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Thread: Time to gut this team like a fish. Sale, Sale, Sale

  1. #31
    Box of Frogs edabbs44's Avatar
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    Re: Time to gut this team like a fish. Sale, Sale, Sale

    Quote Originally Posted by IrishDavidKY
    While I don't think it's at all time to back up the truck, I do think if we start to loose steam in the 2nd half unloading veterans that won't be back next year is a no brainer. However, I think out of the group listed above I would be only willing to give up on: Aurilia, Mercker, Weathers, LaRue, Yan and Milton.

    Even by moving these guys your not going to get very much in return low to mid-range minor leaguers.
    Lose steam in the second half? This team currently has zero steam.

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  3. #32
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    Re: Time to gut this team like a fish. Sale, Sale, Sale

    Quote Originally Posted by kyred14
    Even though you're patentely wrong about Dunn, (no need to get into that) why would you want get rid of Arroyo. We have him locked up on the cheap for two more years. Lopez needs to be traded while he still has value. I would also look to trade Freel.
    Arroyo will net the most in trade for that reason.

  4. #33
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    Re: Time to gut this team like a fish. Sale, Sale, Sale

    Quote Originally Posted by westofyou
    Trade everyone and bring up the Midland Redskins.
    I'm originally from Ohio, but graduated from High School in Farmington, NM where the Connie Mack World Series is held every year. I have seen plenty of the Midland Redskins teams (yes even the one that had Ken Griffey Jr.) I say amen to that.

  5. #34
    Moderator Tommyjohn25's Avatar
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    Re: Time to gut this team like a fish. Sale, Sale, Sale

    Quote Originally Posted by dabvu2498
    Isn't that what we're all really thinking around here anyways?

    Count me out of this statement. Baseball is irreplaceable, no matter what the Reds record is. Which, by the way is a game over .500 at the break in case the majority here didn't notice.
    Benzinger backing and calling! And the 1990 world championship series belongs to the Cincinnati Reds!

  6. #35
    Yay! dabvu2498's Avatar
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    Re: Time to gut this team like a fish. Sale, Sale, Sale

    Quote Originally Posted by Tommyjohn25
    Count me out of this statement. Baseball is irreplaceable, no matter what the Reds record is. Which, by the way is a game over .500 at the break in case the majority here didn't notice.
    And what was it at the break in 2004???
    When all is said and done more is said than done.

  7. #36
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    Re: Time to gut this team like a fish. Sale, Sale, Sale

    I know that it has been hard to watch this team lately but this team is only a game and a half out of the wildcard. Baseball is a funny game and anything can happen. The reds have been an up and down team this year. All it would take is one good week to put the reds back in front of the wildcard and possibly the division.

  8. #37
    Yay! dabvu2498's Avatar
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    Re: Time to gut this team like a fish. Sale, Sale, Sale

    Quote Originally Posted by James B.
    All it would take is one good week to put the reds back in front of the wildcard and possibly the division.
    But it's going to take 3 good months to actually win either of those.
    When all is said and done more is said than done.

  9. #38
    Moderator Tommyjohn25's Avatar
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    Re: Time to gut this team like a fish. Sale, Sale, Sale

    Quote Originally Posted by dabvu2498
    And what was it at the break in 2004???

    47-41. Doesn't matter, first of all that wasn't my point. My main point is there will never be a day when I will be using baseball as a stopgap for football, as you said "everyone" here is. Though I think you said it kind of tongue in cheek. If you want to talk about the record in 2004, well...this isn't 2004, this is a different team with a different front office in a MUCH weaker division. It just seems that this board is acting as if they're 20 games out, if everyone is so sure that they aren't going to succeed, don't watch. Just go get in line way in advance for Bengals tickets.
    Benzinger backing and calling! And the 1990 world championship series belongs to the Cincinnati Reds!

  10. #39
    breath westofyou's Avatar
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    Re: Time to gut this team like a fish. Sale, Sale, Sale

    My main point is there will never be a day when I will be using baseball as a stopgap for football
    The other sports are just sports. Baseball is a love.
    - Bryant Gumbel

  11. #40
    I thought you'd be bigger OldXOhio's Avatar
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    Re: Time to gut this team like a fish. Sale, Sale, Sale

    Quote Originally Posted by westofyou
    The other sports are just sports. Baseball is a love.
    - Bryant Gumbel
    Great quote. I just wish the author were different.
    Originally Posted by nate
    Chapman can be downright pornographic at times.

  12. #41
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    Re: Time to gut this team like a fish. Sale, Sale, Sale

    Fellas, we are not out of this by any means, we are still in the hunt for the playoffs, unlike the AL the NL has only 1 team out in front and lucky for us there not in our division(NYM). We have to play within our boundaries, and by that I mean what is our long-term vision. I think that is what's going to put us on top for years to come. The playoffs are great this year, but I want them every year, and if we have to give up guys like BAiley and Votto then I say no to any major deals. Now on the other hand what if these came along:

    1)Chicago White Sox- trade Brian Anderson(CF) and Sean Tracey(SP) for Ken Griffey.

    2)San Francisco-trade Kevin Correja(RP) for Scott Hatteberg

    3)Chicago Cubs-trade Ronny Cedeno(SS) Will Ohman(RP) and Michael Wuertz(RP) for Felipe Lopez

    we simply must look at all avenues, if it helps us build for next year.

  13. #42
    Worst Behavior. reds44's Avatar
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    Re: Time to gut this team like a fish. Sale, Sale, Sale

    Quote Originally Posted by schroomytunes
    Fellas, we are not out of this by any means, we are still in the hunt for the playoffs, unlike the AL the NL has only 1 team out in front and lucky for us there not in our division(NYM). We have to play within our boundaries, and by that I mean what is our long-term vision. I think that is what's going to put us on top for years to come. The playoffs are great this year, but I want them every year, and if we have to give up guys like BAiley and Votto then I say no to any major deals. Now on the other hand what if these came along:

    1)Chicago White Sox- trade Brian Anderson(CF) and Sean Tracey(SP) for Ken Griffey.

    2)San Francisco-trade Kevin Correja(RP) for Scott Hatteberg

    3)Chicago Cubs-trade Ronny Cedeno(SS) Will Ohman(RP) and Michael Wuertz(RP) for Felipe Lopez

    we simply must look at all avenues, if it helps us build for next year.
    1) Even though Anderson can't hit at all, if you don't have to pay for Junior's salary I would do it.

    2) I don't know about Correja so I can't coment.

    3) Cedeno has a terrible OBP and OPS, and isn't a great fielder. We have William Bergolla in AAA and they are similar players. IMO you could get more for FeLo.
    Quote Originally Posted by PuffyPig View Post
    Let's face it, you mis-hit the bun with the mustard squirter, no one will really care.

  14. #43
    Where's my chair? REDREAD's Avatar
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    Re: Time to gut this team like a fish. Sale, Sale, Sale

    Quote Originally Posted by LoganBuck
    Why would you trade Dunn or Arroyo whom the Reds control for two more years each? I doubt either of them bring enough back to justify their departure, and Arroyo is a low cost pitcher, If he was .500 with a decent IP total he would be worth his contract.
    Yes Arroyo is definitely a keeper. He may not be a #1, but he's exactly what the Reds need -- a guy locked into an affordable contract that gives innings and quality starts. I really doubt Arroyo's value has skyrocketed that much since the Reds got him.

    IMO, it's crazy to have a firesale now. We have two good starting pitchers and a good offense. We need help on defense and bullpen, but that can be fixed in the offseason.

    Since our farm is bare, it makes more sense to try to win now. If the farm system was loaded with talent (like the Marlins was), it's easier to swallow dumping the ML team because you can bring up talented replacements. Let's keep the core intact and hope Wayne can build the farm through the draft over the next 3-4 years. We may not make the playoffs in the Dunn-Arroyo-Harang era, but at least the team will be interesting to watch, and will sell tickets. The worst thing Cast could do now is to order a firesale. Remember, he's trying to win the fans back. If he orders Dunn, Arroyo, Lopez, and Harang traded for prospects (no matter how good those prospects are) he's going to lose a lot of goodwill and faith from the fans.
    Thank you Walt and Bob for going for it in 2010-2014!

    Nov. 13, 2007: One of the greatest days in Reds history: John Allen gets the boot!

  15. #44
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    Re: Time to gut this team like a fish. Sale, Sale, Sale

    So, if you told everyone in spring training that this team would be one game over .500 and within five games of the Cards for the NL Central and 1.5 games behind the wildcard spot, that we should be selling at the trading deadline?

    When are we going to get out of this losing mentality and start looking at the glass as half full?
    If you think small, you'll go nowhere in life.

  16. #45
    Mod Law zombie-a-go-go's Avatar
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    Re: Time to gut this team like a fish. Sale, Sale, Sale

    It would be great to sneak ionto the playoffs this year with a weak NL, but let's not fool ourselves here - come the playoffs, this team will not win a WS title. If they get there, great - but don't give up anything of value to slap a fresh coat of paint on Reds '06. There's a lot of structural work that needs to be done before this team becomes an every-year contender.

    This season has been great so far - enjoy it, but accept it for what it is. What it ain't is a championship-caliber team.
    "It's easier to give up. I'm not a very vocal player. I lead by example. I take the attitude that I've got to go out and do it. Because of who I am, I've got to give everything I've got to come back."
    -Ken Griffey Jr.


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