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Thread: Phillips debacle shows Tribe has a screw loose

  1. #1
    Worst Behavior. reds44's Avatar
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    Phillips debacle shows Tribe has a screw loose

    http://www.cleveland.com/sports/plai...370.xml&coll=2

    Brandon Phillips, peddled to Cin cinnati because he had no future with the dysfunctional Indians, sat in the visitors' dugout Friday. He still wishes it was the other one.

    Many fans feel the same way.

    Phillips, hitting .313 with seven home runs, 43 RBI and 14 steals, is just another mistake in a season of mistakes - on the field, in the bush leagues of suburban Sheffield, and in the front office.

    Phillips was once considered the key player in the big Bartolo Colon trade. Now Grady Sizemore is.

    The Phillips deal isn't the Rocky Colavito trade, but it is always good to see how you match up to giants.

    It is worse than the worst move of General Manager Mark Shapiro's predecessor, John Hart, which was to trade a regular with pop in his bat, Brian Giles, for a left-handed matchup reliever, Ricky Rincon. Rincon wasn't very good, but Jeff Stevens, a Class A pitcher, is what the Tribe got for Phillips.

    Manager Eric Wedge kept Phillips, a fine defensive player, in the lineup too long, although he was hitting next to nothing. Phillips was better at coming in on the ball than even Roberto Alomar, and he certainly was better than Ronnie Belliard. The latter plays the right-field rover position Carlos Baerga made popular when he couldn't get to balls in the hole any other way.

    Maybe the lack of a rebuke by the manager made Phillips think he was untouchable. He no more paid for failure to produce than anyone else had paid for lack of urgency or sense until Friday. Wedge finally gave the hook to first baseman Ben Broussard and moved Victor Martinez there from behind the plate.

    "Everybody doesn't start out like [Albert] Pujols," Phillips said. "I did rookie things and took things for granted. Then they signed Belliard and I went to the back burner."

    He also went to the batting cage. Wedge and Shapiro are a "partnership," but with Phillips they were more Rowan and Martin than Rodgers and Hammerstein. Phillips spent three weeks with the Indians last summer, taking batting practice but seldom appearing in games.

    After laughing about it, Phillips said, "I needed to work on leg kick and use my bottom half more."

    The Indians' interesting view was that he needed to learn that stuff at the major-league level, which told the staff in Buffalo they couldn't be trusted.

    "It really hurt after spring training," Phillips said, after Ramon Vazquez won the utility infielder's job. "But it made me stronger."

    The Indians believed Phillips would not have been happy as a spare part. "I wanted to play every day, but tell me what player does not," he said.

    He has made the most of his second chance. It would be no surprise if Phillips made the National League All-Star team.

    Every time Jhonny Peralta doesn't get to a ball that Omar Vizquel would have snapped up while making the glove optional, the thought occurs that Phillips could play shortstop, too.

    Belliard is in the last year of his contract and will not be around next year. Because of their own short-sightedness, the Indians have no one in waiting. "I thought it would be me," Phillips said. "I thought they would keep me for a long time."

    In the elevators at Jacobs Field, a metal plaque explains the Indians' mission of building a consistent winner in a culture of excellence. It is called "Our vision."

    But they can't make out the big "E" on an eye chart. For error.

    To reach this Plain Dealer columnist:

    blivingston@plaind.com, 216-999-4672

    Quote Originally Posted by PuffyPig View Post
    Let's face it, you mis-hit the bun with the mustard squirter, no one will really care.

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  3. #2
    Member Phhhl's Avatar
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    Re: Phillips debacle shows Tribe has a screw loose

    I didn't see any quote that Phillips wished he were still an Indian. I can't imagine anyone who should be more grateful or happy to be a Cincinnati Red.

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    Knowledge Is Good Big Klu's Avatar
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    Re: Phillips debacle shows Tribe has a screw loose

    Friends of mine who are Indians fans still swear that there was no room for Phillips in the Tribe's lineup, and that there was no way he would get playing time there.
    Eric Stratton, Rush Chairman. Damn glad to meet ya.

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    Member smith288's Avatar
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    Re: Phillips debacle shows Tribe has a screw loose

    Looking at Phillips' historic numbers, there is nothing there that seems to indicate what he is now doing with the Reds.

    I know he had a high ceiling when he was the key component to the Indians/Expos trade but im still exceedingly cautious with him though his personality and demeanor is winning me over.

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    Miami Redhawks Redhook's Avatar
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    Re: Phillips debacle shows Tribe has a screw loose

    Quote Originally Posted by smith288
    Looking at Phillips' historic numbers, there is nothing there that seems to indicate what he is now doing with the Reds.

    I know he had a high ceiling when he was the key component to the Indians/Expos trade but im still exceedingly cautious with him though his personality and demeanor is winning me over.
    His personality and demeanor have won me over too. I was very cautious about getting my hopes up about him after his blazing start. Everyone knew he'd cool down and I expected him to perform poorly offensively for the rest of the season. Boy was I wrong. After watching him rebound after his mini-cool off, I'm convinced he's a very good player and will stay that way. Great defense, great personality, and a very quick bat. I think he'll be a consistent .280+ hitter creating many problems for pitchers and defenses.

    I know his historic numbers don't match his current numbers, but that doesn't mean squat in my mind because he's so young. He's just getting into his prime and sometimes it takes awhile to learn how to be a good hitter. Something clicked with him and I don't see it going away anytime soon.
    "....the two players I liked watching the most were Barry Larkin and Eric Davis. I was suitably entertained by their effortless skill that I didn't need them crashing into walls like a squirrel on a coke binge." - dsmith421

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    Member Phhhl's Avatar
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    Re: Phillips debacle shows Tribe has a screw loose

    Well, it's not like hasn't overcome a little adversity. After his torrid start, his average did take a free fall and he was hitting under .270. Then, he got hot again. Through it all he has played stellar defense, which is probably the REAL reason the Reds went after him in the first place.

    Phillips might be the best fastball hitter on this team. If Billy Wagner can't bust a rising fastball past him, I don't know who can.

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    Re: Phillips debacle shows Tribe has a screw loose

    I hope I'm wrong but this season from BP has a Pokey Reese 1999 feel to it.

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    Miami Redhawks Redhook's Avatar
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    Re: Phillips debacle shows Tribe has a screw loose

    Quote Originally Posted by UC_Ken
    I hope I'm wrong but this season from BP has a Pokey Reese 1999 feel to it.
    Phillips has a quicker bat and more pop. Plus, he has the knack for getting timely hits.
    "....the two players I liked watching the most were Barry Larkin and Eric Davis. I was suitably entertained by their effortless skill that I didn't need them crashing into walls like a squirrel on a coke binge." - dsmith421

    www.kylevoska.com - Golfer? Check out my blog for golf tips.

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    RZ Chamber of Commerce Unassisted's Avatar
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    Re: Phillips debacle shows Tribe has a screw loose

    Quote Originally Posted by UC_Ken
    I hope I'm wrong but this season from BP has a Pokey Reese 1999 feel to it.
    Color me with the same skeptical crayon, because I've been thinking the same thing. How will the demeanor change down the road if the performance changes?

  11. #10
    Making sense of it all Matt700wlw's Avatar
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    Re: Phillips debacle shows Tribe has a screw loose

    Quote Originally Posted by Santo Alcala
    I didn't see any quote that Phillips wished he were still an Indian. I can't imagine anyone who should be more grateful or happy to be a Cincinnati Red.
    All the quotes I've seen and heard shows me he appreciates and loves the opportunity he has here in Cincinnati.

    What a trade!

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    Member paulrichjr's Avatar
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    Re: Phillips debacle shows Tribe has a screw loose

    Quote Originally Posted by Matt700wlw
    All the quotes I've seen and heard shows me he appreciates and loves the opportunity he has here in Cincinnati.

    What a trade!

    Here's hoping this trade is looked back upon like another one that was made in the early 70s for another second baseman.
    Tim McCarver: Baseball Quotes
    I remember one time going out to the mound to talk with Bob Gibson. He told me to get back behind the batter, that the only thing I knew about pitching was that it was hard to hit.

  13. #12
    Your killin' me Smalls! StillFunkyB's Avatar
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    Re: Phillips debacle shows Tribe has a screw loose

    So many poeple praised Shapiro for his rebuilding, but he hasn't done ANYTHING. What has that team done?

    I am happy that Phillips is with Cincinnati now.
    "And the fact that watching him pitch is like having someone poop on your soul." FCB on Gary Majewski

  14. #13
    Member paulrichjr's Avatar
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    Re: Phillips debacle shows Tribe has a screw loose

    Quote Originally Posted by StillFunkyB
    So many poeple praised Shapiro for his rebuilding, but he hasn't done ANYTHING. What has that team done?

    I am happy that Phillips is with Cincinnati now.
    I strongly disagree with this statement. Yes they are having a tough time this year but the future is very bright. A team with guys like Lee and Sizemore cannot be bad for long
    Tim McCarver: Baseball Quotes
    I remember one time going out to the mound to talk with Bob Gibson. He told me to get back behind the batter, that the only thing I knew about pitching was that it was hard to hit.

  15. #14
    Unsolicited Opinions traderumor's Avatar
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    Re: Phillips debacle shows Tribe has a screw loose

    Quote Originally Posted by UC_Ken
    I hope I'm wrong but this season from BP has a Pokey Reese 1999 feel to it.
    Pokey Reese didn't hit in the minors. At 23, he OPSd .591 at AAA :
    .245/.309/.363/.672

    Brandon Phillips in the minors:
    .273/.333/.415/.748
    And those numbers include a black hole in 2003. His last two runs in AAA were .769 and .735 in 2004 and 2005 respectively. There is every indication that while Phillips is probably a bit over expectations at the plate thus far in a Reds uniform, he has been showing signs of being an above average performer at the plate and plays good D. I think he will be more than a flash.
    Can't win with 'em

    Can't win without 'em

  16. #15
    "So Fla Red"
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    Re: Phillips debacle shows Tribe has a screw loose

    The worst thing for the Tribe is that the two AL Central bigger market sleeping giants(White Sox & Tigers) have emerged and look to be very good for a number of years. They are 16 games back of the WC in late June...

    I have the same fear for the Reds and the NL Cental if the Cubs ever got their act together (or were sold by the Tribune Co to someone who actually cared about winning)

    Remember, the Indians had the highest divisional payroll discrepency in baseball in the late 90s. And until the latest Reds ownership change they also had their intrastate rival inexplicablly cede gobs of its former territory and fanbase in Central/Northern Ohio to the Tribe bandwagon.

    BP -- What an absolute gift for the Reds
    Last edited by oregonred; 06-26-2006 at 12:41 AM.


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