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Thread: lack of passion

  1. #16
    Unsolicited Opinions traderumor's Avatar
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    Re: lack of passion

    Quote Originally Posted by membengal
    Here's the thing, you do understand that in the course of a 162 game season that pretty much every team will have a stinker or three, right?

    Perhaps the fans in Philly and Oakland are as worried about passion as Reds fans are today. One game. Small sample size. Weird conditions. Losing 16-7 doesn't emperil their chances to win 81 games (or 91 or 71 whatever your flavor of Kool-Aid) any more than winning 16-7 would have enhanced those chances.
    Do you think fans in Oakland know the season started yesterday?

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  3. #17
    Let's ride BRM's Avatar
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    Re: lack of passion

    Quote Originally Posted by traderumor
    Do you think fans in Oakland know the season started yesterday?
    They had an announced attendance of over 35,000, believe it or not.

  4. #18
    Member cincrazy's Avatar
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    Re: lack of passion

    I completely understand that it's one game. I understand that the 1999 team lost it's first three games, if i'm not mistaken, and went on to win 96. I understand all of that. But the attention to detail and the "little things" has been stressed and talked about for so long now, and I just don't see it. That's the frustrating part. I'm really not trying to be a pessimist, I DO believe this team can contend and at least hang in the race until late summer. The Cubs scored 16 runs on opening day last year, and look at how their season went. I understand all of that. I'm not saying that the Reds chances of winning went down the drain after one game, as I think many of you interpreted it. BUT, what I am saying is, if this team's attention to detail and focus doesn't improve drastically from what it's been the last several years, then it'll be more of the same on the banks of the Ohio River this summer. One of the most integral parts of surviving in the majors is adjusting to opposing teams after they adjust to you. Personally, I would say that our team isn't very good at that, and that concerns me.

  5. #19
    Member cincrazy's Avatar
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    Re: lack of passion

    I thought it was interesting how the A's blocked out 20,000 or so seats. Did anyone else hear that mentioned on ESPN2 the other night? It went from 55,000 to 35,000. They put a big tarp over most of the seats. I hate the idea of that. That stadium was ugly enough to begin with, now it's even worse

  6. #20
    Unsolicited Opinions traderumor's Avatar
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    Re: lack of passion

    Quote Originally Posted by BRM
    They had an announced attendance of over 35,000, believe it or not.
    Oh, that's right, they were playing the Yankees, who probably had 25,000 rooting for them.

  7. #21
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    Re: lack of passion

    Quote Originally Posted by traderumor
    Oh, that's right, they were playing the Yankees, who probably had 25,000 rooting for them.
    The ESPN announcers did attribute the atmosphere at the beginning of the game to the Yankees being in town.

  8. #22
    The Lineups stink. KronoRed's Avatar
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    Re: lack of passion

    Quote Originally Posted by cincrazy
    They put a big tarp over most of the seats. I hate the idea of that. That stadium was ugly enough to begin with, now it's even worse
    At least they can get sellouts now, nobody was sitting in those seats anyway.

    I think it looks nice
    Go Gators!

  9. #23
    Charlie Brown All-Star IslandRed's Avatar
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    Re: lack of passion

    cincrazy, I read two long posts of yours ranting about what's wrong with the Reds -- attention to detail, focus, striking out too much, hitting with RISP, defense. Yet the word "pitch" did not appear in either post. Talk about ignoring the elephant in the room.

    If it seems like we have a bunch of strikeout-prone power hitters who are so-so with the glove, well, we do. But it's not because they're not trying, it's because that's the type of player they are. It's not an effort thing, it's a skills thing. And it wouldn't stop us from winning if we got half-decent pitching. A powerhouse offensive team that's pretty bad in the field? That's what the Yankees are. But they have pitching.
    Not all who wander are lost

  10. #24
    Member cincrazy's Avatar
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    Re: lack of passion

    Bad pitching and bad defense go hand in hand. How can a pitching staff be anywhere near decent with a crap defense behind it? And how many championships have the Yankees approach won them recently? Obviously, one of the biggest reasons this team has underachieved is because of pitching, but that's not the ONLY factor.

  11. #25
    Charlie Brown All-Star IslandRed's Avatar
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    Re: lack of passion

    Bad pitching isn't the only factor, but it's by far the biggest one, and it's where any meaningful fixing of the Reds has to start. Having a crummy defense means we'll give up more runs than we otherwise would, but it's not so terrible that a respectable runs-allowed number couldn't happen if the pitching was better.
    Not all who wander are lost

  12. #26
    Member SteelSD's Avatar
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    Re: lack of passion

    Quote Originally Posted by cincrazy
    Bad pitching and bad defense go hand in hand. How can a pitching staff be anywhere near decent with a crap defense behind it? And how many championships have the Yankees approach won them recently? Obviously, one of the biggest reasons this team has underachieved is because of pitching, but that's not the ONLY factor.
    The Yankees have won four of the last 10 World Series titles, have been the AL World Series representative 60% of the time in that span and have a streak of 11 consecutive playoff appearances. Some failure that club is. But that's neither here nor there because the Yankees have nothing at all to do with what you're complaining about.

    The Reds don't have a group of sterling arms who are only held back by a substandard defense. They have a bunch of mediocre-to-bad pitchers whose collective mediocre-to-badness is exacerbated by a sub-optimal defensive alignment chosen by the Manager and GM.

    It's not an effort issue. It's not a focus issue. It's a brains and ability issue. Put the right guys in the right position and you'd have less of a problem. That being said, the Reds don't make the playoffs regardless without having a bunch of truly good pitchers on their roster.

    There was nothing at all wrong in 2005 with the Reds offense. Nothing. The defense wasn't optimal, but any defensive shortcomings pale in comparison to the extreme issues the Reds have with rotation and bullpen arms; even currently. The former can be dealt with using brains. The latter can be dealt with by acquiring ability. But neither of them have anything to do with focus or effort at this point.

    Get smart people who can acquire truly talented players and then put them in the best possible position to help the club and you've got a good team. Don't do that and we get throngs of Joe Average fan complaining about effort on local talk radio and internet message boards.
    "The problem with strikeouts isn't that they hurt your team, it's that they hurt your feelings..." --Rob Neyer

    "The single most important thing for a hitter is to get a good pitch to hit. A good hitter can hit a pitch that’s over the plate three times better than a great hitter with a ball in a tough spot.”
    --Ted Williams

  13. #27
    Member cincrazy's Avatar
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    Re: lack of passion

    Part of what makes a bad baseball player, as you keep referring to, is a lack of focus and effort. Some of that can be attributed to the fact that they just don't have the ability, and others have the ability, but don't give the effort. These players HAVE the ability to run smart on the basepaths, they HAVE the ability to move runners over, etc. If you're in the major leagues, then you HAVE the ability to do the "little things." You're telling me that these veterans don't have that within them? Any "Joe Average fan" can point out that the little things matter, and that any major league player has the ability to do that. If they didn't have the ability, they wouldn't be in the majors in the first place.

  14. #28
    "Let's Roll" TeamBoone's Avatar
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    Re: lack of passion

    Maybe I'm wrong in feeling that way, but that game embarrassed me.
    It embarassed you???? How do you think Adam Dunn felt? Heck, the whole team for that matter. There's no doubt in my mind they wanted to crawl under a rock somewhere before the game was even half over.

    And, IMHO, those feelings can kill any passion they may have felt when the game started... that and trying to stay semi warm.

    I don't think any team has to be jumping up and down shouting to convey passion. We don't know what happens in the dubout or what is said there. They very well may buoy each other in ways that are not apparent to us.
    "Enjoy this Reds fans, you are watching a legend grow up before your very eyes" ... DoogMinAmo on Adam Dunn

  15. #29
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    Re: lack of passion

    plus it seemed every starter that started today up in the cold weather seemed to have gotten killed !

  16. #30
    Please come again pedro's Avatar
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    Re: lack of passion

    Christ had passion. Look where it got him.
    Get your nunchucks and the keys to your dad's car. I know where we can get a gun


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