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View Poll Results: Buy or sell?

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  • Buy, even if the Reds aren't that good, no else is either

    58 29.44%
  • Sell, baby, sell, the slide has started and it's not going to stop

    30 15.23%
  • Buy/sell, sell vets and prospects to acquire young guys who can help in 2006 and beyond

    109 55.33%
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Thread: Time to make the call: Are the Reds buyers or sellers

  1. #31
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    Re: Time to make the call: Are the Reds buyers or sellers

    I would like to see them sell (in some cases give away) about 15 players on the roster. They have way to many guys on the the wrong side of 30 that were never really that good.

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  3. #32
    He has the Evil Eye! flyer85's Avatar
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    Re: Time to make the call: Are the Reds buyers or sellers

    Quote Originally Posted by Falls City Beer
    I think where the armchair GMs get tangled up is in the singleminded dream of acquiring young, on-the-cusp-of-superstardom pitching talent; going for that strictly limits SO many opportunities.
    the goal should be identifying talent that the Reds have identified as undervalued. Otherwise you'll end up paying to high a price for what you receive. I agree with FCB that a really good GM could move some pieces off the major league roster and strengthen the team in both the short term and long term. The problem with doing it in season is finding a dance partner who needs what you have to trade and has assets to send back that they undervalue.
    What are you, people? On dope? - Mr Hand

  4. #33
    Posting in Dynarama M2's Avatar
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    Re: Time to make the call: Are the Reds buyers or sellers

    Quote Originally Posted by flyer85
    it could only work if you can identify undervalued/underutilized talent. Try getting players that seemed to have fallen out of favor with their current franchise. Players like Davis(cleveland), Floyd(Philly), Wuertz(Chicago), etc.
    I like the basic idea, though Gavin Floyd has fallen out of favor with his current franchise for all the right reasons.

    Davis might be worth a flyer (dig me with the puns). Wuertz strikes me as the most interesting guy on that list.
    Baseball isn't a magic trick ... it doesn't get spoiled if you figure out how it works. - gonelong

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  5. #34
    Member wally post's Avatar
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    Re: Time to make the call: Are the Reds buyers or sellers

    I'm amazed personally to see talk of trading Arroyo because he is obviously a useful cat - yet I believe we should be sellers. We could NEVER win a World Series with whatever we can trade right now and not hurt our current team. We would only be in the game with our weak ante and get knocked out quickly. I am concerned that we would give away too much of the so-called "future"! So I say, let's sell and be bold -

    I mean, this works for the marlins...(out of necessity in their case - yet...) We aren't there and can't get there this year, so let's hope the front office is calculating about our future over the next two years - and give up the right tools to put it ALL together! (I'm hoping for a Tommy Helms/Cesar Geronimo/joe Morgan/Lee May kinda trade here!

    honest.

    I'm open to losing Felipe - Dunn - Kearns - almost anyone... It would be a shock and I won't like it - but... p l e a s e ...????

  6. #35
    Member redsrule2500's Avatar
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    Re: Time to make the call: Are the Reds buyers or sellers

    Arroyo kinda sucks now.
    redsrule2500
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  7. #36
    Member wally post's Avatar
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    Re: Time to make the call: Are the Reds buyers or sellers

    Quote Originally Posted by redsrule2500
    Arroyo kinda sucks now.

    yeah - maybe you are right - I'm not qualified - but it figures given his record. Let's sell high and buy low, right??

    if he (along with an appropriately chosen hitter) got us a more serious ichiban (#1) pitcher?..... YEAH!

    I love redszone - it chills me out.

  8. #37
    Pitching is the thing WVRedsFan's Avatar
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    Re: Time to make the call: Are the Reds buyers or sellers

    Buy. With one caveat. Make it promising young players. No more Castros. Please. Buy arems that can hold a lead. Buy players than do more than field.

    I listened to Jerry Narron on the pre-game show and all he talked about were fielders "who could take the pressure off our pitching so it would be better." Uh...Jerry, the pitching's so bad that fielding won't help much. Your ace took the Reds out of the game by the 4th inning today. Seriously, Narron wants to make this team a fielding giant and a wimpy hitting team. I expect a big trade at the deadline giving someone Dunn, Griffey, and Lopez for three Castro clones or two disgruntled over-the-hill pitchers. Then he can put Castro, Freel, and (good defensive outfielder of your choice) in the lineup to watch the balls fly over the fence. Krivsky traded for a closer and hasn't had a closing situation since. Ironic, isn't it?

    I'm sorry to be so negative, but the management of this team is so poor, we could trade for the top 4 starters in the majors and still lose three of them with the bonehead decisions.

    and if you read my signature below, that was before I learned that Wayne wants to make the team Jerry's non-kids. I would like to think he knows what he's doing, but day after day I have my doubts.
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  9. #38
    The Lineups stink. KronoRed's Avatar
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    Re: Time to make the call: Are the Reds buyers or sellers

    A trade of Arroyo would tick off a lot of fans, but he's hot (well he was)..his career numbers say he probably won't stay this hot, and if a desperate team came calling offering some near ready pitching prospects it would be IMO foolish to say no.
    Go Gators!

  10. #39
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    Re: Time to make the call: Are the Reds buyers or sellers

    why do I have a feeling that nothing will happen?
    "My mission is to be the ray of hope, the guy who stands out there on that beautiful field and owns up to his mistakes and lets people know it's never completely hopeless, no matter how bad it seems at the time. I have a platform and a message, and now I go to bed at night, sober and happy, praying I can be a good messenger." -Josh Hamilton

  11. #40
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    Re: Time to make the call: Are the Reds buyers or sellers

    Reds have shown that they will buy, so all talk is moot (shrug).

    in general, I'd say that the team needs to sell, but since this is the most talent that the Reds will have for a while, and since there's enough of a race to tickle the fans, buying doesn't bother me.

    Another consideration is whether it's a buyers' or sellers' market. It'll take a few moves before one can judge, but the Guardado trade suggests that it's a market for buyers. So altogether, buying makes sense.

    A complication will be that the Reds will announce that Bailey/Bruce are unavailable, yet some trade partners will hold out for one of the two. This will limit things for the Reds

  12. #41
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    Re: Time to make the call: Are the Reds buyers or sellers

    Buy. Buy arms, 2 good starting arms and 1 middle relief arm. If we must, we let one good offensive player go to balance some of the cash flow. Our losses are built around mediocre pitching. A few good wins and everyone's spirits pick up. When everyone's spirits pick up confidence builds and the team picks it up a notch, that makes a huge difference. If the team can get back into a tug of war for first place then the fans start filling up the seats and money helps cover some of the price of the new pitching. We aren't looking at a World Series Team here, but we can have a division level team. Then in the off season some holes can be plugged we have something to build on. For the last 7 years all we've done is let down the hopes of new and old fans with false promises and all star break sales events, lets leave that to GM. It's never been a secret that the Reds needed a few really good starting pitchers, we've had a decent fielding and hitting team. Buy pitchers.

  13. #42
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    Re: Time to make the call: Are the Reds buyers or sellers

    Buy. When you're within five games of the NL Central and 1.5 games back for the wildcard, you have to make a run for it......as long as you don't mortgage the farm system.

    With that said, the Reds need to add a setup man for the bullpen because word is Coffey is tipping his pitches right now and is getting lit up. Cubs' Scott Williamson and Marlins Joe Borowski would be fine acquisitions. LaTroy Hawkins is a former Twin that could end up in Cincinnati Reds.

    With Brandon Claussen looking horrible in his first rehab assignment and Joe Mays being burnt toast, it is obvious the Reds need another starter. How about RHP Jon Leiber of the Phillies or possible RHP Brad Radke of the Twins? Pirates could be offering the likes of RHPs Kip Wells, Roberto Hernandez and LHP Damos Marte. LHP Mark Redman of the Royals might make a suitable fifth starter for the Reds.

    Just a few ideas to throw out but I think you have to make a run for a playoff spot.
    If you think small, you'll go nowhere in life.

  14. #43
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    Re: Time to make the call: Are the Reds buyers or sellers

    Quote Originally Posted by Krusty
    Buy. When you're within five games of the NL Central and 1.5 games back for the wildcard, you have to make a run for it......as long as you don't mortgage the farm system.

    With that said, the Reds need to add a setup man for the bullpen because word is Coffey is tipping his pitches right now and is getting lit up. Cubs' Scott Williamson and Marlins Joe Borowski would be fine acquisitions. LaTroy Hawkins is a former Twin that could end up in Cincinnati Reds.

    With Brandon Claussen looking horrible in his first rehab assignment and Joe Mays being burnt toast, it is obvious the Reds need another starter. How about RHP Jon Leiber of the Phillies or possible RHP Brad Radke of the Twins? Pirates could be offering the likes of RHPs Kip Wells, Roberto Hernandez and LHP Damos Marte. LHP Mark Redman of the Royals might make a suitable fifth starter for the Reds.

    Just a few ideas to throw out but I think you have to make a run for a playoff spot.
    Wouldn't Radke have 10/5 rights?
    "My mission is to be the ray of hope, the guy who stands out there on that beautiful field and owns up to his mistakes and lets people know it's never completely hopeless, no matter how bad it seems at the time. I have a platform and a message, and now I go to bed at night, sober and happy, praying I can be a good messenger." -Josh Hamilton

  15. #44
    Member 15fan's Avatar
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    Re: Time to make the call: Are the Reds buyers or sellers

    Quote Originally Posted by M2
    I've never really bought into that line of thinking. It always struck me as another way of saying the team can only expect to win by getting extremely lucky.

    Anyway, I'm not so sure the year is picking the Reds. Yeah the league is mired in mediocrity, but the Reds still don't strike me as a team likely to take advantage of it.

    Personally I'm in favor of option #3. If the team gets a guy like Brandon McCarthy (picking a name out of a hat here), it can claim it's "going for it" while still loading up for the next two seasons, which strikes me as the time when the Reds can actually pick their year and luck be damned.
    Competing is part art, part science, and part luck.

    Compared to previous years, luck has actually been making an occasional appearance in Cincinnati this year. At the very least, Reds voodoo dolls haven't been the recipient of many pins so far in 2006. Most importantly (he said knocking on wood), the team has been relatively healthy. The bats have been thumping the ball about like we thought they should. Arroyo & Harang have been workhorses.

    I also like the idea of buying from the psychological perspective. It's been a while since the guys wearing Reds uniforms have been playing meaningful games in August. It's been a while since the folks in River City have had a reason to go to the park in August in September. I'd like to see the FO show some signs that they're willing & able to go get some help if the team can make a go of it over the first half of the season.

    With a move or two in the next couple of weeks, I don't see the Reds being that much different from, say, the Florida Marlins of 2003. That's a team that caught lightning in a bottle. The 2006 Reds actually have a couple of bottles, and there are some grey clouds above. It's time to get out in the field and do a rain dance to get the skies to open up. We've been holed up in the storm cellar for long enough.

  16. #45
    Where's my chair? REDREAD's Avatar
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    Re: Time to make the call: Are the Reds buyers or sellers

    Quote Originally Posted by 15fan
    You don't pick the year, the year picks you.

    Buy.
    Amen to that. The Cards have stumbled this year, and it's kept us in the race. We might not be so lucky again for a long time.

    Actually, what Wayne is doing right now, such as picking up guys like Guardo and Yan is nice. They are potential help (doesn't take much to upgrade our horrible pen), and costing us nothing that will hurt in the future. I think Wayne can buy without doing something crazy like sending Homer and Bruce to rent Soraino for the rest of the year.
    Thank you Walt and Bob for going for it in 2010-2014!

    Nov. 13, 2007: One of the greatest days in Reds history: John Allen gets the boot!


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