Let's all take a deep breath (everyone please read)

[savafan]

Okay Steel, you're making me reconsider hiding reputation points.

I hate it when you get me all confused like that.

[TOBTTReds]

Well said, as usual, ORH. Frankly, I'd love to see the following added to the top of the Redszone Rules/Guidelines:

1. You have the right to have an opinion.
2. You do not have the right to have an unopposed opinion.

The folks who make it here long-term at Redszone almost instinctually understand those two truths. Those who don't...well, we've seen the issues.

It is how people's opinions get opposed that has created this whole thread. Everyone knows that there will be a rebuttle to their thoughts. That is why many post, to see the response and create discussion.

Some people get there opinions taken away by others because the opposition is so strong with their words and statements, that the person loses all opinion and gets absolutely slammed.

So if I had to add a rule:

Everyone's opinions will remain just that, even after discussion on it. A person can not be slammed, name called, and basically humiliated because of their opinion.

--------------
There have been many threads where someone has their opinion knocked by others, then it is an all out gang up on one guy. It's not the strength in numbers which is bad (bc then likely that one person was wrong), but it is the cruelty at which people go at it against that one person. Just like this title of the thread, people need to take a deep breath. And let someone have their own opinion.

[Ron Madden]

Why would anyone want to believe in and cling to any opinion that is proven wrong? I don't understand this line of thinking.

I would rather someone dispute my opinion and prove me wrong than to go on believeing in something that is'nt true.

We must all keep an open mind.

[TOBTTReds]

Why would anyone want to believe in and cling to any opinion that is proven wrong? I don't understand this line of thinking.

I would rather someone dispute my opinion and prove me wrong than to go on believeing in something that is'nt true.

We must all keep an open mind.

Many times things aren't proven wrong and the fight goes on. For example someone saying that Rich Aurilia is a better 1B than Hatteberg. Someone might feel very strong about Hatteberg, then a rebuttle is that Aurilia has more range. Hatte picks better though, Aurilia positions himself better....these types of things can't be proved. Even some stats that are used in hitting situations and stuff still create arguments.

If all opinions could be solved, they wouldnt be opinions, they would be facts, or wrong.

[Larry Schuler]

I have noticed that the most admirable suggestions in this thread have come from those who have the well being of the WHOLE community in mind and not just themselves. Those who offer ideas that open the community and encourage new members and opinions.

It is very easy to make a post saying, "RedsZone members should be allowed to XYZ" when that particular privelage/activity is something that serves yourself. It's similar to my boss hassling me for being late to work and me responding with, "I think for the best interest of this company, all workers should start work at 8:15 instead of 8." I am offering ideas based on what serves me best.

I agree with the people who suggested a mission statement. This board either needs to be open to anyone or closed to the elite. It can't be both to different people. That is where a lot of conflict comes from, those who think posting on RedsZone is a privelage for a select few battling with those who think RedsZone is a place for all Reds fans to share their thoughts.

[NastyBoy]

Here are my suggestions for improving the forum.

1. Eliminate reps points. Make ORG posting by invitation only.
2. Eliminate game threads. The whole concept of a game thread and a forum are opposed. A game thread is a stream of thought event. A forum post is a well thought out response to a topic. To hold both to the same standards is ridiculous. Create a live game chat and let the comments and emotion of the moment flow.
3. Set up a new forum called "the Crapper" or "the Toilet" or "the Dump" or "the Abyss". Here you can have all the Dunn HOF vs. Dunn SUX and Marty HOF vs. Marty SUX banter, RRS vs. RC, ROY vs. CYA, RISP vs. RSVP... etc. you want. And make it a free for all... anything goes.

[Ron Madden]

Many times things aren't proven wrong and the fight goes on. For example someone saying that Rich Aurilia is a better 1B than Hatteberg. Someone might feel very strong about Hatteberg, then a rebuttle is that Aurilia has more range. Hatte picks better though, Aurilia positions himself better....these types of things can't be proved. Even some stats that are used in hitting situations and stuff still create arguments.

If all opinions could be solved, they wouldnt be opinions, they would be facts, or wrong.

Most of those arguments can be setteled with facts.

I have had opinions that I believed to be true proven false by others with a differing opinion. They backed thier opinions with facts.

Instead of being "Bull Headed" I learned from them. Thats all I'm saying by keep an open mind.

[TeamCasey]

I like the 2 game threads because it keeps the noise down, you can follow the game instead of hitting refresh and seeing 25 new posts and maybe 1 of them saying something about what actually happened on the field.

I was staying out of all this, but I will say this much. I enjoy the two game threads. It isn't about haves or have nots or quality of posts to me. It simply cut the numbers down. I can read either one and they aren't 30 pages long anymore.

[TeamCasey]

I finally read through everything. Still staying out of the fray...... I hope. I did read a couple mentions of having a single game thread on ORG. That would be a tragic mistake, IMO. Everyone should have access to a game thread. I enjoy two because of the numbers.

That said, I would love to see more people involved in chat. I only get in there on the weekends. Sometimes a decent crowd, sometimes not. All are welcome new and old ...... and the rules are less restrictive. We even get a little naughty in there on occasion.

Does everyone know it exists? Perhaps it's a bit camouflaged on the tool bar. Boss, can we make the chat button more prominent? Maybe a different color or a bit chat button on the upper right corner above the "Welcome TeamCasey"?

[wheels]

Here are my suggestions for improving the forum.

1. Eliminate reps points. Make ORG posting by invitation only.
2. Eliminate game threads. The whole concept of a game thread and a forum are opposed. A game thread is a stream of thought event. A forum post is a well thought out response to a topic. To hold both to the same standards is ridiculous. Create a live game chat and let the comments and emotion of the moment flow.
3. Set up a new forum called "the Crapper" or "the Toilet" or "the Dump" or "the Abyss". Here you can have all the Dunn HOF vs. Dunn SUX and Marty HOF vs. Marty SUX banter, RRS vs. RC, ROY vs. CYA, RISP vs. RSVP... etc. you want. And make it a free for all... anything goes.

1. I couldn't care less about what is done with rep points, but I use them.

2. Game threads are great, and are the meat and potatoes of the board during the season. It's not really all that hard to be civil.

3. Different forum or not, the concept you've outlined still goes against the reason for Redszone's existance. How many different forums does one site need anyway?

Every time a new influx of posters occurs, this happens.

Every time the older posters get fed up with the junk that's floating around and start getting vocal about it, the newer posters start making a push to enact change even though they've essentially just joined the board.

If the owners of this site changed at the whim of everyone, lord only knows what it would look like.

Learn the rules, think about what you say, develop a thicker skin when it comes to having your ideas challenged, and everything else is peripheral.

This place doesn't belong to us, so we need to follow the rules, or move on.

[edabbs44]

1. I couldn't care less about what is done with rep points, but I use them.

2. Game threads are great, and are the meat and potatoes of the board during the season. It's not really all that hard to be civil.

3. Different forum or not, the concept you've outlined still goes against the reason for Redszone's existance. How many different forums does one site need anyway?

Every time a new influx of posters occurs, this happens.

Every time the older posters get fed up with the junk that's floating around and start getting vocal about it, the newer posters start making a push to enact change even though they've essentially just joined the board.

If the owners of this site changed at the whim of everyone, lord only knows what it would look like.

Learn the rules, think about what you say, develop a thicker skin when it comes to having your ideas challenged, and everything else is peripheral.

This place doesn't belong to us, so we need to follow the rules, or move on.

I think this post made a lot of sense. There are a lot of newer posters (myself included) and I never saw any gamethread ground rules posted. This, to me, is one of the roots of the "problem" at hand.

[Raisor]

:

1. You have the right to have an opinion.
2. You do not have the right to have an unopposed opinion.

I don't think this can be said enough, so I'm quoting Steel.

I'm also going to give Steel some negative rep points. Just because.

[remdog]

.....I would love to see more people involved in chat. I only get in there on the weekends. Sometimes a decent crowd, sometimes not. All are welcome new and old ...... and the rules are less restrictive. We even get a little naughty in there on occasion.

I was there that night and I have to say I was....well....shocked! (In a good way ) After that session I can't wait for the next 'Ladies of Redszone' calender!

Rem

[registerthis]

How bout separate forums for optimists and pessimists.

I don't think there's any way that could ever work.

[Raisor]

I still think we need Thunderdome. We could ask Tina Turner to moderate it!