Turn Off Ads?
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 17

Thread: Complete this trade idea..

  1. #1
    Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    34

    Complete this trade idea..

    During the upcoming offseason I would look for Baltimore to once again entertain the idea of moving Miguel Tejeda. Now, if you were Wayne Krivsky would you take that opportunity and put together a package including Adam Dunn to get Miguel Tejeda? (I for one have wanted to see Tejeda in a Reds uniform since his departure from Oakland, his intensity and love for the game would be a perfect match for Cincinnati, it has been a long time since this ballclub has had a player of that caliber.)

    The key to this deal is to not only get Tejeda but to also find a way to get Erik Bedard in this package also. What else would have to be included to snag these two?

    If the rumors were true during the July 31st deadline, the idea of Tejeda coming to Cincinnati was more than speculation. But it was at the expense of Homer Bailey and that tells us Wayne Krivsky is not looking to move him. So excluding Bailey what would it take to get this deal done?
    Last edited by Gamble; 09-15-2006 at 03:43 AM.


  2. Turn Off Ads?
  3. #2
    Member mth123's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Posts
    31,919

    Re: Complete this trade idea..

    I don't think you can get Bedard w/o including Bailey.

  4. #3
    Member
    Join Date
    May 2000
    Location
    Williamsport, PA
    Posts
    12,714

    Re: Complete this trade idea..

    Rumor is Tejeda is better at third defensively than at shortstop.
    If you think small, you'll go nowhere in life.

  5. #4
    Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2001
    Posts
    1,154

    Re: Complete this trade idea..

    Quote Originally Posted by Krusty View Post
    Rumor is Tejeda is better at third defensively than at shortstop.
    The reds already have third base covered with EE. I would keep Tejada at SS. How about Dunn, Coffey and Cormier. One could wish!!!

  6. #5
    Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2002
    Location
    Calgary, Alberta, aka, the most prosperous city in the world.
    Posts
    13,308

    Re: Complete this trade idea..

    Quote Originally Posted by mth123 View Post
    I don't think you can get Bedard w/o including Bailey.
    THey probably couldn't get him even including Bailey.

    Would you trade EE for a package including a hot-shot third base propsect?

    You don't trade a young cheap sure thing for a "possible". You do trade an expensive sure thing in a package for a hot-shot. The time to get Bedard was before he broke through or when he's on the verge of FA.

  7. #6
    Raaaaaaaandy guttle11's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Posts
    4,118

    Re: Complete this trade idea..

    Quote Originally Posted by Gamble View Post
    During the upcoming offseason I would look for Baltimore to once again entertain the idea of moving Miguel Tejeda. Now, if you were Wayne Krivsky would you take that opportunity and put together a package including Adam Dunn to get Miguel Tejeda? (I for one have wanted to see Tejeda in a Reds uniform since his departure from Oakland, his intensity and love for the game would be a perfect match for Cincinnati, it has been a long time since this ballclub has had a player of that caliber.)

    The key to this deal is to not only get Tejeda but to also find a way to get Erik Bedard in this package also. What else would have to be included to snag these two?

    If the rumors were true during the July 31st deadline, the idea of Tejeda coming to Cincinnati was more than speculation. But it was at the expense of Homer Bailey and that tells us Wayne Krivsky is not looking to move him. So excluding Bailey what would it take to get this deal done?
    Dunn, Cueto, and Medlock for Tejada.

    Stay away from Bedard.

  8. #7
    Member Highlifeman21's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Bristol, just around the corner from ESPN
    Posts
    8,694

    Re: Complete this trade idea..

    Quote Originally Posted by Gamble View Post
    During the upcoming offseason I would look for Baltimore to once again entertain the idea of moving Miguel Tejeda. Now, if you were Wayne Krivsky would you take that opportunity and put together a package including Adam Dunn to get Miguel Tejeda? (I for one have wanted to see Tejeda in a Reds uniform since his departure from Oakland, his intensity and love for the game would be a perfect match for Cincinnati, it has been a long time since this ballclub has had a player of that caliber.)

    The key to this deal is to not only get Tejeda but to also find a way to get Erik Bedard in this package also. What else would have to be included to snag these two?

    If the rumors were true during the July 31st deadline, the idea of Tejeda coming to Cincinnati was more than speculation. But it was at the expense of Homer Bailey and that tells us Wayne Krivsky is not looking to move him. So excluding Bailey what would it take to get this deal done?
    1. Welcome to RedsZone!

    2. I'm a Tejada fan, but I would never move Dunn for Tejada. Not in a million years.

    3. As for Bedard, I'm not sold on him, and I would like to see how this Homer Bailey rollercoaster plays out first. While I fully expect Homer Bailey to never remotely even closely realize the ridiculously lofty expectations placed on him by us fans, he may be serviceable, as a #3.

  9. #8
    Member mth123's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Posts
    31,919

    Re: Complete this trade idea..

    Quote Originally Posted by PuffyPig View Post
    THey probably couldn't get him even including Bailey.

    Would you trade EE for a package including a hot-shot third base propsect?

    You don't trade a young cheap sure thing for a "possible". You do trade an expensive sure thing in a package for a hot-shot. The time to get Bedard was before he broke through or when he's on the verge of FA.
    I agree for the most part. The key word in the original post was including Bailey (along with Dunn). My point was no Bedard w/o Bailey. But like you, still not sure even with him.

    I'd also be squeamish about dealing Dunn. Next year at $10 Million he is still cheap for his 40 HRs and high OBP. It would likely take $13 to $15 million to replace his production on the FA market. That would probably be in LF and you would still have the same problem of where to play JR, no good everyday option in CF, and less money for pitching. Sure you could probably sign Hunter with the money and fix a couple of those problems, but the offense would be worse with Hunter subbing for Dunn IMO. Hunter is a very, very good complimentary player. But a complimentary player he is. W/O Dunn this team needs a centerpiece.

  10. #9
    Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Wheelersburg, Ohio
    Posts
    930

    Re: Complete this trade idea..

    Quote Originally Posted by mth123 View Post
    I don't think you can get Bedard w/o including Bailey.

    Agreed. I do not believe there would any way to pull a deal off like that w/o Bailey heading the other way.

  11. #10
    Recovering Cubs Fan
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Posts
    711

    Re: Complete this trade idea..

    Quote Originally Posted by mth123 View Post
    Sure you could probably sign Hunter with the money and fix a couple of those problems, but the offense would be worse with Hunter subbing for Dunn IMO. Hunter is a very, very good complimentary player. But a complimentary player he is. W/O Dunn this team needs a centerpiece.
    I agree with you in principle here. There are so few true franchise players, when you get one you need to hang on to them with both hands.

    Unfortunately, neither Dunn nor Griffey qualify as a true franchise player. They're both complementary players, and this team has no centerpiece. That doesn't mean Dunn never will be, but the time is quickly approaching to decide whether you build around him or trade him while his value is high. His disappearing act every September is simply not the stuff a centerpiece is made of.

  12. #11
    Member mth123's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Posts
    31,919

    Re: Complete this trade idea..

    Quote Originally Posted by Natty Redlocks View Post
    His disappearing act every September is simply not the stuff a centerpiece is made of.
    How many Septembers have the Reds been in contention for him to disappear? This sounds like a yearly occurrence.

  13. #12
    Recovering Cubs Fan
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Posts
    711

    Re: Complete this trade idea..

    Quote Originally Posted by mth123 View Post
    How many Septembers have the Reds been in contention for him to disappear? This sounds like a yearly occurrence.
    His career September OPS was around .755 last time I checked.

    Todd Hollandsworth's career September OPS is around .775.

    If your team would be better off benching you for T-Hole down the stretch, you MIGHT not be a franchise player.

  14. #13
    Member mth123's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Posts
    31,919

    Re: Complete this trade idea..

    Quote Originally Posted by Natty Redlocks View Post
    His career September OPS was around .755 last time I checked.

    Todd Hollandsworth's career September OPS is around .775.

    If your team would be better off benching you for T-Hole down the stretch, you MIGHT not be a franchise player.
    We all have stats we think are important I suppose. If you pick and choose enough you can seemingly make a case for or against anything. Stats are great when applied correctly. You can choose the small sample size of Sept OPS which were accumulated through years of meaningless games with many of his team's primary players sitting out with injury (Griffey, Kearns, Casey, Pena, Boone, etc.) during most of those years.

    I choose to see a guy who won't be 27 until November, who has put up 3 years in a row with over 40 Homers, a high OBP and a high OPS. There aren't many players with stats like that in MLB and even fewer that are only 26. I seriously doubt many will become available to build this team around and if they are they will probably cost more than $10 Million. I'd trade Dunn if I could get a serious haul that filled three or four needs long term. Lacking that I would build around the guy. Don't make the mistake of thinking that trading Dunn is payroll relief. It will cost more than he is paid to replace him.

    We probably just disagree on this point.

  15. #14
    Member Highlifeman21's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Bristol, just around the corner from ESPN
    Posts
    8,694

    Re: Complete this trade idea..

    Quote Originally Posted by Natty Redlocks View Post
    I agree with you in principle here. There are so few true franchise players, when you get one you need to hang on to them with both hands.

    Unfortunately, neither Dunn nor Griffey qualify as a true franchise player. They're both complementary players, and this team has no centerpiece. That doesn't mean Dunn never will be, but the time is quickly approaching to decide whether you build around him or trade him while his value is high. His disappearing act every September is simply not the stuff a centerpiece is made of.
    Dunn is a franchise player. You're kidding yourself if you think otherwise. EE is developing into a franchise player. Right now, Harang is our franchise pitcher.

    But, in your world, the Reds lack a franchise player....

  16. #15
    Recovering Cubs Fan
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Posts
    711

    Re: Complete this trade idea..

    Quote Originally Posted by mth123 View Post
    We all have stats we think are important I suppose. If you pick and choose enough you can seemingly make a case for or against anything. Stats are great when applied correctly. You can choose the small sample size of Sept OPS which were accumulated through years of meaningless games with many of his team's primary players sitting out with injury (Griffey, Kearns, Casey, Pena, Boone, etc.) during most of those years.

    I choose to see a guy who won't be 27 until November, who has put up 3 years in a row with over 40 Homers, a high OBP and a high OPS. There aren't many players with stats like that in MLB and even fewer that are only 26. I seriously doubt many will become available to build this team around and if they are they will probably cost more than $10 Million. I'd trade Dunn if I could get a serious haul that filled three or four needs long term. Lacking that I would build around the guy. Don't make the mistake of thinking that trading Dunn is payroll relief. It will cost more than he is paid to replace him.

    We probably just disagree on this point.
    It's not just September, though. I just checked: his lifetime August OPS is .820 -- pretty ordinary for your best hitter. And Sept. has now dropped to .748, which means that for the last two months of the season, his entire career, the OPS is well below .800. That's not a tiny sample size. It's roughly a third of his at-bats, arguably the most important third, with pennant races going on and theoretically playoff games ahead. If the Reds ever make the playoffs, do you want it to be with your "franchise player" in a free fall since July?

    I really really do understand the value of Dunn. I love his patience. He does his part to make pitchers work. He's an imposing presence in the lineup. He gets on base and scores a lot. He drives in more runs than anyone else on the team. He's really young and may get way better. He's better defensively than most people give him credit for.

    But he's going to get very expensive very soon. The time is coming to decide whether he's your guy to build your offense around or not. If so, bat him third and leave him there. If not, start exploring what you can get for him. This offseason would be a good time for that.


Turn Off Ads?

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Board Moderators may, at their discretion and judgment, delete and/or edit any messages that violate any of the following guidelines: 1. Explicit references to alleged illegal or unlawful acts. 2. Graphic sexual descriptions. 3. Racial or ethnic slurs. 4. Use of edgy language (including masked profanity). 5. Direct personal attacks, flames, fights, trolling, baiting, name-calling, general nuisance, excessive player criticism or anything along those lines. 6. Posting spam. 7. Each person may have only one user account. It is fine to be critical here - that's what this board is for. But let's not beat a subject or a player to death, please.

Thank you, and most importantly, enjoy yourselves!


RedsZone.com is a privately owned website and is not affiliated with the Cincinnati Reds or Major League Baseball


Contact us: Boss | Gallen5862 | Plus Plus | Powel Crosley | RedlegJake | The Operator