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Thread: Okay I am making my call right now....

  1. #1
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    Okay I am making my call right now....

    The Reds will win the central...Call me crazy but I like what I am hearing about this team, especially with a new GM and owner in place. The rest of the division is a mess and with the Reds lineup and a greatly improved pitching staff, I am seeing a fun season ahead for Reds fans. Its been a long time folks, we are due.
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    Posting in Dynarama M2's Avatar
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    Re: Okay I am making my call right now....

    Quote Originally Posted by SanDiegoRed
    The Reds will win the central...Call me crazy but I like what I am hearing about this team, especially with a new GM and owner in place. The rest of the division is a mess and with the Reds lineup and a greatly improved pitching staff, I am seeing a fun season ahead for Reds fans. Its been a long time folks, we are due.
    Can the new GM and owner pitch?
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    Tired of talk. Win! Joseph's Avatar
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    Re: Okay I am making my call right now....

    Pitching didn't get worse, but I wouldn't call them greatly improved.

    I would love for your prediction to be right though.

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    Dunnilicious creek14's Avatar
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    Re: Okay I am making my call right now....

    Quote Originally Posted by SanDiegoRed
    Call me crazy
    You are crazy.

    Will trade this space for a #1 starter.

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    Re: Okay I am making my call right now....

    I dig the optimism coming from you, I wish I could share in it. But hey, ya never know, and hope springs eternal on opening day!
    Benzinger backing and calling! And the 1990 world championship series belongs to the Cincinnati Reds!

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    Re: Okay I am making my call right now....

    World Series here we come!!! :notworthy

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    Re: Okay I am making my call right now....


  9. #8
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    Re: Okay I am making my call right now....

    I think what's missing in this inebriation over the new owners and the Dunn signing is that the Reds aren't a damn bit better talent-wise than last year.

    I'm no longer giving the new crew a year to figure it out--they've got an infrastructure of negotiators in the front office/scouting, they've got 29 teams to deal with, they've got talent with which to deal. Get busy.

    Everyone else can give these guys a free pass if the Reds are 20 games out in mid-July with no pitching having been acquired. That's your business. Personally, I hold them responsible for not having a near-ace caliber pitcher on the staff by opening day.
    Last edited by Falls City Beer; 02-19-2006 at 01:01 PM.

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    Re: Okay I am making my call right now....

    Quote Originally Posted by Falls City Beer
    Everyone else can give these guys a free pass if the Reds are 20 games out in mid-July with no pitching having been acquired. That's your business. Personally, I hold them responsible for not having a near-ace caliber pitcher on the staff by opening day.
    Who's trading near-ace caliber pitchers at this time of year?

    I'm all for getting one, but you might as well demand they make it snow in Sarasota too.

    The team has been making good progress. DanO got canned immediately. Krivsky's signed Dunn to a LTC and he's been cutting out the rot from the front office with gusto.

    Things aren't going to change overnight. I don't need to tell you how far away the Reds are from being good. Had Castellini and Krivsky arrived in November, I'd agree with you that the club should have achieved some major turnover. IMO, there's a big difference between a free pass and recognition that the team's going to have to wait for the market to open up before it pounces.
    Baseball isn't a magic trick ... it doesn't get spoiled if you figure out how it works. - gonelong

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  11. #10
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    Re: Okay I am making my call right now....

    Quote Originally Posted by Falls City Beer
    I think what's missing in this inebriation over the new owners and the Dunn signing is that the Reds aren't a damn bit better talent-wise than last year.

    I'm no longer giving the new crew a year to figure it out--they've got an infrastructure of negotiators in the front office/scouting, they've got 29 teams to deal with, they've got talent with which to deal. Get busy.

    Everyone else can give these guys a free pass if the Reds are 20 games out in mid-July with no pitching having been acquired. That's your business. Personally, I hold them responsible for not having a near-ace caliber pitcher on the staff by opening day.
    Get busy with what?

    If there was value to be had for Austin Kearns or Wily Mo Pena, we'd be speaking of them in the past tense by now.

    Part of the dilemma that Krivsky has inherited is that he is running a team with no tangible assets other the aforementioned Adam Dunn. Other players are movable (Freel, Lopez, Pena, Kearns), but the return value would send most of the regulars on this board (myself included) into a giant "YAWN"-fest and send most of the casual fends looking for a torch and pitchfork with "Firesale!" as their rallying cry. It's hard to build a castle when the only supplies around are dung and straw.

    If player acquisitions THIS season are your measuring stick, then I'm afraid the Krivsky administration is going to (likely) leave you wanting. The best any of us can hope for is that either Kearns or Pena heats up in the first half and can be flipped at the break for high-prospect arms from a contending club. That's the best case scenario for this season: last (or next-to-last) place, but with a couple AA/AAA (either acquired or returning from injury) arms that can get you excited about 2007 or 2008.

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    Re: Okay I am making my call right now....

    im not gonna say we make the playoffs, but if our linup produces like it can, we could have a good season, if we could just get something from our starters.

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    Re: Okay I am making my call right now....

    Quote Originally Posted by M2
    Who's trading near-ace caliber pitchers at this time of year?

    I'm all for getting one, but you might as well demand they make it snow in Sarasota too.

    The team has been making good progress. DanO got canned immediately. Krivsky's signed Dunn to a LTC and he's been cutting out the rot from the front office with gusto.

    Things aren't going to change overnight. I don't need to tell you how far away the Reds are from being good. Had Castellini and Krivsky arrived in November, I'd agree with you that the club should have achieved some major turnover. IMO, there's a big difference between a free pass and recognition that the team's going to have to wait for the market to open up before it pounces.
    I bet Beane'd take offers for Zito; I bet Chicago would be open to trading Contreras; I feel quite certain Jimbo would deal Livan. And there's Clement of course.

    They're out there. They're always out there. Every day of the year. You just have to have the guts to make it work.

    From where I sit, Krivsky's done nothing inventive or unique: he's come in and replaced the guys who might challenge his opinions (surprise!), kept around the flunkeys, and signed their only long-contract-worthy player to a three year contract. While I can't argue with the canning of DanO or the signing of Dunn, they seem like more a matter of course than of invention or design.

    While the market shifts and changes, need (particularly for this team) doesn't. If the Reds FO aren't directly attacking the pitching market, then they need to be indirectly moving out the crap or bringing in the other chips to make deals down the line. We had waiting for two years. I know what that got us.

  14. #13
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    Re: Okay I am making my call right now....

    Quote Originally Posted by Falls City Beer
    I bet Beane'd take offers for Zito; I bet Chicago would be open to trading Contreras; I feel quite certain Jimbo would deal Livan. And there's Clement of course.

    They're out there. They're always out there. Every day of the year. You just have to have the guts to make it work.

    From where I sit, Krivsky's done nothing inventive or unique: he's come in and replaced the guys who might challenge his opinions (surprise!), kept around the flunkeys, and signed their only long-contract-worthy player to a three year contract. While I can't argue with the canning of DanO or the signing of Dunn, they seem like more a matter of course than of invention or design.

    While the market shifts and changes, need (particularly for this team) doesn't. If the Reds FO aren't directly attacking the pitching market, then they need to be indirectly moving out the crap or bringing in the other chips to make deals down the line. We had waiting for two years. I know what that got us.
    He's replaced guys who didn't get the job done. That he might have different opinions from theirs only works in Krivsky's favor. A big chunk of the flunky brigade is gone or has been pushed to the margins. It's been a pretty decent housecleaning. The job isn't finished, though the good news is that Krivsky's shown no indication that he's anywhere near done on that front.

    After more than two years of not getting Dunn signed, I'm not sure how you can claim that Krivsky working out that deal within a week doesn't qualify as inventive AND unique. It's a great contract for the team signed by a player that most folks assumed planned to walk away at his first opportunity.

    As for who's available, I doubt a single pitcher you listed above is on the market at the moment. No way are any of those teams moving arms like those until they get a better handle on what their 2006 needs will be. Oh, you could probably move Dunn for Contreras or Livan or Clement, but I'm guessing you'd prefer the Reds not go that route.
    Baseball isn't a magic trick ... it doesn't get spoiled if you figure out how it works. - gonelong

    I'm witchcrafting everybody.

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    Re: Okay I am making my call right now....

    Quote Originally Posted by M2
    He's replaced guys who didn't get the job done. That he might have different opinions from theirs only works in Krivsky's favor. A big chunk of the flunky brigade is gone or has been pushed to the margins. It's been a pretty decent housecleaning. The job isn't finished, though the good news is that Krivsky's shown no indication that he's anywhere near done on that front.

    After more than two years of not getting Dunn signed, I'm not sure how you can claim that Krivsky working out that deal within a week doesn't qualify as inventive AND unique. It's a great contract for the team signed by a player that most folks assumed planned to walk away at his first opportunity.

    As for who's available, I doubt a single pitcher you listed above is on the market at the moment. No way are any of those teams moving arms like those until they get a better handle on what their 2006 needs will be. Oh, you could probably move Dunn for Contreras or Livan or Clement, but I'm guessing you'd prefer the Reds not go that route.
    I bet Lopez or Encarnacion ropes you any of those pitchers. And where do I sign up for that?

    And I didn't assume Dunn would walk away. I didn't assume he'd stay, but I didn't assume he was itching to get out, either. It all comes back to money, anyway. DanO didn't appreciate what they had in Dunn; Krivsky did; huzzah for him. I imagine 75% of all GMs would have done exactly what Krivsky did in signing Dunn. We're giving Krivsky bonus points for not being a Nimrod--but grade inflation will do that.

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    Re: Okay I am making my call right now....

    Quote Originally Posted by Falls City Beer
    From where I sit, Krivsky's done nothing inventive or unique: he's come in and replaced the guys who might challenge his opinions (surprise!), kept around the flunkeys, and signed their only long-contract-worthy player to a three year contract. While I can't argue with the canning of DanO or the signing of Dunn, they seem like more a matter of course than of invention or design.

    While the market shifts and changes, need (particularly for this team) doesn't. If the Reds FO aren't directly attacking the pitching market, then they need to be indirectly moving out the crap or bringing in the other chips to make deals down the line. We had waiting for two years. I know what that got us.
    I agree that Krivsky hasn't done a tremendous amount in his short tenure, but it has been a very, very short tenure at the end of the offseason. He is in a tough situation to make any impact changes. With that said, he deserves credit for the Dunn signing (not a change, but a good move).

    I second M2 on the point about teams not being willing to trade top tier pitchers at this stage of the offseason. If Beane trades Zito at this late date, what other top tier pitcher is he going to get to anchor his rotation? I guess Contreras may be a little more likely to be traded because the White Sox have a wealth of pitching, but he hasn't been traded yet, and 29 other teams need starting pitching. I can't imagine Ken Williams is frustrated that he can't shed a top flight pitcher -- the guy has pulled the trigger all offseason whenever he wanted to do so. As for Clement being available, . . . okay. I imagine David Wells could be had, as well. I can't fault Krivsky for not jumping to acquire either guy in his first two weeks on the job. Clement is a huge question mark, and Wells is just huge (and wants to go to the West Coast).

    For all we know Krivsky may actually be a smart man and have a plan. His tenure with the Twins would suggest that is the case. He may be waiting until ST gets under way and teams start cutting players and deciding among talent for rosters. If Boston or Chicago settles on a 5 man rotation that excludes an otherwise decent starter, Krivsky could get a better bargain by calling that team on its obvious surplus. The same goes for other teams.

    In sum, I'd give Krivsky and Castellini a break -- call it a free pass or whatever -- at least until they have had a reasonable period to create change. And by "reasonable," I'm not just talking about a length of time, but a period of time when solid players are available and other teams haven't already tried to set their rosters/rotations. This is not a good time to try to rework the roster, even though I agree major changes needed to be made this past offseason.

    As for the optimism that started this thread, I love it. I hope everyone who smiled at the post and shook their heads (including myself) winds up looking back at season's end to give you kudos for being right. It would make for a much happier summer.


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