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Thread: Choosing an offensive philosophy

  1. #1
    Hey Cubs Fans RFS62's Avatar
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    Choosing an offensive philosophy

    Great coaches in every sport coach to their personnel.

    If you don't have a fast guy to run the baseline, you can't play the 1-3-1 in basketball.

    If you don't have a quick release accurate short passer as quarterback, you can't succeed in the West Coast offense in football.

    If you have a bunch of free swingers who can't bunt and put the bat on the ball at will, playing small bal won't work in baseball.

    You assess your personnel, and chose your strategy and tactics accordingly if you want to maximize your offense.

    Some coaches or managers don't get it. Bob Boone tried to manage like Gene Mauch with guys who couldn't get a bunt down or hit to the right side when he wanted them to.

    The Reds are not designed for smallball. Hell, they're not designed for anything. They are what they are by random chance. And that random chance produced an incredible number of runs last year as thumpers, not contact hitting smallballers.

    We need to see things as they are, not as we might want them to be. Assess the personnel. Why on earth would we fix something that's not broken.

    Personally, I like 70's and 80's baseball better. I like the "traditional" game much more than the swing from the heels so called "modern" game. I hope against hope that that style re-emerges, when speed becomes the undervalued commodity that Moneyballers move to after everybody and his uncle is overpaying for OBP and that well dries up.

    But we're closer to being contenders if we see things as they are, right now. Right now, our offense is devestating.

    Right now, our pitching and defense blows on a historic scale.

    Coach to our strengths and fix our weakness. Fix the pitching. Leave the offense alone.
    "Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover."
    ~ Mark Twain

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  3. #2
    Member Ron Madden's Avatar
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    Re: Choosing an offensive philosophy

    I doubt that the need of good OBP will ever go out of syle.

    OBP is very imprtant. The more you reach base the fewer outs you make and the more runs you'll score.

    OBP will always have value.

  4. #3
    Hey Cubs Fans RFS62's Avatar
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    Re: Choosing an offensive philosophy

    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Madden
    I doubt that the need of good OBP will ever go out of syle.

    OBP is very imprtant. The more you reach base the fewer outs you make and the more runs you'll score.

    OBP will always have value.

    It won't go out of style, I agree. But the essence of Moneyball is finding undervalued commodities. It could well become overpriced due to supply and demand now with every major league owner telling his GM "hey, I want me some of that thar' Moneyball".
    "Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover."
    ~ Mark Twain

  5. #4
    got alil captain in u?
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    Re: Choosing an offensive philosophy

    my choice is whichever one that wins us more games than last year

  6. #5
    breath westofyou's Avatar
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    Re: Choosing an offensive philosophy

    Aside from pitching this team lacks is up the middle defense and at least 1 BA driven starter.

    If they had the above they could probably sacrifice some offense that they might lose.

    Currently its a conundrum... without the players we have playing now we won't score 800 runs, with them we might give up 60-100 extra.

  7. #6
    RaisorZone Raisor's Avatar
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    Re: Choosing an offensive philosophy

    I like to post this occassionally, and this thread seems a good place for it:



    Announcer: [A fan] from Frederick, Maryland, wants to know why you don't go out and get some more team speed.

    Earl Bleepin Weaver: Team speed, for (goodness sakes) , you get BLEEP (gosh darn) little fleas on the bases getting picked off trying to steal, getting thrown out, taking runs away from you. You get them big BLEEP who can hit the BLEEP ball out of the BLEEP ballpark and you can't make any (gosh darn) mistakes.
    "But I do know Joey's sister indirectly (or foster sister) and I have heard stories of Joey being into shopping, designer wear, fancy coffees, and pedicures."

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    breath westofyou's Avatar
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    Re: Choosing an offensive philosophy

    Paul Blair was fast, Al Bumbry was fast.

    Team speed at certain positions isn't a bad thing.

    Earl also wrote in his book on the outfield.

    "Defensively the key here is speed. An outfielder has a lot of territory to cover and the faster he is, the easier it will be for him."

  9. #8
    RaisorZone Raisor's Avatar
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    Re: Choosing an offensive philosophy

    Quote Originally Posted by westofyou
    Paul Blair was fast, Al Bumbry was fast.

    Team speed at certain positions isn't a bad thing.

    Earl also wrote in his book on the outfield.


    I was just sayin that Earl was "offensive"

    Sometimes I'm too clever for myself even.

    "But I do know Joey's sister indirectly (or foster sister) and I have heard stories of Joey being into shopping, designer wear, fancy coffees, and pedicures."

  10. #9
    Hey Cubs Fans RFS62's Avatar
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    Re: Choosing an offensive philosophy

    Quote Originally Posted by Raisor
    Sometimes I'm too clever for myself even.


    It's a burden.
    "Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover."
    ~ Mark Twain

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    Worst Behavior. reds44's Avatar
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    Re: Choosing an offensive philosophy

    Quote Originally Posted by westofyou
    Aside from pitching this team lacks is up the middle defense and at least 1 BA driven starter.

    If they had the above they could probably sacrifice some offense that they might lose.

    Currently its a conundrum... without the players we have playing now we won't score 800 runs, with them we might give up 60-100 extra.
    Wouldn't Bergolla solve some of that problem?

  12. #11
    breath westofyou's Avatar
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    Re: Choosing an offensive philosophy

    Quote Originally Posted by reds44
    Wouldn't Bergolla solve some of that problem?
    Yes, but IMO even better would be a picker at SS an Lopez moving to 2nd base, that frees Freel up for CF and then Griffey could slide to the corner (cause that's the one of the dudes I trade for the SS) But that's a big dream.

  13. #12
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    Re: Choosing an offensive philosophy

    I always try to think what Whitey would do to fix the situation and i think WOY is right....CF defense would be corrected, FELO would be moved ...etc..WOY said it all.

    What would Earl Weaver do? Put EE at short? and move folks over one slot?

    Dodgers of the 50 and 60's would probably put Freel at the D- position (2nd base?) and then make it a C+ ala...Jr. Gilliam.


    None of these are good moves --they don't fit to make the situation better. Only option is to make a trade.

  14. #13
    Charlie Brown All-Star IslandRed's Avatar
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    Re: Choosing an offensive philosophy

    Fixing the defense will probably result in a change in hitting profile as well. Good glove guys, particularly up the middle, tend not to be Three True Outcomes types.
    Not all who wander are lost

  15. #14
    breath westofyou's Avatar
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    Re: Choosing an offensive philosophy

    Quote Originally Posted by IslandRed
    Fixing the defense will probably result in a change in hitting profile as well. Good glove guys, particularly up the middle, tend not to be Three True Outcomes types.
    Yeah, they tend to be the bat on the ball types that can push the offense up with good years or drag it down with bad ones. But they save runs on the other side of the coin. It's a ying to a yang that the Reds need to get their chakras in line.

  16. #15
    Posting in Dynarama M2's Avatar
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    Re: Choosing an offensive philosophy

    The problem the Reds have is that the club will have to deal some offense to get pitching. It can't buy it and it doesn't have enough in the pipeline to count on that as a delivery system.

    It means the Reds will have less thunder in the near future. The team is also going to have to sacrfice a little muscle to fix that defense. That's not necessarily a bad tradeoff. It just means the team is going to have to find some guys who are still productive without the big, honking biecps. A leadoff guy who can get on base, run a bit and play quality CF would be a sweet pickup. No, that guy won't rake like Jr., but he will catch a lot more balls and score in front of the thunder the Reds do manage to keep.
    Baseball isn't a magic trick ... it doesn't get spoiled if you figure out how it works. - gonelong

    I'm witchcrafting everybody.


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