Turn Off Ads?
Page 1 of 6 12345 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 78

Thread: Jerry Narron really, really stinks, except for ONE little thing....

  1. #1
    Worth The Wait
    Join Date
    Jul 2000
    Location
    Oklahoma City
    Posts
    4,327

    Jerry Narron really, really stinks, except for ONE little thing....

    I've been around this board for a long time. Over that span, I doubt anyone would characterize me as a "homer" or an "apologist." But I am totally baffled at the level of utter disdain for Jerry Narron. Actually, I'm disgusted by it.

    I don't see things only in black and white. Just because we're leading the wild card doesn't mean the manager "must" be doing a good job. I understand sample sizes, coincidence, chance, etc....

    But I've seen enough of Narron to realize one fairly important thing:

    The Reds have been a whole lot better since he's been on board.

    If it is simply because the roster has improved, then a manager is obsolete anyway-- if a manager is only as good as his roster, then the debate should end, and we should just save money and hire a monkey to manage the team.

    I am not a huge fan of Narron's line-up construction and I wished he'd give EE some more playing time. Narron is a bit "old school" for me, but does seem to be pretty good at one thing that always gets overlooked at Redszone:

    HE'S A GOOD LEADER

    Yes, I understand things like leadership and clubhouse harmony are considered "hocus pocus" by many, but it appears to me that Narron has done an excellent job of keeping a team together that has traditionally crashed and burned by mid season for the past several years.

    I really like the way Narron has handled the bullpen since "the trade"-- he has done a great job of re-inventing Coffey and putting him in place to succeed when his confidence had to be way down.

    And there have been several times this year when I thought the Reds were absolute toast. Done. I had NO faith. Yet, the team has clawed back each time and suddenly, we're not only leading the WC, but slowly creating breathing room.

    The mediocrity (or worse) of the NL certainly helps, however, this is simply a team with a different "feel" or culture since Narron has been on the bench.

    I think Narron does and excellent job of handling the 25 guys on the roster all at once. And you know what? For as much as he gets ripped for playing RA so often and at clean-up, the guy has been pretty darn productive for us-- and he's come through in some big spots. As fans, we can be concerned with the longterm, but Narron's job is to win NOW. I wouldn't write-up the same line-ups he does on a daily basis, but I really don't have a problem with them either.

    It's almost August and I'm pumped about Reds baseball. I think I'll hold off on my complaints for now.

  2. Turn Off Ads?
  3. #2
    Hey Cubs Fans RFS62's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2000
    Location
    New York
    Posts
    16,601

    Re: Jerry Narron really, really stinks, except for ONE little thing....

    Edskin. Voice of reason.

    This has been one crazy year.


    "Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover."
    ~ Mark Twain

  4. #3
    Glenn Braggs
    Join Date
    Apr 2000
    Location
    Cologne, Germany
    Posts
    1,376

    Re: Jerry Narron really, really stinks, except for ONE little thing....

    That's the reason I don't visit here regulary anymore.

    Why did they trade for Arroyo?
    Aurilla sucks
    The Phillips pick up sucked
    Narron sucks
    Hysterical reactions about trade rumors
    Not to mention some insane statements about Dunn

    Controversial discussions are great, but it seems that halfway intelligent discussions have become a mental challenge for some here.

    It has come to a point, where I personally enjoy a so far great season more without reading posts that seem to belittle or critizice every single move that is made. Sometimes I don't even have the impression to be among Reds fans anymore, with so much disdain spread at players (from Castro to Dunn)

    The Reds are currently on pace to finish 15 games improved compared to last season (currently 87 wins projected).

    They have a very good chance to claim the wild card (or even division title) and make the playoffs.

    After 5 losing seasons in a row, this is the first time that the team will likely finsih above .500 again.

    Boy, what a different turn this organization has taken compared for example to the Pirates.

    To each his own; I just think it hasn't been so much fun watching the Reds for a long time.

  5. #4
    Member paulrichjr's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    Savannah, TN
    Posts
    2,897

    Re: Jerry Narron really, really stinks, except for ONE little thing....

    I agree 110%. Narron deserves some credit for turning this thing around. Maybe Lou could have gotten us an extra couple of wins but Narron is a good manager who makes mistakes sometimes (leaving Milton in too long) but often makes decisions that lead to a win...
    Tim McCarver: Baseball Quotes
    I remember one time going out to the mound to talk with Bob Gibson. He told me to get back behind the batter, that the only thing I knew about pitching was that it was hard to hit.

  6. #5
    Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Posts
    4,472

    Re: Jerry Narron really, really stinks, except for ONE little thing....

    People like to scapegoat and jump on the bandwagon around here. Not a lot of imagination.

  7. #6
    2009: Fail Ltlabner's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    Cincinnati
    Posts
    7,441

    Re: Jerry Narron really, really stinks, except for ONE little thing....

    Edskin,

    Fantastic post.

    People say, are you happy being only a little over .500 (meaning that another manager would absolutley have us WAY over .500). I say YES. Were we "a little over .500" 4 days from August in 2005? Were we talking about the possibilities of being in the race till the end any other time this century? Has ownership and Kriv made serrious inroads on the damage to the orginiziation inflicated by Schott, Linder, Bowden, Allen, Obrian, et al?

    As of this point in the year, we are LIGHTYEARS ahead of where we were last year. That doesn't grant blanket amunity to BC/Kriv/Narron but some people seem to have a hard time giving any credit to the Reds. I've noticed a trend where some posters only grant credit to the other team. The reds didn't make a good play, the opposing batter just didn't hit the ball well. The reds pitcher didn't pitch well, the opposing team has a crappy offense. The Reds aren't in the WC hunt, all the other NL teams are horrible. It's a move to minimize anything positive on the Reds part and I just don't understand it.

    Of course Narron does wacky things and makes mistakes. People should criticise his mistakes, so don't post a reply that says I want everyone to agree, don't want debate or drink the kool-aide. Of course the Reds have weaknesses and not everybody is going to argee on every move. But I just can't understand this refusal to admit anything good about Narron, and in some cases, the Reds as a whole. Why is beating a certian subject or player to death not acceptable, unless it's Narron?
    Last edited by Ltlabner; 07-29-2006 at 10:03 PM.
    a super volcano of ridonkulous suckitude.

    I simply don't have access to a "cares about RBI" place in my psyche. There is a "mildly curious about OBI%" alcove just before the acid filled lake guarded by robot snipers with lasers which leads to the "cares about RBI" antechamber though. - Nate

  8. #7
    Member Marc D's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    Philadelphia, PA
    Posts
    2,776

    Re: Jerry Narron really, really stinks, except for ONE little thing....

    It really comes down to how much credit you want to give Narron for the improved pitching. Thats the difference between this club and the ones we have seen the past few years imo. The lineups and bullpen usage are all vintage Boone and Miley. Give either one of them this years version of Arroyo, Harang and EZ and I'm sure they could fumble their way to .500ish ball.

    Does that mean I'm not happy that we're having a good year for once? Nope. Make me not a "real" fan? Laughable, but someone will say it.

    It just means I think this team wins in spite of Narron, not because of him. Personally I could care less how many fellow RedZoners that disgusts or how little imagination it shows.

  9. #8
    2009: Fail Ltlabner's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    Cincinnati
    Posts
    7,441

    Re: Jerry Narron really, really stinks, except for ONE little thing....

    Does that mean I'm not happy that we're having a good year for once? Nope. Make me not a "real" fan? Laughable, but someone will say it.
    Marc, I don't agree with your assessment, but I do agree that it is silly for people to question anybodies "fan-ness". I assume all here are 100% reds fans. Other wise they are trolls or people who revel in being miserable - either way they are pretty sad.

    But I don't doubt you or others fan-ness in any way.
    a super volcano of ridonkulous suckitude.

    I simply don't have access to a "cares about RBI" place in my psyche. There is a "mildly curious about OBI%" alcove just before the acid filled lake guarded by robot snipers with lasers which leads to the "cares about RBI" antechamber though. - Nate

  10. #9
    Redsmetz redsmetz's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Winton Place
    Posts
    11,181

    Re: Jerry Narron really, really stinks, except for ONE little thing....

    Last night when we were in Milwaukee, we got there early enough that the Reds were still taking batting practice. We were standing behind the dugout and some of the players would come in and we'd say something to some of them.

    A few examples. Clayton's coming in, it's not his fault he got traded here, but I'm a fan and I want whoever is on the Reds to succeed (whether "career norms" say they will or not). "Hey, Royce, welcome to the Reds!" He looks up and says "Thanks".

    Juan Castro and Javy Valentin are coming in and I'm actually please to have Juan back, I've always enjoyed him as a player. I know some disagree, but that's me. "Juan, glad to have you back!". "It's good to be back". Javy's jogging behind him and I added, "And, Javy, we're always glad to have you here." He laughed at that one.

    Finally, Narron is walking by and we say hi and he nods. "You're doing a good job, Jer." He stops, turns, and says, "Thanks"

    I know none of these folks are popular with some of the Zone's denizens, but they're with the Reds, I want to cheer them on, encourage them. Let's win some games and make the post-season.

  11. #10
    Member redsrule2500's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2001
    Location
    Cincinnati, OH
    Posts
    3,215

    Re: Jerry Narron really, really stinks, except for ONE little thing....

    Narron can manage, because he has beaten expectations and is in a playoff race. Everyone complains about lineups, not playing certain people, taking out pitchers - but the the bottom line is he is winning.
    redsrule2500
    Go Reds!
    Baseball Bliss
    Im a normal guy blessed with the ability to hit a baseball. - Sean Casey

  12. #11
    Member Marc D's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    Philadelphia, PA
    Posts
    2,776

    Re: Jerry Narron really, really stinks, except for ONE little thing....

    Quote Originally Posted by redsrule2500
    Narron can manage, because he has beaten expectations and is in a playoff race. Everyone complains about lineups, not playing certain people, taking out pitchers - but the the bottom line is he is winning.
    Dusty Baker took the Giants to the WS in 2002. In 2006 he's sitting at the bottom of one of the weakest divisions in all baseball. If, as you suggest, a manager is judged on wins and losses alone, how do you reconcile that? Is Dusty good or bad?

  13. #12
    Will post for food BuckeyeRedleg's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2001
    Location
    Dublin, OH
    Posts
    5,350

    Re: Jerry Narron really, really stinks, except for ONE little thing....

    Quote Originally Posted by Marc D
    It really comes down to how much credit you want to give Narron for the improved pitching. Thats the difference between this club and the ones we have seen the past few years imo. The lineups and bullpen usage are all vintage Boone and Miley. Give either one of them this years version of Arroyo, Harang and EZ and I'm sure they could fumble their way to .500ish ball.

    Does that mean I'm not happy that we're having a good year for once? Nope. Make me not a "real" fan? Laughable, but someone will say it.

    It just means I think this team wins in spite of Narron, not because of him. Personally I could care less how many fellow RedZoners that disgusts or how little imagination it shows.
    Nailed it.

  14. #13
    Churlish Johnny Footstool's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2001
    Location
    Olathe, KS
    Posts
    13,792

    Re: Jerry Narron really, really stinks, except for ONE little thing....

    Quote Originally Posted by redsrule2500
    Narron can manage, because he has beaten expectations and is in a playoff race. Everyone complains about lineups, not playing certain people, taking out pitchers - but the the bottom line is he is winning.
    The TEAM is winning, not Narron.

    Funny how the manager gets so much credit for the team's performance, good or bad.
    "I prefer books and movies where the conflict isn't of the extreme cannibal apocalypse variety I guess." Redsfaithful

  15. #14
    Member Cedric's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Monroe
    Posts
    6,397

    Re: Jerry Narron really, really stinks, except for ONE little thing....

    Quote Originally Posted by Johnny Footstool
    The TEAM is winning, not Narron.

    Funny how the manager gets so much credit for the team's performance, good or bad.
    Same way in every sport. Get's too much credit and blame.
    This is the time. The real Reds organization is back.

  16. #15
    Smells Like Teen Spirit jmcclain19's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    Phoenix
    Posts
    6,490

    Re: Jerry Narron really, really stinks, except for ONE little thing....

    Quote Originally Posted by Cedric
    Same way in every sport. Get's too much credit and blame.
    Absolutely agree 100%. Which is why I never understand the wrangling around Redszone over the manager. You could substitute "Jerry Narron" for "Dave Miley" and "Bob Boone" in the Redszone archives and the posts have been about the same for years now.

    I have a distinct feeling it's replicated across baseball.


Turn Off Ads?

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Board Moderators may, at their discretion and judgment, delete and/or edit any messages that violate any of the following guidelines: 1. Explicit references to alleged illegal or unlawful acts. 2. Graphic sexual descriptions. 3. Racial or ethnic slurs. 4. Use of edgy language (including masked profanity). 5. Direct personal attacks, flames, fights, trolling, baiting, name-calling, general nuisance, excessive player criticism or anything along those lines. 6. Posting spam. 7. Each person may have only one user account. It is fine to be critical here - that's what this board is for. But let's not beat a subject or a player to death, please.

Thank you, and most importantly, enjoy yourselves!


RedsZone.com is a privately owned website and is not affiliated with the Cincinnati Reds or Major League Baseball


Contact us: Boss | GIK | BCubb2003 | dabvu2498 | Gallen5862 | LexRedsFan | Plus Plus | RedlegJake | redsfan1995 | The Operator | Tommyjohn25