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Thread: The Xavier way....should UC take note?

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    Making sense of it all Matt700wlw's Avatar
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    The Xavier way....should UC take note?


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    Member CrackerJack's Avatar
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    Re: The Xavier way....should UC take note?

    I lost a lot of respect for Huggins over the years, his act got real old. I don't think UC is of the mindset now to look for a savior coach, although many of the local fans probably think they need one. Fact is - they do, at least right now. Huggins and Zimpher and Goins left that program in shambles - it is a mess.

    They could sure take some advice from XU though - as they've been to one more final four than UC has in the last 10+ years.

    Ranking and seeds don't mean squat if you can't live up to them, or come close to resembling them post season.

    UC's in serious danger of becoming a bottom feeder in the Big East, they have to know this, and it's why they don't want a Huggins' minion on the sidelines - and probably why they haven't offered Kennedy the job at this point. Why hire him when you could've just kept Huggins?

    They definitely need a high profile coach to clean this mess up and get the roster and program back on track.

    Personally the head coach of Murray State would be my first choice.

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    Re: The Xavier way....should UC take note?

    Quote Originally Posted by CrackerJack
    They could sure take some advice from XU though - as they've been to one more final four than UC has in the last 10+ years.
    Xavier has never been to the final four in school history.

    Quote Originally Posted by CrackerJack
    Personally the head coach of Murray State would be my first choice.
    Mick Cronin in a "Huggins minion" as you put it. He was the recruiting coordinator and assistant head coach to Bob Huggins from 1997-2001.
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    Member CrackerJack's Avatar
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    Re: The Xavier way....should UC take note?

    Sorry - "Final 8" is what I meant regarding XU. The last Final 8 for UC was in 1995-6 I believe?

    Cronin - has UC/Huggins ties - but in no way coaches, recruits or manages his team like Huggins does/did. He learned from two of the best - Pitino and Huggins. Cronin is a great recruiter and is proving to also be a very good, upcoming bball coach.

    It's "my" opinion that he'd be a good fit - I certainly dont expect UC to share that opinion due to the Huggins' situation. I also think Cronin would be a better recruiter and coach than Kennedy - Kennedy's approach to the game is quite similar to Huggins - it's all he knows really - Cronin is his own man.

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    Re: The Xavier way....should UC take note?

    Quote Originally Posted by CrackerJack
    Sorry - "Final 8" is what I meant regarding XU. The last Final 8 for UC was in 1995-6 I believe?

    Cronin - has UC/Huggins ties - but in no way coaches, recruits or manages his team like Huggins does/did. He learned from two of the best - Pitino and Huggins. Cronin is a great recruiter and is proving to also be a very good, upcoming bball coach.

    It's "my" opinion that he'd be a good fit - I certainly dont expect UC to share that opinion due to the Huggins' situation. I also think Cronin would be a better recruiter and coach than Kennedy - Kennedy's approach to the game is quite similar to Huggins - it's all he knows really - Cronin is his own man.
    Cronin's players at Murrary St. have had a few encounters with law enforcement. Nancy Zimpher is going to let her hatred for Bob Huggins influence this hire, nobody associated with him in any fashion will have a shot at this job. If she screws up this hire and UC becomes a basketball wasteland her days are President are numbered.

    Edit: I think Kennedy is a great game coach, but I'm not sure about his recruiting ability. Due to Zimpher we are pretty much screwed for the next 2 years when it comes to recruits. She already goes to UC games with armed bodyguards, she hasn't seen ugly yet. Next year when UC wins maybe 10 games it isn't going to be pretty for her in this city.
    Last edited by Reds4Life; 01-18-2006 at 04:54 PM.
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    Re: The Xavier way....should UC take note?

    Quote Originally Posted by CrackerJack
    They definitely need a high profile coach to clean this mess up and get the roster and program back on track.
    The program was enjoying amazing amounts of success -- UC was seemingly a shoe-in for the NCAA Tournament every year, enjoyed amazing amounts of national TV coverage, and consistently recruited top talent. For a very long time, it was the only thing that kept Cincinnati from being a total laughingstock in the sports world.

    Granted, not everything was perfect -- but things seldom are in any situation. Huggins took a lot of chances on young men; sometimes it worked out, sometimes it didn't.

    The program was ON track, and it was derailed deliberately. No high profile coach is going to want to step into this mess, because the ever-present fear now is that the rug will be yanked at any time, regardless of level of performance on the court.
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    Re: The Xavier way....should UC take note?

    Quote Originally Posted by CrackerJack
    Kennedy's approach to the game is quite similar to Huggins - it's all he knows really - Cronin is his own man.
    Hmm, you don't watch much UC basketball do you. Kennedy actually has a very different approach to the game than Huggins did. Kennedy's team is running a lot more of a set offense and scoring more points than Huggins teams did. They also let up more points and don't rebound as well. Two different styles really.

    Kennedy has played on every level there is to play on. He's seen a ton of different coaches in his day. I think he knows a bit more than what he saw from Huggins the past few years.

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    Re: The Xavier way....should UC take note?

    Quote Originally Posted by Redlegs23
    Hmm, you don't watch much UC basketball do you. Kennedy actually has a very different approach to the game than Huggins did. Kennedy's team is running a lot more of a set offense and scoring more points than Huggins teams did. They also let up more points and don't rebound as well. Two different styles really.

    Kennedy has played on every level there is to play on. He's seen a ton of different coaches in his day. I think he knows a bit more than what he saw from Huggins the past few years.
    Kennedy coached at UAB and South Alabama - his coaching experience the last 4 seasons has been solely influenced by Huggins'. His playing days don't mean anything to me as a coach - Huggins' just didn't play pro ball for a brief period of time like Kennedy did.

    UC gives up more points because they are under-sized and play in the Big East - this is obvious. That is also the same reason they don't rebound as much - they are under-sized and under-manned, playing 3 small guards quite a bit at times.

    Huggins was also fond of bringing in a banger from the football team when necessary.

    Kennedy's team traps and employs a full court press, more often before Armein went down. And are you trying to tell me Huggins' never had a set offense? Cmon.

    Kennedy has his players playing relaxed and confident - due to his less volatile style - they are more precise, relaxed, smooth and disciplined on the court - I think a lot of that is that they don't have a guy storming up and down the court more interested in screaming at the refs than paying attention to the nuances of what's going on with his team. (among other things)

    The end game shot last night was a perfect example of Huggins' influence - give the ball to the best scorer and let him take the ball all the way up the court and shoot it- no passes - no screens - no set or planned plays - very Hugginsesque.

    The last time I saw an end-game set play was in the Alaska Shootout versus Duke with Huggs.

    I have watched UC basketball since the late 80's.

  10. #9
    Making sense of it all Matt700wlw's Avatar
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    Re: The Xavier way....should UC take note?

    UC's way worked fine for 16 years.....it can work fine again if Nancy makes the right decision

    ....I'm asking a lot though

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    Re: The Xavier way....should UC take note?

    Kennedy coached at UAB and South Alabama - his coaching experience the last 4 seasons has been solely influenced by Huggins'. His playing days don't mean anything to me as a coach - Huggins' just didn't play pro ball for a brief period of time like Kennedy did.

    I think most coaches are largely influenced by the coaches from their playing days. You don't have to be a coach to learn from another coach, players are always learning too. I think that's why a lot of players have instant success in coaching when their playing days are over.

    UC gives up more points because they are under-sized and play in the Big East - this is obvious. That is also the same reason they don't rebound as much - they are under-sized and under-manned, playing 3 small guards quite a bit at times.

    Yes, it's "obvious" that UC is undersized, but weren't they undersized last year as well? Didn't seem to affect that team when they were among the nation leaders in field goal percentage allowed. And the Big East argument holds no water. We've played 4 Big East games, how about the other 14 games? We've been without Kirkland for 2.5 games. This is the only time we've been forced to play 3 small guards at once. Very rarely would you see 3 small guards on the floor at the same time before Kirk went down.

    Huggins was also fond of bringing in a banger from the football team when necessary.

    Kennedy didn't have much of an option here. I don't think this was necessarily Huggins influenced.

    And are you trying to tell me Huggins' never had a set offense? Cmon.

    No. I'm trying to tell you exactly what I said. Kennedy's team is running a lot more set offenses than Huggins teams did. Kennedy is simply more of an offensive minded coach.

    Kennedy has his players playing relaxed and confident - due to his less volatile style - they are more precise, relaxed, smooth and disciplined on the court - I think a lot of that is that they don't have a guy storming up and down the court more interested in screaming at the refs than paying attention to the nuances of what's going on with his team. (among other things)

    I agree with the relaxed & smooth observations. I would argue the disciplined one since defense and rebounding are all about discipline.

    I'm not trying to quibble here but I think it's fairly obvious that Kennedy and Huggins have different styles. Yes, there are some similarities, but Huggins was always known for having teams that played tough defense and rebounded well. With Kennedy you have to sacrifice some defense for some offense.

    This years team has already scored 100+ twice in half the season. Last year's team didn't manage to do that once all last season. To me that's evidence of more offense.


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