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Thread: Astros Give Reds Credit

  1. #1
    Redsmetz redsmetz's Avatar
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    Astros Give Reds Credit

    From today's Houston Chronicle:

    Reds chip away at Oswalt's dominance
    Unbeaten streak ends as Astros fall run short in ninth

    By BRIAN MCTAGGART
    Copyright 2006 Houston Chronicle

    CINCINNATI - If there was a silver lining in the first loss of the season for Astros righthander Roy Oswalt, it's that he no longer will have to answer questions about his perfect record against the Cincinnati Reds.

    That's because the Reds one of baseball's biggest surprises this season finally figured out how to beat the Astros righthander on Friday night at Great American Ball Park. Oswalt (4-1) allowed eight hits and three runs in six innings and suffered his first loss in 16 career decisions against the Reds (16-7), who held on to beat the Astros 5-4 in front of 32,089 fans.

    "Eventually it was going to come to an end if you play long enough," said Oswalt, who lost for the first time since Sept. 11, 2005.

    Oswalt came into the game 15-0 against the Reds since 2001 and with the major-league record for most wins against a team without a loss.

    "He could start another five-year run if he wants to," Astros manager Phil Garner said. "That's a nice streak. I don't know how to explain those things. It's an unusual record."

    Cincinnati won for the fifth game in a row and knocked the Astros (15-7) from first place in the National League Central with their club record-tying 16th win in April. It was the Astros' first loss in eight one-run games this year.

    Reds lefthander Brandon Claussen (2-2) collected the win after holding the Astros to six hits and two runs in 5 1/3 innings. Todd Coffey threw two scoreless innings in relief, and David Weathers held on in the ninth for his seventh save.

    Called on to protect a 5-2 lead, Weathers gave up a two-run homer down the left-field line to Lance Berkman with one out. The ball was caught by a fan in front of the foul pole and quickly ruled a homer by third-base umpire Gerry Davis.

    "I knew I hit it good, but I wasn't thinking home run," Berkman said. "The whole time I was wondering if it was going to be fair or foul. I kind of watched and at the last minute it straightened out and died in the corner. The guy reached his glove out and caught it, and I knew they were going to call it at least a double."

    With a chance to tie the game, Morgan Ensberg flied out to center field and Preston Wilson flied out to right to end the game.

    "It's was their night," Berkman said. "They kept giving themselves chances to score, but a lot of hits were not exactly tattooed. There were seeing-eye grounders and a jam shot and that sort of thing, but give those guys a lot of credit."

    Oswalt struggled with his location and worked in and out of trouble all night. Still, the three runs the Reds scored off him came on a bloop single, groundout and sacrifice fly.

    "It's better than bullets all over the field, I guess," Oswalt said. "It's kind of bad when you throw a quality pitch and they hit it over the infield or put it in play and score."

    Garner said Oswalt wasn't himself.

    "He wasn't as sharp and was missing location all night long," he said. "I looked at the board at replays and could see (catcher) Brad (Ausmus) setting up away and the ball would be up and in. A couple of balls that were hit, he set up in and they ran back across the plate. Even at that, we're still in the ballgame."

    The Astros couldn't capitalize on their nine hits or the six walks and one hit batter Reds pitchers provided. They left 10 runners on base.

    "It's one of those nights you had to battle to stay in the game and I really didn't have anything to go with," Oswalt said. "Later in the game in the sixth, seventh inning, I felt better than the first four."

    With the Astros trailing 3-1 in the sixth, Wilson led off with a homer his first since April 10 to get the Astros within a run. They had runners at second and third with two outs later in the inning, but reliever Rick White got Craig Biggio to ground out.

    Mike Gallo started the seventh for the Astros and was pulled after giving up a one-out single to Adam Dunn. Chad Qualls came in and surrendered consecutive singles to Rich Aurilia and Scott Hatteberg to load the bases. Qualls struck out Austin Kearns swinging for the second out and got ahead of Brandon Phillips with two strikes. But Phillips rolled the next pitch back up the middle for a two-run single.

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  3. #2
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    Re: Astros Give Reds Credit

    Sounds to me like they were making Excuses and then talking about the weak hits the Reds had. Basically meaning, it was LUCK. That is the way I am reading them.
    "Some of the guys who pitched well for us last year aren't going to make the ballclub," Narron said.

    Pete Rose, when asked by David Letterman who he likes in the MLB playoffs:

    "You sound like you're betting on baseball."

  4. #3
    CELEBRATION TIME RBA's Avatar
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    Re: Astros Give Reds Credit

    I have to agree with cReds1, it reads like a lot of excuses.

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    Redsmetz redsmetz's Avatar
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    Re: Astros Give Reds Credit

    I'll concede the title is probably overstated, I chose it hesitantly based on this comment from Berkman:

    "It's was their night," Berkman said. "They kept giving themselves chances to score, but a lot of hits were not exactly tattooed. There were seeing-eye grounders and a jam shot and that sort of thing, but give those guys a lot of credit."
    Part of what struck me about their comments was that this wasn't the typical Reds win we've seen. Someone noted at the season's onset that we weren't going to see a lot of 2-1, 3-2 games, but rather more 9-8 games etc. This game might well have been a 5-2 game had the fan not caught the ball in front of the foul pole., but we'll never know if that ball would have been a homer or a foul or a double. That said, I'll take a 5-4 win which featured no home runs for the hometown nine - it was a small ball win with good starting pitching and I think we earned some respect for that. And that was my actual point.

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    Dunnilicious creek14's Avatar
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    Re: Astros Give Reds Credit

    "Eventually it was going to come to an end if you play long enough," said Oswalt,
    Translated "The Reds just got lucky, I could have held them winless my entire career."

    "He could start another five-year run if he wants to," Astros manager Phil Garner
    Translated "The Reds just got lucky, Roy could have held them winless his entire career."

    Berkman said. "They kept giving themselves chances to score, but a lot of hits were not exactly tattooed. There were seeing-eye grounders and a jam shot and that sort of thing..."
    Translated "The Reds just got lucky, Roy could have held them winless his entire career."

    Garner said Oswalt wasn't himself. "He wasn't as sharp and was missing location all night long," he said. "I looked at the board at replays and could see (catcher) Brad (Ausmus) setting up away and the ball would be up and in. A couple of balls that were hit, he set up in and they ran back across the plate. Even at that, we're still in the ballgame."
    Translated "The Reds just got lucky, Roy could have held them winless his entire career."
    Will trade this space for a #1 starter.

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    Moderator RedlegJake's Avatar
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    Re: Astros Give Reds Credit

    Actually it is the small ball aspect of this team that encourages me most...no more waiting for a 3 run bomb but getting the bombs AND scratching out runs when the long ball isn't there. Small ball by itself won't win games but as a spice it makes a good dish great.

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    Redsmetz redsmetz's Avatar
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    Re: Astros Give Reds Credit

    Quote Originally Posted by RedlegJake
    Actually it is the small ball aspect of this team that encourages me most...no more waiting for a 3 run bomb but getting the bombs AND scratching out runs when the long ball isn't there. Small ball by itself won't win games but as a spice it makes a good dish great.
    Exactly!

  9. #8
    "Let's Roll" TeamBoone's Avatar
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    Re: Astros Give Reds Credit

    Credit? I didn't see any credit in that article (except from Berkman).

    I think cReds1 nailed it.

    In the article I posted on the game thread, the writer chalked it up to the fact that Oswalt was "under the weather".
    "Enjoy this Reds fans, you are watching a legend grow up before your very eyes" ... DoogMinAmo on Adam Dunn

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    Member MattyHo4Life's Avatar
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    Re: Astros Give Reds Credit

    The Astros didn't give the Reds any credit. They are sore losers, and just made excuses for why they lost. Not one time did they say that they lost to the better team, because they don't believe it. In their minds, the Reds just got lucky, and it won't happen again. I'm sorry, but I just can't stand the Astros. The Cubs are my least favorite team, but the Astros are right up there with them. Comments like these show you exactly why.

  11. #10
    One and a half men Patrick Bateman's Avatar
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    Re: Astros Give Reds Credit

    Quote Originally Posted by MattyMo4Life
    I'm sorry, but I just can't stand the Astros.
    Really, there is no reason to apologize.

  12. #11
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    Re: Astros Give Reds Credit

    I will say that I was reading the story on the Astros' site about the game recap (the counterpart to the recap on the Reds' site), and Garner did give the Reds some credit.

    Here's his quote from that story. It's right at the bottom of it, in case you wanna read the rest:

    "That's what happens when they put the ball in play," Garner said. "Sometimes they're caught and a lot of times they'll sneak away. I think that's the biggest difference with [the Reds] this year. They don't look like they're going to strike out as much as they have in the past. Putting the ball in play, things are going to happen."

    As much as I hate the Astros, Garner is right. We hardly struck out last night against a guy that has killed us in the past. That was the key to the game--putting the ball in play.

  13. #12
    Where's my chair? REDREAD's Avatar
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    Re: Astros Give Reds Credit

    I don't get all the "excuses" angles.

    It seemed like Oswalt was just saying all streaks come to an end.
    Berkman said "It was their night".. Isn't that giving some credit?

    What do you guys expect the Astros to say, "The Reds beat us tonight, and they are probably a better team than us?" I don't seem to recall any people complaining after a Reds loss that our team didn't give enough credit to the opposing team.

    In fact, I've heard people on this board state after some Claussen & Harang losses that the other team got a few lucky ones to fall in for hits, etc and that his start wasn't that bad. It's the nature of the beast to think that somehow your team might've been able to pull off a win if they had only gotten a few more breaks (How many fans/teams of basketball blame the refs, citing that a couple of calls changed the game )

    Anyhow, I don't take this as disrespecting the Reds or making excuses. It's standard post game talk. Remember, their audience is the Astro fans. And of course Garner is going to sing Oswalt's praises, even after a loss. That's part of his job, to help promote the stars of the team.
    Thank you Walt and Bob for going for it in 2010-2014!

    Nov. 13, 2007: One of the greatest days in Reds history: John Allen gets the boot!

  14. #13
    For a Level Playing Field RedFanAlways1966's Avatar
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    Re: Astros Give Reds Credit

    Quote Originally Posted by REDREAD
    Anyhow, I don't take this as disrespecting the Reds or making excuses. It's standard post game talk. Remember, their audience is the Astro fans. And of course Garner is going to sing Oswalt's praises, even after a loss. That's part of his job, to help promote the stars of the team.
    Exactly how I read it.
    Small market fan... always hoping, but never expecting.

  15. #14
    GO XAVIER! toledodan's Avatar
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    Re: Astros Give Reds Credit

    also after hitting alot of homeruns early the reds have hit very few over the last couple of weeks. i think we have just hit a couple during our 5 game winning streak.
    there's nothing like bowling a 300 game! 13 now and retired.


    Ricky henderson has a higher OBP than C. patterson and he's retired. C. Trent 6-14-2008

  16. #15
    Redsmetz redsmetz's Avatar
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    Re: Astros Give Reds Credit

    Quote Originally Posted by MattyMo4Life
    The Astros didn't give the Reds any credit. They are sore losers, and just made excuses for why they lost. Not one time did they say that they lost to the better team, because they don't believe it. In their minds, the Reds just got lucky, and it won't happen again. I'm sorry, but I just can't stand the Astros. The Cubs are my least favorite team, but the Astros are right up there with them. Comments like these show you exactly why.
    Would you really expect the Astros to say of the Reds "they're the better team"? That hardly sounds realistic. I think they were giving the Reds their due while still acknowledging their own shortcomings.


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