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Thread: GABP Changes

  1. #16
    Where's my chair? REDREAD's Avatar
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    Re: GABP Changes

    It's too late now, but I wish they had built the park to be at least a slight pitchers' park. With all the bandboxes in the league, it possibly would've given the Reds a homefield advantage to have a pitcher's park. Most of Dunn's HRs are no doubters anyhow.

    Bowden and Allen were thinking short term. They wanted to build a park to help Casey and Jr hit Hr. I always thought that plan of "loading up on LH pitchers and batters" was flawed.

    Anyhow, you build a pitcher's park and then possibly you don't have to spend as much money on premium starting pitchers. Make the OF large, get great gloves in the OF, and you have a nice advantage. I know Colorado tried that and failed, but the ball moves so fast up there when hit hard, I'm not sure that's a fair comparison.

    The other advantage of having a pitching park is that it can make mediocre pitchers look a lot better for trade. (Kind of like Washington). If the park aided pitching numbers make the pitchers too pricey, you wouldn't have that much problem trading them.
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  3. #17
    getting younger alloverjr's Avatar
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    Re: GABP Changes

    The best thing they could do to GABP is tear it down. Reminds me of Victory Field. Kinda plastic looking. But, I know this isn't the point of the thread.

    As has been mentioned there is very little that can be done without decreasing seating capacity. Although that may never be an issue on non-giveaway nights. I think the biggest change is having a guy in the GM's chair, given a full off season, trade in his fly ball pitchers for ground ball pitchers. Oh, and then find some guys who can field it when it's hit.
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  4. #18
    2009: Fail Ltlabner's Avatar
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    Re: GABP Changes

    Quote Originally Posted by REDREAD View Post
    Anyhow, you build a pitcher's park and then possibly you don't have to spend as much money on premium starting pitchers.

    The other advantage of having a pitching park is that it can make mediocre pitchers look a lot better for trade. (Kind of like Washington).
    I agree.

    Being a bandbox imposes the "hidden cost" of having to have pitchers that are all above average to survive. Of course everybody wants all superstar pitchers but every team has to make do with some medocre guys on the staff. If you have a "pitchers park" you can get away with a few more medocre guys than if you have a "hitters park".

    The other hidden cost is that it forces you to acquire only groundball type pitchers. This greatly limits the number of pitchers you could acquire or draft. If there's a weak market for pitching already, your teams market is even smaller because you need a specific type of pitcher. If you have a big "pitchers" park you can live with either type.

    Obviously the home park is 1/2 the equation but since the trend has been smaller, more home run friendly parks you have to consider the effect on your pitching staff for away games too.

    Overall, I see no need to change GABP, nor do I see it as a problem that so many homers are hit. As long as you work within the limitations & costs imposed on the pitching staff there's nothing wrong with so many balls flying out.
    Last edited by Ltlabner; 09-01-2006 at 08:22 AM.
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  5. #19
    Stat Wanker Hodiernus RedsManRick's Avatar
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    Re: GABP Changes

    3 words: Twenty foot walls.
    Games are won on run differential -- scoring more than your opponent. Runs are runs, scored or prevented they all count the same. Worry about scoring more and allowing fewer, not which positions contribute to which side of the equation or how "consistent" you are at your current level of performance.

  6. #20
    Member RedsFan75's Avatar
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    Re: GABP Changes

    Naw, go for 40 all the way around.
    In those things which we commit to practice we can master, and with mastery we have the freedom to use these skills whenever we desire, without this practice we are slaves to our inability.

  7. #21
    Rally Onion! Chip R's Avatar
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    Re: GABP Changes

    Quote Originally Posted by REDREAD View Post
    It's too late now, but I wish they had built the park to be at least a slight pitchers' park. With all the bandboxes in the league, it possibly would've given the Reds a homefield advantage to have a pitcher's park. Most of Dunn's HRs are no doubters anyhow.

    Bowden and Allen were thinking short term. They wanted to build a park to help Casey and Jr hit Hr. I always thought that plan of "loading up on LH pitchers and batters" was flawed.
    One of the reasons they built such a small park, if you remember, is because they had limited space to work with. They had to squeeze it in there between the arena and Cinergy.

    Not only do you have to factor in how much it would cost to move the walls back in construction costs but you also have to factor in the lost seats. They are going to be gone forever and aren't coming back. Besides, it's not like these HRs are clearing the fence by 5 feet anyway. Most of the HRs hit here are legitimate shots.

    Want a solution to giving up so many HRs? Get better pitching. How many times have we seen guys like Oswalt shut the vaunted offenses the Reds have had in the past 4 years down?
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  8. #22
    Davey BuckWoody's Avatar
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    Re: GABP Changes

    Looks like I'm in the minority here but I have no problem with the batter's eye in center. I mean there has to be something there that's dark. They could have put up a big black sheet or a plywood wall but instead they put up a building that has bar in it and charge a little extra for groups to sit there....Brilliant!

    I've sat there on many nights looking at the outfield and wondering what they might be able to do about that short right field. There aren't many options. One thing that I have thought of is to get rid of the stacks in center and extend the seating all the way over to the batters eye. They could then move the fences back and raise the height of the wall and offset the loss of the first few rows of seating. I'm sure that would be big bucks though and not likely to happen.

    Another thing to bring up is the fact that the GABP is not a hitter's park. It's been brought up on here more than once that it is a neutral park since it gives up a lot of home runs but the dimensions cut down on the extra base hits. Maybe the idea here is the have pitchers that limit the number of base runners allowed so that when they do give up the inevitable tater, it's a solo shot instead of a three-run shot.

  9. #23
    Member Highlifeman21's Avatar
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    Re: GABP Changes

    Build a ballpark at Broadway Commons?

  10. #24
    breath westofyou's Avatar
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    Re: GABP Changes

    Quote Originally Posted by wheels View Post
    I think Baker Bowl had a huge wall made out of aluminum or tin.

    Where's WoY?
    Tin

    Baker Bowl, hemed in by railroad tracks, and the first steel and concrete stadium.



    The first year of LA found them facing what Alston called "The Chinese Wall"


    Alston said when he first saw the field he thought that all of Ebbetts could sit on the grass and not touch the stands.



    Crosley Field was a pure pitchers park until the 40's, and ten years later it was a hitters park all around thanks to The Goat Run the Reds often had trouble drawing when they didn't win, they had no sexy offense the 1956 season cemented in the eyes of the owners that offense sells in Cincinnati better then pitching and thus, that is where we are today.

    As in some other stadiums, the data on field dimensions at Crosley Field are a little suspect. The original field dimensions were supposedly 360 feet down both the left and right field lines, but given the latter dimensions as shown above (which were pretty much established by 1938), that would only be possible if home plate had been subsequently moved about 30 feet toward the left side, which would have left an extremely unequal foul territory. In fact, home plate WAS moved considerably more than once, in 1927 and in 1938, but this was mostly in a forward direction. These changes reduced the distance to center field from 420 feet to 387 feet, the shortest in the majors other than Ebbets Field in its last decade.
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  11. #25
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    Re: GABP Changes

    The park doesn't need to be changed.

    Does anyone think the Yankees wouldn't win 90-100 games year-in and year-out in GABP?

    The Mets, Cardinals, Dodgers, Yankees, Tigers and A's would all still be winning their divisions if they were playing in GABP.

    What we need to do is increase our number of talented players. Plain and simple. Changing the park would just change our run differential to the difference between two high numbers to the difference between two lower numbers.

  12. #26
    Member ochre's Avatar
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    Re: GABP Changes

    I'd bring in a few groundball pitchers and better infield defense before I reengineered teh ballpark.
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  13. #27
    I'm gettin paper Homer Bailey's Avatar
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    Re: GABP Changes

    The Reds are never going to be able to attract any free agent pitchers in this park. They are going to have to overpay like they did for Eric Milton, and like the Rockies did back in '01 (I think) with Mike Hampton.

    Off the top of my head, I can only think of one really good team that plays in a hitters park and that is the Yankees. Correct me if I'm wrong?

  14. #28
    So Long Uncle Joe BoydsOfSummer's Avatar
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    Re: GABP Changes

    here is an idey. Put a nice big scoreboard out in right so's Big Rik can enjoy replays and stuff from his cheap seats in the bleachers!
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  15. #29
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    Re: GABP Changes

    Quote Originally Posted by Homer Bailey View Post
    The Reds are never going to be able to attract any free agent pitchers in this park. They are going to have to overpay like they did for Eric Milton, and like the Rockies did back in '01 (I think) with Mike Hampton.

    Off the top of my head, I can only think of one really good team that plays in a hitters park and that is the Yankees. Correct me if I'm wrong?
    Red Sox have had a great run lately.

  16. #30
    Hisssssssss Yachtzee's Avatar
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    Re: GABP Changes

    The only thing I would do would be to do some sort of refacing of the batter's eye restaurant. I think it could be done relatively cheaply, much cheaper than getting rid of it, and it could be done to look more congruous with the rest of the ballpark.
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