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Thread: All is not well in Baltimore

  1. #1
    SERP Emeritus paintmered's Avatar
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    All is not well in Baltimore

    'Free the birds': Orioles fans walk out in protest

    Associated Press

    BALTIMORE -- Nearly a thousand disgruntled Orioles fans walked out of Baltimore's game against Detroit en masse on Thursday, culminating a demonstration aimed at team owner Peter Angelos.

    A majority of the protesters wore black T-shirts that read "FREE THE BIRDS," and many carried signs that had "For Pete's Sake" on one side and "Free the Birds" on the other.

    They filled parts of six sections in the upper deck, then walked out in the middle of the fourth inning at precisely 5:08 p.m. -- in honor of former Oriole stars Brooks Robinson (No. 5) and Cal Ripken (No. 8).

    The group walked in line through the lower deck before departing.

    Baltimore is in the midst of its club-record ninth consecutive losing season, all of them under the leadership of Angelos, who gained control of the franchise in 1993.

    "We are here to show our dissatisfaction with his role, and some of the stupid decisions he has made," said 43-year-old fan Eric Hunter. "We want someone in there who will spend the money to do the things that will bring the fans back."

    Angelos defended the fashion in which he runs the team, which last reached the playoffs in 1997.

    "Whoever joins that protest has no comprehension of what it costs to run a baseball team," Angelos said in a telephone interview from his law office in Baltimore. "When you get down to facts, putting together a team that can compete in the AL East means having a payroll between $100 million-$110 million. That money comes from the consumer, and I have chosen to keep ticket prices to a minimum.

    "Our payroll is $75 million, and our ticket prices average $22. Some of the teams we compete against charge an average of $45," Angelos said. "We're going to have to match the competition. How to do that is a decision I will make in the future."

    The rally was organized by Nestor Aparicio, owner of radio station WNST-AM and the nephew of former Oriole shortstop Luis Aparicio.

    "We have a chance to make a memorable civic statement about how we, as fans, are fed up with the embarrassment that the Orioles have become," Aparicio said.

    "He is a very unimportant person who has delusions of grandeur," Angelos said. "To begin with, to leave in the middle of the game is an abuse of the players who have worked hard and played their hearts out."

    Aparicio spoke beforehand of bringing in between 3,000 fans and 10,000 fans, but the group fell far short of that amount. Still, they made their presence known by chanting and rooting for the Orioles from well before the game started.

    Raymond Burke, 54, wore a dark suit over his black "FREE THE BIRDS" shirt.

    "This is all part of my kids having the experience that I had as a kid coming to the games -- of experiencing the great teams and teams that meant something to the community," he said.

    After the game, Orioles vice president of baseball operations Mike Flanagan said, "They showed a lot of passion and exuberance. They want to win and we want to win. Hopefully, we're headed in that direction in the offseason."
    It will be interesting to see if anything comes of this. Their schedule certainly doesn't help them much.
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  3. #2
    Member paulrichjr's Avatar
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    Re: All is not well in Baltimore

    We think our prior ownership was bad. You can pretty much take whatever Peter Angellos does and do the opposite and have a very good team.

    I'm just very happy that BobC is our owner. He is going to be a great one.
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  4. #3
    Member Wheelhouse's Avatar
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    Re: All is not well in Baltimore

    I can see why they don't like Angelos--his response was charmless and he does seem like an egomaniac. Who is he to determine how important or unimportant a person is?
    "Don't trust any statistics you did not fake yourself."--Winston Churchill

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    Unsolicited Opinions traderumor's Avatar
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    Re: All is not well in Baltimore

    "Whoever joins that protest has no comprehension of what it costs to run a baseball team," Angelos said in a telephone interview from his law office in Baltimore. "When you get down to facts, putting together a team that can compete in the AL East means having a payroll between $100 million-$110 million. That money comes from the consumer, and I have chosen to keep ticket prices to a minimum.
    He had to have consulted John Allen before saying that. I made the quip last year, but this simply reinforces the thought that the Orioles are what the Reds (pre-Cast/K) would look like with a bigger budget. Poorly run organizations flush money, its just a matter of how much money they have to flush.

  6. #5
    Haunted by walks
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    Re: All is not well in Baltimore

    Next they'll want to make out the lineups.

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    Hey Cubs Fans RFS62's Avatar
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    Re: All is not well in Baltimore

    Sooooo..... our gamethread took a field trip to Baltimore, eh?
    "Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover."
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    Pitching is the thing WVRedsFan's Avatar
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    Re: All is not well in Baltimore

    I think those fans have spunk. Really. They are refusing to pay for a bad product. I don't think we'd ever see such a thing in Cincinnati, but our six-year losing streak (unless something drastic happens) will be getting close to theirs.

    And I am not so enthusiastic about our ownership and GM as I was earlier in the year. I saw them take a team with a winning record and parlay it into a loser. Regardless of the reasons, that is what happened and that's the bottom line. I also see no proof that it's going to get any better, but they have an off-season to convince me and I hope they do.
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  9. #8
    THAT'S A FACT JACK!! GAC's Avatar
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    Re: All is not well in Baltimore

    "If you build it they will come."
    "panic" only comes from having real expectations

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    Unsolicited Opinions traderumor's Avatar
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    Re: All is not well in Baltimore

    Quote Originally Posted by WVRedsFan View Post
    I saw them take a team with a winning record and parlay it into a loser. Regardless of the reasons, that is what happened and that's the bottom line.
    I realize you shut the door on any different views with the above, but that is a mighty big leap in logic. The "team with a winning record" was one starting pitcher different from the team on the field the year before, when avoiding 90 losses was an accomplishment. So, to say they tinkered with a machine that was doing just fine is hardly reality.

  11. #10
    Making sense of it all Matt700wlw's Avatar
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    Re: All is not well in Baltimore

    Reminds me of when Lions fans protested during last years game (where the Bengals clinched the division in Detroit) by wearing Bengals gear and cheering for them.

    Matt Millen still doesn't get it. Hopefully for Orioles' fans...Peter Angellos will
    Last edited by Matt700wlw; 09-22-2006 at 03:31 PM.

  12. #11
    Pitching is the thing WVRedsFan's Avatar
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    Re: All is not well in Baltimore

    Quote Originally Posted by traderumor View Post
    I realize you shut the door on any different views with the above, but that is a mighty big leap in logic. The "team with a winning record" was one starting pitcher different from the team on the field the year before, when avoiding 90 losses was an accomplishment. So, to say they tinkered with a machine that was doing just fine is hardly reality.
    No shut door here, but to say I'm mystified at how they went about "improving" the team is the understatement of the year. And I want someone, anyone, to blow a hole in my argument or stand on this. I've said this before and not to beat a dead horse, it started out well and then (all of a sudden) we were getting every retread that ever pitched a ball game in a Reds uniform. That reminded me of the Bowden years. Franklin, Kim, Mays, the list goes on, were brought in to do what pitchers we already had could do and that was give up great numbers of hits and runs. The bullpen was statistically better, but the guys we already had improved also, so determining the effect of that should be left to Cyclone or someone who has time to figure it. Anyway the result if obvious.

    And I agree this team needed some tinkering and yes, only one starting pitcher was different, but the result will apparently be the same, no matter how much tinkering was done (hopefully not, btw). I guess the best thing to do is give it a couple of years and then judge. I just wish Robert and Wayne had done that with field management (at least a year), but adoration of Krivsky and Castillini (I can't spell his name, I know) is a little much right now.
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  13. #12
    Be the ball Roy Tucker's Avatar
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    Re: All is not well in Baltimore

    Sounds like Angelos went to the John Allen School of Customer Relations, i.e. "those darn customers, they just need to give us their money and shut up, they can be so annoying".

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  14. #13
    Unsolicited Opinions traderumor's Avatar
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    Re: All is not well in Baltimore

    Quote Originally Posted by WVRedsFan View Post
    No shut door here, but to say I'm mystified at how they went about "improving" the team is the understatement of the year. And I want someone, anyone, to blow a hole in my argument or stand on this. I've said this before and not to beat a dead horse, it started out well and then (all of a sudden) we were getting every retread that ever pitched a ball game in a Reds uniform. That reminded me of the Bowden years. Franklin, Kim, Mays, the list goes on, were brought in to do what pitchers we already had could do and that was give up great numbers of hits and runs. The bullpen was statistically better, but the guys we already had improved also, so determining the effect of that should be left to Cyclone or someone who has time to figure it. Anyway the result if obvious.

    And I agree this team needed some tinkering and yes, only one starting pitcher was different, but the result will apparently be the same, no matter how much tinkering was done (hopefully not, btw). I guess the best thing to do is give it a couple of years and then judge. I just wish Robert and Wayne had done that with field management (at least a year), but adoration of Krivsky and Castillini (I can't spell his name, I know) is a little much right now.
    "Started out well" is the key point. The team had a great April, the rest of the season was more of the same because it was the same. The results were predictable, although we all hoped upon hope the team would be the one to overcome the odds. In the end, they have not and the minor moves that were made had mixed results.

    Now, this offseason will tell us much, as I hope a major overhaul will take place.

  15. #14
    Pitching is the thing WVRedsFan's Avatar
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    Re: All is not well in Baltimore

    Quote Originally Posted by traderumor View Post
    "Started out well" is the key point. The team had a great April, the rest of the season was more of the same because it was the same. The results were predictable, although we all hoped upon hope the team would be the one to overcome the odds. In the end, they have not and the minor moves that were made had mixed results.

    Now, this offseason will tell us much, as I hope a major overhaul will take place.
    We totally agree on the final point. The off-season is the key. I just hope and pray that we don't see the reincarnation of the Minnesota Twins here. Ever notice how many former Twins Krivsky brings in? I mean, it's like he doesn't have an original idea. I'm sorry, but I'm really disappointed in Krivsky and Robert C. When they started out, they went gangbusters. DFA'd a lot of worthless players, brought in a couple of good players and I got into a comfort zone with them. Then, all of a sudden, we get two starters for three pretty much worthless pitchers and an over-the-hill shortstop followed by the numerous retread pitchers. What?

    Today, I was listening to another MLB "expert" tellling how we got the biggest fleecing of the year. I believe in accountability. I always have in business or in sports business. You bring in guys who are supposed to make a difference and if they don't, you are the blame. Yes, it's too soon to hang Krivsky from the highest tree. Same with Cast, but I'm not afraid to say that the total result of the changes has been less than satisfactory starting with extentions for Krivsky from Cast and the manager from Krivsky. If things are not working out, you shake things up, but in the usual conservative ways this franchise has practiced from time to time, e get more of the same. I want radical change. Ditch the whole team if you must, but make it better. What we got was less value for what we had and regardless of the improvement of the bullpen, we've continued to lose, lose, lose. Is that acceptable? Not to me especially from a bunch who came in saying heads would roll.

    It may all work out, but I'm not seeing that right now. What I'm seeing is what we've had for six long years. Losing baseball and moves that mystify everyone. We had that with Boone and Miley, Marge and Carl, and now Bob and Wayne. Be "glass-half-full" all you want, but the bottom line is losing baseball and made worse by moves. I will not sugar-coat it and go along with the ones who want to "have faith" in the new ownership and management. What I see is losing baseball and moves making things worse. And that's not acceptable.
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    Re: All is not well in Baltimore

    I'm dissapoined too as the rest of us on here are but at the beginning of the year did anyone really expect this team to contend.Its the last week of the season and they still haven't been mathamatically eliminated yet. I guess thats saying something although it is the same as the last six years. With all the tinkering Wayne did with the pitching its the offense that went south on this team the last six weeks. Dunn has really stunk it up and Griffey isn't far behind. Phillips has an obp of less than 300 the last two months, Ross and Freel are striking out at Adam Dunn pace and Hatteburg finally came down to earth. Its still to soon to say we got fleeced on the Kearns Lopez trade but it does look like a veteran GM took advantage of a rookie GM.
    There are five things I do this off season if I'm Krisky.1.I trade Dunn for an outfielder who can make contact at the plate and drive in 80 runs or better.2.Griffey goes to Left or right and if doesn't then he's not a team player. 3.I dump Hatteburg and give Aurilia 1st base for 2007.I'm tired of having a pop and Judy hitting 1st baseman.4.I go after the best starting pitcher on the free agent market hot and heavy.If its Schmidt and he wants 12 to 14 million a year then do it.If you want to excite this city and let them know you mean business this will do it.5. I've been a Jerry Narron supporter all year and for the most he's done his best with what he's had to work with but I just don't see him as a great motivater.It just seems like he's quit with the rest of the team.Giving this I would go after Big Lou or any manager who won't stand by quietly while the ship is sinking.
    I'm spending a lot of money here but I think they have it and if success is in the cards then they had better spend it. Just an opinion.
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