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Thread: Now the truth comes out... Jim Bowden was never....

  1. #1
    Member paulrichjr's Avatar
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    Now the truth comes out... Jim Bowden was never....

    This just cracked me up. I wonder who gave Gammons this little rumor...
    You think JimBo takes any blame for the shambles that he left in Cincy's farm?

    http://insider.espn.go.com/espn/blog...peter#20060612

    Jim Bowden was never allowed to be big into the draft when he was in Cincinnati because he had owners who didn't believe in it, or its costs. But Bowden has been empowered to begin the reconstruction of the Washington Nationals, and threw himself into the draft. Bowden and the Nationals took the long-term route, with high-profile high school players like 3B Chris Marrero, Florida H.S. RHP Colton Willems, hard-throwing New Jersey RHP Sean Black and Orlando H.S. SS Stephen King. That is an indication that the new ownership is allowing Bowden to eventually trade for as much young talent as he can get, so the market for Alfonso Soriano, Jose Guillen, Livan Hernandez, Tony Armas, et al will be very interesting next month. Next to the draft, what Bowden enjoys most is making trades, so stay tuned.
    Last edited by paulrichjr; 06-14-2006 at 12:09 AM.
    Tim McCarver: Baseball Quotes
    I remember one time going out to the mound to talk with Bob Gibson. He told me to get back behind the batter, that the only thing I knew about pitching was that it was hard to hit.

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  3. #2
    got alil captain in u?
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    Re: Now the truth comes out... Jim Bowden was never....

    we know about how jimbo does deals see ryan dempster brian moehler projects who those worked out

  4. #3
    Member Reds4Life's Avatar
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    Re: Now the truth comes out... Jim Bowden was never....

    Bowden is still a very bitter man when it comes to the Reds. He needs to move on and focus that energy on keeping his job in Washington.
    Pessimists are well informed optimists

  5. #4
    RZ Chamber of Commerce Unassisted's Avatar
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    Re: Now the truth comes out... Jim Bowden was never....

    I must admit that's a decent smokescreen to cover up or justify the choices that were made in the draft while he was in Cincinnati.

  6. #5
    The Lineups stink. KronoRed's Avatar
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    Re: Now the truth comes out... Jim Bowden was never....

    So no credit for Dunn and Kearns then
    Go Gators!

  7. #6
    Churlish Johnny Footstool's Avatar
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    Re: Now the truth comes out... Jim Bowden was never....

    Jimbo was neither as bad as fans make him out to be nor as good as he believes he was.

    However, he was forced to pass up on a few high-level picks due to "signability" issues.
    "I prefer books and movies where the conflict isn't of the extreme cannibal apocalypse variety I guess." Redsfaithful

  8. #7
    Worst Behavior. reds44's Avatar
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    Re: Now the truth comes out... Jim Bowden was never....

    Quote Originally Posted by KronoRed
    So no credit for Dunn and Kearns then
    Edwin
    Quote Originally Posted by PuffyPig View Post
    Let's face it, you mis-hit the bun with the mustard squirter, no one will really care.

  9. #8
    Who, What, Where, When? Tornon's Avatar
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    Re: Now the truth comes out... Jim Bowden was never....

    Edwin wasn't drafted by us

  10. #9
    Worst Behavior. reds44's Avatar
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    Re: Now the truth comes out... Jim Bowden was never....

    Quote Originally Posted by Tornon
    Edwin wasn't drafted by us
    Yes, but Bowden traded for him.
    Quote Originally Posted by PuffyPig View Post
    Let's face it, you mis-hit the bun with the mustard squirter, no one will really care.

  11. #10
    The Lineups stink. KronoRed's Avatar
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    Re: Now the truth comes out... Jim Bowden was never....

    He traded for Mateo, Edwin was a throw in
    Go Gators!

  12. #11
    THAT'S A FACT JACK!! GAC's Avatar
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    Re: Now the truth comes out... Jim Bowden was never....

    Quote Originally Posted by Johnny Footstool
    Jimbo was neither as bad as fans make him out to be nor as good as he believes he was.

    However, he was forced to pass up on a few high-level picks due to "signability" issues.
    That's exactly right. And Marge really downplayed the significance of the farm system and scouting. She refused to spend the money on what she thought was frivalous ventures.
    "panic" only comes from having real expectations

  13. #12
    Baseball card addict MrCinatit's Avatar
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    Re: Now the truth comes out... Jim Bowden was never....

    Wasn't it scouting supervisors Marge went through like George Steinbrenner went through managers? That foundation still hurts the Reds, IMO, and Dan0's reign did nothing to help.
    But, of course, Bowden was a pretty bad GM...so he and Narge were a perfect match.

  14. #13
    Where's my chair? REDREAD's Avatar
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    Re: Now the truth comes out... Jim Bowden was never....

    Quote Originally Posted by Johnny Footstool
    Jimbo was neither as bad as fans make him out to be nor as good as he believes he was.

    However, he was forced to pass up on a few high-level picks due to "signability" issues.

    Great summary.

    I will add to Bowden's defense that not many GM's have had two first round picks totally unfunded (Sowers + Esponisa). Then were forced to make signablity picks like Snamek, etc.

    Bottom line is that after Allen said in the press that Howington was a "waste of money", the draft money dried up.

    However, Bowden did make quite a few big gaffes, like passing over Berkman (because he was an "AL" player). Another one was to pick CJ Nitcowski #1 in hopes of him being a lefty out of the pen that fall to face Atlanta. Passing over Jeter and Garciparra was also an obvious mistake.

    But Bowden had quite a few successes in the pre-Howington era. Dunn, Kearns, Williamson, maybe LaRue. He also had an eye for picking young talent in trades (although it was mainly position players).
    Thank you Walt and Bob for going for it in 2010-2014!

    Nov. 13, 2007: One of the greatest days in Reds history: John Allen gets the boot!

  15. #14
    Hisssssssss Yachtzee's Avatar
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    Re: Now the truth comes out... Jim Bowden was never....

    Quote Originally Posted by Johnny Footstool
    Jimbo was neither as bad as fans make him out to be nor as good as he believes he was.

    However, he was forced to pass up on a few high-level picks due to "signability" issues.
    I think the first statement if a fair assessment. However, lots of teams have to pass up draft picks because of signability issues. It doesn't always have to do with whether a team can afford the player or not. Smart teams are going to be very careful about players asking for the big money because no one wants to end up with another Brien Taylor.

    I don't know him personally, so my impressions are based on what I've seen in the papers and on TV. My feeling on Jim Bowden is that he is a bright guy, but he lacks self-control. He lacks it when he speaks and he seems to lack it when he does business. My theory is that working with a small budget actually helped reign him in. I feel that if they had opened the pocketbooks, he would have just spent it poorly. The other big issue I saw was that he seems to have this desire to have to "win" trades. With the Griffey trade in particular, there were a few times when he seemed to be gloating about how he got the best of the deal. Not exactly a good way to do business in an industry where you have a limited number of organization with whom you can deal.

    All in all, Bowden made some brilliant moves and some real stinkers.
    Burn down the disco. Hang the blessed DJ. Because the music that he constantly plays, it says nothing to me about my life.

  16. #15
    breath westofyou's Avatar
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    Re: Now the truth comes out... Jim Bowden was never....

    But Bowden had quite a few successes in the pre-Howington era. Dunn, Kearns, Williamson, maybe LaRue.
    Horrible 1st rounders too. and gave the 1995 pick away for Berryhill.

    Code:
    1993 	Pat Watkins 	OF 	SECOND ROUND 			32 
    1994 	C.J. Nitkowski 	LHP 	St. John's U 			9 
    1995 	Brett Tomko 	RHP 	SECOND ROUND 			54 
    1996 	John Oliver 	OF 	Lehman, PA 			25
    1997 	Brandon Larson 	SS 	Louisiana State U 		14 
    1998 	Austin Kearns 	RF 	Lexington, KY 			7 
    1999 	Ty Howington 	LHP 	Vancouver, WA 			14
    2000 	David Espinosa 	SS 	Miami, FL 			23
    2001 	*Jeremy Sowers 	LHP 	Ballard HS, KY 			20
    2002 	Chris Gruler 	RHP 	Brentwood, CA 			3
    2003 	Ryan Wagner 	RH1P 	Un of Houston 			14


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