does not know how to react or play the game w/o Randy Moss.
    Perhaps. But I remember a playoff game a few years ago when the Giants jumped out to a huge lead and Moss went into the tank for the rest of the game. And that could happen again whether Moss is playing or not. With turnovers amd such any team can fall behind very quickly. I don't deny Moss is a weapon and changes the way defenses scheme his team. All I'm saying is that Moss has a tendency to stop playing when his team is hopelessly behind. People will remember that and for that reason will always bring that up when comparing him to guys like Jerry Rice.
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  6. #20
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    Re: Bengals v. Vikings

    Quote Originally Posted by Sabo Fan
    It doesn't matter if you have Randy Moss if you don't have any time to throw the football.
    Yeah, but how much more difficult is it to send a blitz when you can't pull a safety or a corner? You can't. Not effectively or consistently.

    The Vikings miss Randy Moss.

    If they still had Moss, losing the Offensive Coordinator would not be that big of a deal.

    Without Moss, losing him is disastrous.

    There is not a single player in the NFL who changes the way a team gameplan's for his team than Randy Moss. To proclaim that Moss isn't an integral part of the equation as to why the Vikings are struggling mightily is pure hogwash.

  7. #21
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    Re: Bengals v. Vikings

    If you trade the best player in the NFL for a mediocore linebacker, you can expect to experience some serious consequences.

    Everybody benefitted from having Randy. The RBs, the linemen, definitely the QB, and certainly the other receivers. Without him there, you can downgrade each of their levels of effectiveness by at least a letter grade. Tack on losing your Center, and another starting lineman, and you are in for some serious trouble.

  8. #22
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    Re: Bengals v. Vikings

    Quote Originally Posted by Chip R
    Perhaps. But I remember a playoff game a few years ago when the Giants jumped out to a huge lead and Moss went into the tank for the rest of the game. And that could happen again whether Moss is playing or not. With turnovers amd such any team can fall behind very quickly. I don't deny Moss is a weapon and changes the way defenses scheme his team. All I'm saying is that Moss has a tendency to stop playing when his team is hopelessly behind. People will remember that and for that reason will always bring that up when comparing him to guys like Jerry Rice.
    Yep. Too bad you couldn't combine the physical attributes of Randy Moss with the work ethic and attitude of Jerry Rice. What a monster that would be.

  9. #23
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    Re: Bengals v. Vikings

    Quote Originally Posted by WilyMoROCKS
    Yeah, but how much more difficult is it to send a blitz when you can't pull a safety or a corner? You can't. Not effectively or consistently.

    The Vikings miss Randy Moss.

    If they still had Moss, losing the Offensive Coordinator would not be that big of a deal.

    Without Moss, losing him is disastrous.

    There is not a single player in the NFL who changes the way a team gameplan's for his team than Randy Moss. To proclaim that Moss isn't an integral part of the equation as to why the Vikings are struggling mightily is pure hogwash.
    If you watched the game today, you would see that it didn't matter how many guys the Bengals sent, they were still getting pressure on Culpepper. Same thing with the Bucs last week. Tampa Bay brought four or five guys most of the time and were in Daunte's face all day. Similar thing today. It only took four or five guys to create pressure. Moss's departure is a big factor, no doubt. However, the bigger factor is the loss of Matt Birk and starting a rookie guard.

    Go back to last year and look at the five games Moss either missed or was not a factor in. You project those numbers from those games over a sixteen game season for Culpepper and you get 30-some TD's and 10 interceptions. Not too shabby. The difference between not having Moss then and not having him now is the offensive line and the offensive coordinator, plain and simple.
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    Re: Bengals v. Vikings

    Congratulations, Bengals. You really came out strong. Your franchise is really on the upswing.
    Sabo Fan, your observations are quite accurate. I'm a Vikes fan and the O-line is not playing well. Birk's out for the year, their LT McKinnie is out for a game or two, and RG Dixon is retired. Moreover, the offensive coordinator (Steve Loney) doubles as the OLine coach. Guess what - it's obviously too much for him.
    It is very clear that Daunte misses his QB/Ocoordinator Linehan. He lobbied hard for the Vikes to Linehan to stay. Harder than he did for the Vikes not to trade Randy.

  11. #25
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    Re: Bengals v. Vikings

    Like Daunte would admit how badly he needed Randy... Actually, I doubt he admitted in part because in his own mind he thought that he could indeed be just as successful without Randy. I don't care if Rich Brooks is calling the plays, you put a quarterback with a strong arm on the field with Randy Moss and Randy Moss is going to make that quarterback look good. As long as he can throw it far. LOL, I watched the game. I relished every second of it. Daunte made a plethora of mistakes today when he WASN'T under pressure. Just out and out bad throws.

    You can talk about the O-Line, make excuses about the Offensive Coordinator, but don't try and make those excuses and then come with the garbage that Randy isn't just as big a factor--BIGGER--than those other 2. Just because you don't like Randy Moss don't try to minimize what his presence and productivity meant to the Vikings in season's past and what his absence means now.

    Daunte Culpepper was suffering from the same delusions... "Randy doesn't matter" "I can still be just as good a QB w/o Randy" blah blah blah

    Maybe he's beginning to come back to reality.
    Last edited by WMR; 09-18-2005 at 11:35 PM.

  12. #26
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    Re: Bengals v. Vikings

    At least Daunte knew where his bread was buttered, watching Kerry Collins play quarterback is painful. He hasn't gone to Moss nearly enough this game. Daunte knew who to throw to, somebody needs to send Collins/Norv Turner the memo.

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    Re: Bengals v. Vikings

    Quote Originally Posted by WilyMoROCKS
    Like Daunte would admit how badly he needed Randy... Actually, I doubt he admitted in part because in his own mind he thought that he could indeed be just as successful without Randy. I don't care if Rich Brooks is calling the plays, you put a quarterback with a strong arm on the field with Randy Moss and Randy Moss is going to make that quarterback look good. As long as he can throw it far. LOL, I watched the game. I relished every second of it. Daunte made a plethora of mistakes today when he WASN'T under pressure. Just out and out bad throws.

    You can talk about the O-Line, make excuses about the Offensive Coordinator, but don't try and make those excuses and then come with the garbage that Randy isn't just as big a factor--BIGGER--than those other 2. Just because you don't like Randy Moss don't try to minimize what his presence and productivity meant to the Vikings in season's past and what his absence means now.

    Daunte Culpepper was suffering from the same delusions... "Randy doesn't matter" "I can still be just as good a QB w/o Randy" blah blah blah

    Maybe he's beginning to come back to reality.
    First of all, I'm not a Randy Moss-hater. He was my favorite player and it will probably be a long time before the Vikings can find a receiver close to his ability. Out of that respect for what he contributed to the Vikes, I don't consider him "replaceable" by any receiver in the NFL.
    Second of all, I'm not making any excuses. Daunte's talent is undeniable (except of course, to critics like you) but he is obviously not playing up to that talent. Do you doubt that the Bengals would trade Carson Palmer for Daunte in a minute if it was offered?
    Therefore, I really don't appreciate your agressively rude and analytically wayword tone.
    If you're a Bengals fan, then you should be enjoying your team's decisive win. If you're a Randy Moss fan and you want to see the Vikes do poorly, you should be enjoying yourself also.

  14. #28
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    Re: Bengals v. Vikings

    Quote Originally Posted by Betterread
    First of all, I'm not a Randy Moss-hater. He was my favorite player and it will probably be a long time before the Vikings can find a receiver close to his ability. Out of that respect for what he contributed to the Vikes, I don't consider him "replaceable" by any receiver in the NFL.
    Second of all, I'm not making any excuses. Daunte's talent is undeniable (except of course, to critics like you) but he is obviously not playing up to that talent. Do you doubt that the Bengals would trade Carson Palmer for Daunte in a minute if it was offered?
    Therefore, I really don't appreciate your agressively rude and analytically wayword tone.
    If you're a Bengals fan, then you should be enjoying your team's decisive win. If you're a Randy Moss fan and you want to see the Vikes do poorly, you should be enjoying yourself also.
    Would the Bengals trade Carson Palmer for Daunte Culpepper? They wouldn't trade Carson for Daunte, EVER. Carson is a more accurate passer, and is further along development-wise 3 years in than Daunte is at this point in his career. Not sure how many years he's been in the league.

    And my comment was not directed towards you. It was directed towards the poster who said "if i watched the game" I would have seen so and so. If that's not "analytically wayward," please tell me what is.

  15. #29
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    Re: Bengals v. Vikings

    It doesn't matter if you have Randy Moss if you don't have any time to throw the football. The offensive line is a mess and Culpepper is under fire almost every play. He's put all the pressure on himself and trying to force things. The biggest loss this offseason was not Moss, but offensive coordinator Scott Linehan. He was Culpepper's guru and one of the top O.C.'s in the NFL. Too bad that the ownership changeover occured when it did and Linehan was able to be snatched up.
    Where did Linehan end up?

    The Bengals played a good game and the Vikings tanked. I'm a Viking fan so I speak from experience here: don't get too high on your team just yet. They're good, but fast starts can just as quickly turn into slides. Things are never as bad as they seem, and usually never as good.
    Don't worry. We're Bengal fans. We're trying to finish over .500. We know it's a long season and anything can happen. We also know that as well as we've started Pittsburgh has started off better. We're taking this one game at a time. All we know is it's a lot more fun to start off 2-0 than 1-4 which has been the norm. We also wish we had to compete against the likes of Detroit and Green Bay like your Vikes in order to win a division title

  16. #30
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    Re: Bengals v. Vikings

    Carson Palmer might already be better all around than Dante, but if he isn't he will be. No way would I trade Carson palmer for Dante Culpepper. He's too inconsistent, and yes, I think Moss bailed him out plenty of times the last few years.
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