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Thread: Kentucky High School athletic proposal

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  1. #1
    Resident optimist OldRightHander's Avatar
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    Kentucky High School athletic proposal

    They were talking this morning on 1360 about a proposal that is being voted on in Kentucky that would separate the private schools from the public ones for post season tournaments and that there would be a state champion for each. Of course the angry guys were quite angry about this, and I can see why. Personally, I think this is wrong. For one, if I was back in high school and playing sports and I had the good fortune to win a state championship, I would want the satisfaction that my team was indeed the best team in the state. Also, it makes me wonder what is considered the primary purpose of high school to start with. They were saying that some of the public schools were complaining about not being able to compete with the private schools that are able to recruit. It seems rather lame to me. I hope this doesn't go through in Kentucky, because it could be an idea that would catch on in other states if it does. I can see some parents saying things like, "If it makes it easier for my little Johnny to win a state championship, then it's a good idea." I just don't think this is a good idea.

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    Just The Big Picture macro's Avatar
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    Re: Kentucky High School athletic proposal

    The problem is that public schools have set boundries from which they may draw their students, while private schools can recruit students from anywhere in the United States. Private schools can use offers of financial aid to attract athletes from public schools. Public schools must comply with Title IX rules requiring comparable treatment of boys' and girls' sports; single-gender private schools are not subject to such rules. Single-sex private schools such as Louisville's Trinity and St. Xavier, with about 1,400 boys each, have numbers no public school can match. What's fair about that?

    Private schools won 17 of 31 KHSAA championships last school year despite comprising only about 17 percent of the schools. I don't know if splitting the championships is the best solution, but something should be done to level the playing field.
    Last edited by macro; 10-20-2005 at 11:21 AM.

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    For a Level Playing Field RedFanAlways1966's Avatar
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    Re: Kentucky High School athletic proposal

    Quote Originally Posted by macro
    I don't know if splitting the championships is the best solution, but something should be done to level the playing field.
    I agree completely! There is nothing fair about schools who get students based on one certain geographical boundary vs. schools who can "recruit" from about 10 of those geographical boundaries combined.
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    C-A-T-S CATS! CATS! CATS! WVRed's Avatar
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    Re: Kentucky High School athletic proposal

    Quote Originally Posted by macro
    The problem is that public schools have set boundries from which they may draw their students, while private schools can recruit students from anywhere in the United States. Private schools can use offers of financial aid to attract athletes from public schools. Public schools must comply with Title IX rules requiring comparable treatment of boys' and girls' sports; single-gender private schools are not subject to such rules. Single-sex private schools such as Louisville's Trinity and St. Xavier, with about 1,400 boys each, have numbers no public school can match. What's fair about that?

    Private schools won 17 of 31 KHSAA championships last school year despite comprising only about 17 percent of the schools. I don't know if splitting the championships is the best solution, but something should be done to level the playing field.
    Very well said.

    I am not a fan of this proposal either. If anything, the KHSAA needs to crack down on private schools and kick out those who don't comply. I just think they fear an Oak Hill Academy emerging from the state.

    Its not just football either. Kentucky is a basketball crazy state, and people threw a fit when Lexington Catholic won state a couple years ago. I also saw it first hand when a small Christian school I attended in Ashland KY ended up with a 6'4 7th grader by the name of OJ Mayo.

    Something needs to be done, but putting public and private schools in their own field accomplishes nothing. If anything, it tells me that the KHSAA feels threatened to do anything, so they are just sweeping it under the rug.
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    Re: Kentucky High School athletic proposal

    I'm not sure if its the case in Kentucky, but here in Indiana the Catholic schools dominate all the smaller classes. They have all the advantages of being able to recruit, but don't have to play against the big schools.
    As much as people gripe about Catholic schools here. The top teams; Warren Central, Ben Davis, Penn, and Bloomington South(or at least they were a top team a few years ago) are all still public.

    In Ohio, I think a public school actually has an advantage if it can keep its own kids. EG Colerain kept its own kids while Moeller, St. X, Elder, and Lasalle dilluted all the other top players.
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    SERP Emeritus paintmered's Avatar
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    Re: Kentucky High School athletic proposal

    Quote Originally Posted by Hoosier Red
    I'm not sure if its the case in Kentucky, but here in Indiana the Catholic schools dominate all the smaller classes. They have all the advantages of being able to recruit, but don't have to play against the big schools.
    As much as people gripe about Catholic schools here. The top teams; Warren Central, Ben Davis, Penn, and Bloomington South(or at least they were a top team a few years ago) are all still public.

    In Ohio, I think a public school actually has an advantage if it can keep its own kids. EG Colerain kept its own kids while Moeller, St. X, Elder, and Lasalle dilluted all the other top players.
    It's more prominent in the smaller schools in ohio - particularly in basketball where one elite player can carry a team to state.
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    Re: Kentucky High School athletic proposal

    Quote Originally Posted by Hoosier Red
    In Ohio, I think a public school actually has an advantage if it can keep its own kids. EG Colerain kept its own kids while Moeller, St. X, Elder, and Lasalle dilluted all the other top players.
    My understanding (which may well be mistaken/out of date) is that the Archdiocese of Cincinnati cracked down on recruiting and implemented some sort of districting system for the secondary schools they oversee. Of the schools you mentioned, St. Xavier (Jesuit) is the only school not subject to these guidelines.

    My cousin, for example, lived in McNick's district. Had he wanted to go to Moeller, like any right-thinking person, I believe he would have had to sit out athletics his freshman year. He went to St. X, and was promptly disowned. (I'm kidding, sorta.)

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    Re: Kentucky High School athletic proposal

    I found a nifty way to sit out my freshman year in Tennis.

    I didn't make the team.
    When people say that I donít know what Iím talking about when it comes to sports or writing, I think: Man, you should see me in the rest of my life.
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    Rally Onion! Chip R's Avatar
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    Re: Kentucky High School athletic proposal

    Isn't this done in Illinois?
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    15 game winner Danny Serafini's Avatar
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    Re: Kentucky High School athletic proposal

    I've always thought it was a joke that public and private schools competed in the same leagues when the private schools have such an obvious advantage. Why not level the playing field?

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    Resident optimist OldRightHander's Avatar
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    Re: Kentucky High School athletic proposal

    So does everybody think that the public schools never do any "recruiting"? Are top notch athletic prospects never encouraged to move to a certain neighborhood so they will be eligible to attend that school? Are there never cases where a kid lives with an uncle or grandparent or some other relative in that district just to meet the residency requirement to attend that school? I don't think that it's only the private schools that recruit. I'm not saying that the private schools are as pure as the driven snow either, but to say that the public schools are never guilty strikes me as rather naive.

  12. #12
    The Lineups stink. KronoRed's Avatar
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    Re: Kentucky High School athletic proposal

    Sure that goes on, but not near to the extent the private schools do.
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    Re: Kentucky High School athletic proposal

    Quote Originally Posted by KronoRed
    Sure that goes on, but not near to the extent the private schools do.
    Don't know if I would say that, but private schools get away with it more.
    Quote Originally Posted by savafan View Post
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    Hisssssssss Yachtzee's Avatar
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    Re: Kentucky High School athletic proposal

    Quote Originally Posted by KronoRed
    Sure that goes on, but not near to the extent the private schools do.
    I don't know about that. Up here in Northeast Ohio, there are constant allegations of public schools poaching students from each other. Massillon, Jackson, and Canton McKinley are always being hit with claims of illegal recruiting, especially when some top athlete's parent mysteriously gets a job in one of those districts or they decide to live with their "aunt." Even when there is no actual "recruiting" going on, families who have kids with talent will move to a district with a good team. They want the exposure that goes with playing on a potential state champ because they hope that exposure will lead to college scholarships. I'm sure it goes on down in Cincinnati and Kentucky too. How many kids on the Colerain team grew up there and how many moved there right before high school?

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    Re: Kentucky High School athletic proposal

    FWIW, Texas has a separate athletic association for the public schools (UIL), one for the prep schools (SPC, which includes Oklahoma) and another one for the private and parochial schools (TAPPS). The media here barely acknowledge the existence of athletic programs outside the public schools, aside from reporting the scores.

    When I lived in Wisconsin, there were parallel athletic associations for the private (WISAA) and public schools (WIAA), until the private school association folded. There was much gnashing of teeth at inclusion of private schools in the sacred WIAA playoffs, particularly when some former WISAA schools won in the first year after the merger.

    I'm opposed to separation, but I will admit being biased. As a Catholic school graduate, coming from a school that won quite a few OHSAA state championships in the last 30 years, I know that if Ohio had separate associations or categories of state championships, the honor would have been diluted significantly.


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