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Thread: Rosenthal on Reds defense, 'Stros pitching

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    Can he be stopped?
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    Rosenthal on Reds defense, 'Stros pitching

    One of the season's most surprising early developments is that the Astros lead the majors in rotation ERA by a considerable margin even without right-hander Brandon Backe, who is out until at least June 1 with a sprained elbow, and right-hander Roger Clemens, who has yet to decide whether he will play for the Astros or another club.

    The Astros had a 2.89 rotation ERA entering Friday's play, more than a half-run per game better than the next-best team, the Cardinals. Lefty Wandy Rodriguez, 4-0 with a 2.53 ERA, might be a fluke. But rookie righty Taylor Buchholz, in the estimation of one scout, is better than Backe.
    Buchholz, the centerpiece of the Billy Wagner trade with the Phillies in Nov. 2003, was hindered by shoulder trouble in '04 and '05. He excelled in his first two starts against the Brewers and Pirates, prompting a rival G.M. to say, "He looks legit. I'll be surprised if he doesn't stick."

    Astros owner Drayton McLane is notoriously thrifty, but those who know him do not expect him to back off Clemens, who is expected to command a contract of $3 million to $4 million a month. The Astros plan to renew contact with Clemens on Monday, the first day they are permitted to negotiate with him after declining to offer him salary arbitration in December.

    One rival executive describes Clemens as "Drayton's opium," and the recent Forbes magazine valuations of major-league clubs indicate that the Astros are in strong enough financial position to give Clemens the salary he desires. McLane would be villified in Houston if he lost Clemens over money.

    Forbes estimated the Astros' value at $416 million, 10th highest in the majors. It also estimated that the team generated a $30.2 million profit last season second highest in the majors before interest, taxes, depreciation and amortization.

    Rob Manfred, baseball's executive vice president of labor relations, said that the Forbes estimates "misstate" the finances of both the industry and the individual clubs. Perhaps, but there is little doubt that the Astros did big business last season and that Clemens played a major role in both their on-field and off-field success.


    The Reds: Bound to fall?
    Contending teams usually feature strong pitching and defense. The Reds are deficient in both areas, making it doubtful that they'll be a serious threat in the NL Central.

    The Reds' split personality isn't as pronounced as it was last season, when they led the NL in both runs scored and runs allowed, finishing 73-89.

    They were again first in runs scored entering Friday's play, but third in runs allowed progress of sorts. Two of their projected starting pitchers, right-hander Paul Wilson and lefty Eric Milton, are on the DL, though neither is certain to be a significant contributor. Veteran reliever Rick White, 37, might have the best fastball on the club.

    The defense doesn't help matters. The Reds committed 22 errors in their first 22 games, most in the majors, and ranked 25th out of 30 in defensive efficiency, a statistic that measures the percentage of balls in plays that are converted into outs.

    The defensive struggles of third baseman Edwin Encarnacion, who leads the majors with eight errors, are curious; Encarnacion, 23, does early work every day with bench coach Bucky Dent, according to G.M. Wayne Krivsky.

    "He has enough raw ability that it shouldn't be so difficult he's got a good arm, good enough feet, good enough reactions," says a scout who recently saw the Reds. "But it might just be that he's a bat who belongs in the American League."

    Left fielder Adam Dunn, who has made four errors, is another issue.

    "He's worse now than he has ever been in the outfield," the scout says. "His range is limited. His routes to balls are a little scary. They're going to have to move him to first base."
    http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/5551338

    Please, Please, Please move Dunn to 1st!
    Tom Shearn... who knew?

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  3. #2
    This one's for you Edd Heath's Avatar
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    Re: Rosenthal on Reds defense, 'Stros pitching

    Lots of stuff to toss against the wall again for Rosy there.
    Some people play baseball. Baseball plays Jay Bruce.

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    The Lineups stink. KronoRed's Avatar
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    Re: Rosenthal on Reds defense, 'Stros pitching

    Dunn to 1st is true, but EE an AL guy? pure poop.
    Go Gators!

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    Re: Rosenthal on Reds defense, 'Stros pitching

    "He has enough raw ability that it shouldn't be so difficult — he's got a good arm, good enough feet, good enough reactions," says a scout who recently saw the Reds. "But it might just be that he's a bat who belongs in the American League."
    Based on what?

    Eight errors or some hidden flaw the "scout" is refusing to reveal, because it sounds like he likes what he has for the position.

    Sounds like bleacher talk to me.

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    Member red-in-la's Avatar
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    Re: Rosenthal on Reds defense, 'Stros pitching

    Dunn to 1B and JR to LF.... .....makes this as close to an everyday starting 8 as I have seen since 1976.

    It also leaves Aurilia, and Hatteburg on the bench which makes this a pretty strong bench.

    Trouble is....as obvious as this decision is, Narron won't make it.

    I would remind some that it took Sparky over a month to make the famous "move Rose to 3B" decision.
    "Is there a problem officers?"

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    Re: Rosenthal on Reds defense, 'Stros pitching

    Eddie had a nice game last Sunday. The piece says he has all the tools to be a good defensive player, so how can he come to the conclusion that he is a dh? Granted that the number of errors so far is alarming, but he's too good of an athlete not to turn this around.

    If it gets bad enough, he hits well enough to be a corner outfielder... at the very least. Buncha crap. Scouts work for teams, and part of their job is to spin things to set up deals for their clubs. People tend to forget that.

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    Re: Rosenthal on Reds defense, 'Stros pitching

    Sounds to me like a Card or Cubs or Astros scout trying to get the Reds to deal him out of the league. Nice try...OB no longer works for the Reds, too little, too late.

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    On the brink of disaster acredsfan's Avatar
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    Re: Rosenthal on Reds defense, 'Stros pitching

    Quote Originally Posted by Santo Alcala
    Eddie had a nice game last Sunday. The piece says he has all the tools to be a good defensive player, so how can he come to the conclusion that he is a dh? Granted that the number of errors so far is alarming, but he's too good of an athlete not to turn this around.

    If it gets bad enough, he hits well enough to be a corner outfielder... at the very least. Buncha crap. Scouts work for teams, and part of their job is to spin things to set up deals for their clubs. People tend to forget that.
    Just throwing this out there, but maybe it isn't the athletic ability of Encarnacion holding him back, maybe its mental, although i think saying he is an AL player is a big leap, but there can be a mental problem with him, maybe he's just rushing himself too much and needs to slow it down, or maybe he's just young, although Rosenthal doesn't mention age as a possible influence on the errors in the article and people in the media and on this board seem to forget he's still a kid. I'm not making excuses for him, but he does have time on his side. I don't think he is an AL player, i think he'll be just fine here with the reds, just give him time before you start dooming him to being a designated hitter. Maybe 1st base would be a good position for him, he's got the bat, and that will eliminate a lot of throwing errors.
    "I thought I'd get your theories, mock them, then embrace my own. The usual." -- House

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    Unsolicited Opinions traderumor's Avatar
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    Re: Rosenthal on Reds defense, 'Stros pitching

    EE made 3 errors in one game. Sort of like deciding a reliever sucks in April because he had a bad outing and his ERA is high because of it.
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    Re: Rosenthal on Reds defense, 'Stros pitching

    The idea of playing EdE anywhere other than 3b is lunacy. He's got future Gold-Glover written all over him.
    Quote Originally Posted by Scrap Irony View Post
    Calipari is not, nor has he ever been accused or "caught", cheating. He himself turned in one of his players (Camby) for dealing with an agent to get one Final Four overturned. The other is all on the NCAA and Rose. (IF Rose cheated.)
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    "Let's Roll" TeamBoone's Avatar
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    Re: Rosenthal on Reds defense, 'Stros pitching

    And he's pretty much still a rookie. No reason to panic because he's made errors; I truly think he'll work hard at turning that part of his game around.
    "Enjoy this Reds fans, you are watching a legend grow up before your very eyes" ... DoogMinAmo on Adam Dunn

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    Re: Rosenthal on Reds defense, 'Stros pitching

    This should be the lineup and defensive alignment...

    Freel CF
    Lopez SS
    Dunn 1B
    Griffey LF
    Encarnacion 3B
    Kearns RF
    Phillips 2B
    LaRue/Valentin C

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    Member Gainesville Red's Avatar
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    Re: Rosenthal on Reds defense, 'Stros pitching

    I thought it was interesting that he added the sentence about Rick White. I'm not arguing that he does or does not have the best fastball on the team, I'm just saying that the sentence doesn't seem to fit in the article. It just seems to be in there for no reason. Just sort of thrown in there.

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    The Lineups stink. KronoRed's Avatar
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    Re: Rosenthal on Reds defense, 'Stros pitching

    Quote Originally Posted by johngalt
    This should be the lineup and defensive alignment...

    Freel CF
    Lopez SS
    Dunn 1B
    Griffey LF
    Encarnacion 3B
    Kearns RF
    Phillips 2B
    LaRue/Valentin C
    The perfect lineup.
    Go Gators!

  16. #15
    GR8NESS WMR's Avatar
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    Re: Rosenthal on Reds defense, 'Stros pitching

    Quote Originally Posted by johngalt
    This should be the lineup and defensive alignment...

    Freel CF
    Lopez SS
    Dunn 1B
    Griffey LF
    Encarnacion 3B
    Kearns RF
    Phillips 2B
    LaRue/Valentin C
    MY perfect lineup: w. defense

    1) Freel CF
    2) Lopez SS
    3) Dunn 1st
    4) EdE 3rd
    5) Griffey Jr.LF
    6) Kearns RF
    7) Phillips 2nd
    8) LaRue C

    I batted Phillips 7th because Deno give him a bit of protection. Playing them both everyday, it'll be obvious what changes needed to be made. But the changes will be made from a scientific, intelligent stand-poing.

    Maybe people will move up or down, but it wll BASED ON ACTUAL REASON FOR ONCE.

    You got your first two protected by Dunn. EdE, batting behind Dunn, will not only receive ENOURMOUS opporunitiy with men on base, he'll also see good pitches and have a chance to even further develop his already very good "hitter's eye." He can affor be selfish, because look who's hitting right behind him, a pitcher that no pitcher wants to face.

    Can you really afford to pass Griff? Kearns is an enigma sometimes, but he can still his it out and always a threat to do damage. Kearns makes you at least about pitching to Griffey.

    Again, I like Phillips higher because I like what he's liable to do when he gets on base also considering that he's currently the better of the two to do damage and wreck havov if DO happen to be ducks on the pond.. I feel much happier when he gets on base with LaRue/Deno batthing behind him as opposed to the pitcher.

    So... that'y my take. Implement it and I guarantee.........


    "Follow this line-up and I guarantee you that your wildest dreams. will come true"

    Last edited by WMR; 04-29-2006 at 05:11 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Scrap Irony View Post
    Calipari is not, nor has he ever been accused or "caught", cheating. He himself turned in one of his players (Camby) for dealing with an agent to get one Final Four overturned. The other is all on the NCAA and Rose. (IF Rose cheated.)
    "Cheering for Kentucky is like watching Star Wars and hoping Darth Vader chokes an ewok"



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