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Thread: Time to gut this team like a fish. Sale, Sale, Sale

  1. #46
    Harry Chiti Fan registerthis's Avatar
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    Re: Time to gut this team like a fish. Sale, Sale, Sale

    I really, REALLY don't understand any calls to trade Arroyo.

    Makes not bleepin' lick of sense to me.
    We'll burn that bridge when we get to it.

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  3. #47
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    Re: Time to gut this team like a fish. Sale, Sale, Sale

    Harry Chiti was traded for himself, in a player to be named deal, a tremendous deal for the Mets, It cleared the wat for Chris Canizzaro.

  4. #48
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    Re: Time to gut this team like a fish. Sale, Sale, Sale

    Quote Originally Posted by redsupport
    Harry Chiti was traded for himself, in a player to be named deal, a tremendous deal for the Mets, It cleared the wat for Chris Canizzaro.
    Indeed he was. Harry Chiti is my hero.
    We'll burn that bridge when we get to it.

  5. #49
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    Re: Time to gut this team like a fish. Sale, Sale, Sale

    what about Cliff Cook the redoubtable, third baseman the Mets purloined from the Reds in the unforgettable expansion draft of 1962, he needs your support

  6. #50
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    Re: Time to gut this team like a fish. Sale, Sale, Sale

    Quote Originally Posted by redsupport
    what about Cliff Cook the redoubtable, third baseman the Mets purloined from the Reds in the unforgettable expansion draft of 1962, he needs your support
    The Reds traded Cook for the infamous Mr Potato Head Don Zimmer.

    They lost these guys in the draft.

    Pick by NY N Gus Bell.
    Pick by NY N Elio Chacon.
    Pick by HOU N Dick Gernert.
    Pick by NY N Jay Hook.
    Pick by HOU N Ken Johnson.
    Pick by NY N Sherman Jones.

  7. #51
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    Re: Time to gut this team like a fish. Sale, Sale, Sale

    Sherman "Roadblock" Jones
    Jay Hook, electrical engineering student at Northwestern, won the Mets first game I think 9-1 over Pirates
    Dick Gernert, key pinch hitter in the Reds 1961 season
    Ken Johnson, pitched a no hitter against reds and lost on a Nellie Fox error to Joe Nuxhall while pitching for Colt 45's
    Elio Chacon what a sad loss for the 1961 hero of game two
    Gus Bell no comment, he was too good for any satiric response

  8. #52
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    Re: Time to gut this team like a fish. Sale, Sale, Sale

    Quote Originally Posted by zombie-a-go-go
    It would be great to sneak ionto the playoffs this year with a weak NL, but let's not fool ourselves here - come the playoffs, this team will not win a WS title. If they get there, great - but don't give up anything of value to slap a fresh coat of paint on Reds '06. There's a lot of structural work that needs to be done before this team becomes an every-year contender.

    This season has been great so far - enjoy it, but accept it for what it is. What it ain't is a championship-caliber team.
    My thoughts exactly. I've really enjoyed the way the Reds have overachieved thusfar but lets face it this team has way too many holes to be a serious contender. With so many teams in playoff contention I'd think this would be a great opportunity to sell off some of our spare parts for more than they'd normally be worth. By the same token this might be a great time to try to move Griffey, he has been relatively healthy and productive this season and with so many teams in contention I'd think there might be a couple teams willing to take a chance on him. I may be in the minority but I'd be willing to concede this season if I was able to put the pieces in place for the club to become perennial contenders a couple years down the road.

  9. #53
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    Re: Time to gut this team like a fish. Sale, Sale, Sale

    Quote Originally Posted by nmculbreth
    My thoughts exactly. I've really enjoyed the way the Reds have overachieved thusfar but lets face it this team has way too many holes to be a serious contender. With so many teams in playoff contention I'd think this would be a great opportunity to sell off some of our spare parts for more than they'd normally be worth. By the same token this might be a great time to try to move Griffey, he has been relatively healthy and productive this season and with so many teams in contention I'd think there might be a couple teams willing to take a chance on him. I may be in the minority but I'd be willing to concede this season if I was able to put the pieces in place for the club to become perennial contenders a couple years down the road.
    I certainly argree with you. I am sick of overacheiving then trying to put pieces here and there then failing miserably the next year or two. I'd much rather have a plan for the future then spend some money based on necessity for this season, which I feel has been a sheet pulled over the eyes of many. Some of you were probably taken in april while others were taken in during June(winning streak). Sadly, Bob Castellini or whoever was in his ear jumped the gun on Narron too. I just don't think Jerry is the answer. Remember, he is Dan O Briens guy.

    However, if the Reds will finally go to a youth movement. And I don't even really care if they lose 100 games next year. I think we will see a difference in 3 years. I'm talking BIG difference. I'm not saying trade away our bigger name offensive powers. But I am saying let this baby tank for a few years and see what happens. The jury is still out on Detroit but their proving my point so far this season. We have the owner and GM in place. The rest is just putting trust in them to do whatever needs to be done.

  10. #54
    The Lineups stink. KronoRed's Avatar
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    Re: Time to gut this team like a fish. Sale, Sale, Sale

    Quote Originally Posted by zombie-a-go-go
    It would be great to sneak ionto the playoffs this year with a weak NL, but let's not fool ourselves here - come the playoffs, this team will not win a WS title. If they get there, great - but don't give up anything of value to slap a fresh coat of paint on Reds '06. There's a lot of structural work that needs to be done before this team becomes an every-year contender.

    This season has been great so far - enjoy it, but accept it for what it is. What it ain't is a championship-caliber team.
    Agreed.

    IMO the goal is to win the series, .500, 90 wins, ext..not important, the goal is to raise a banner.
    Go Gators!

  11. #55
    Where's my chair? REDREAD's Avatar
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    Re: Time to gut this team like a fish. Sale, Sale, Sale

    Quote Originally Posted by zombie-a-go-go
    It would be great to sneak ionto the playoffs this year with a weak NL, but let's not fool ourselves here - come the playoffs, this team will not win a WS title. .
    That's true. This team would not win the world series. Still, the 1999 season helped rejuvinate the franchise. It would be nice, even if the team finished close to the wild card after all these years of mediocrity. Might even help attract some bullpen FAs in the offseason. This team has to change it's loser image to attract fans and FAs.
    Thank you Walt and Bob for going for it in 2010-2014!

    Nov. 13, 2007: One of the greatest days in Reds history: John Allen gets the boot!

  12. #56
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    Re: Time to gut this team like a fish. Sale, Sale, Sale

    Where did all the optimistic views go? I see that if the bullpen doesn't get changed drastically then we will have dark times ahead, but that doesn't have to stop us from being optimistic about a team that we all love!
    Let's make some noise!

  13. #57
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    Re: Time to gut this team like a fish. Sale, Sale, Sale

    Quote Originally Posted by REDREAD
    That's true. This team would not win the world series. Still, the 1999 season helped rejuvinate the franchise. It would be nice, even if the team finished close to the wild card after all these years of mediocrity. Might even help attract some bullpen FAs in the offseason. This team has to change it's loser image to attract fans and FAs.
    As great as the 1999 season was I think it serves as a cautionary tale as well. After coming so close to making the playoffs the Reds management misjudged where they were at as an organization and the moves they made afterward have hindered the Reds abiliity to compete for the rest of this decade. Who knows where the organization would be if management had decided to stick to their previous timetable but I don't think it's unfounded to say we would probably be in a better situation had we not decided to trade for Griffey or re-sign Larkin for more than the franchise could afford.

    I hope that this management group does a better job with evaluating where the club stands and opts to make moves which allow for the team to be perennial contenders and not another one year wonder.

  14. #58
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    Re: Time to gut this team like a fish. Sale, Sale, Sale

    Food for thought. The Reds have 13 blown saves this year. Now assume that the Reds had a good bullpen and take away half of those blown saves and assume that the Reds would have 7 more wins. Do you know what you have? A team who would be one game behind the Mets for the best record in the NL.

  15. #59
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    Re: Time to gut this team like a fish. Sale, Sale, Sale

    Quote Originally Posted by nmculbreth
    As great as the 1999 season was I think it serves as a cautionary tale as well. After coming so close to making the playoffs the Reds management misjudged where they were at as an organization and the moves they made afterward have hindered the Reds abiliity to compete for the rest of this decade. Who knows where the organization would be if management had decided to stick to their previous timetable but I don't think it's unfounded to say we would probably be in a better situation had we not decided to trade for Griffey or re-sign Larkin for more than the franchise could afford.

    I hope that this management group does a better job with evaluating where the club stands and opts to make moves which allow for the team to be perennial contenders and not another one year wonder.
    I for one look back on 99 season as bad thing too. I see another one happening right before our eyes. Perhaps, at the worst of times too. Though I do trust Wayne over Bowden. I think even Wayne would overspend on another 2000 team but I dont think at the lengths Bowden did. But then again, what if Griffey was healthy for those seasons and produced numbers coeherent with his All Century Team numbers? I would bet they would have been better but not WS caliber.

    I agree with many who have said WS or bust. I dont think anyone is optimistic enough to say this team is anywhere near such a level. They might slip into the WC because of the lack of great teams in the NL, the West always beating up on themselves, and no real clear cut team besides the Mets in the East. Not to mention they could easily tank the second half of the season with a pitching injury here or there. So it is possible for the playoffs this year espcially if the bullpen improves. WHICH IT WILL, I mean could it get any worse? YES I know. but I wouldnt bet on it.

    One question to push this thread maybe a bit further. Dunn and Kearns have shared the spotlight so to speak as the young should be in the future All Stars on this team for quite sometime. Are you willing to part with them for whatever we need? Or are you more willing to leave them as centerpieces and trade more blue chips like Bailey, Edwin, Deno, Votto, or Bruce who are unproven in the bigs?

  16. #60
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    Re: Time to gut this team like a fish. Sale, Sale, Sale

    wouldn't it be nice to have a playoff-capable Reds team OVER ACHIEVE into the World Series?

    Instead it is always the sub-par Reds with the small-market payroll, always OVER ACHIEVING to .500 ball.

    Where are you BIG RED MACHINE?!?!?
    Answer: Sucked up into the vacuum that is a "capless MLB."


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