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Thread: How to build a franchise (Detroit)

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    How to build a franchise (Detroit)

    http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/playof...rry&id=2631335

    Here's a great link from Jerry Crasnick (ESPN) on Detroit's approach to team-building.
    Last edited by Rex Argos; 10-19-2006 at 03:09 PM.
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    Unsolicited Opinions traderumor's Avatar
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    Re: How to build a franchise (Detroit)

    The same type of articles were written last year about the White Sox, who failed to make the playoffs this year. Making a run in one year is not nearly as impressive as what the Yankees, A's, Cardinals, Braves and Astros have done year after year in the 21st century, with some extending for over a decade of success. The one year wonders seem positioned to become the next model franchise, then next thing you know, they cannot even gain a wildcard birth the following year.

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    Re: How to build a franchise (Detroit)

    Quote Originally Posted by traderumor View Post
    The same type of articles were written last year about the White Sox, who failed to make the playoffs this year. Making a run in one year is not nearly as impressive as what the Yankees, A's, Cardinals, Braves and Astros have done year after year in the 21st century, with some extending for over a decade of success. The one year wonders seem positioned to become the next model franchise, then next thing you know, they cannot even gain a wildcard birth the following year.
    Exactly.

    Though I love the notion of the Tigers having Velander and Miller to anchor the rotation for the better part of a decade. My guess is the problem Detroit will encounter will be scoring runs on a consistent basis. In that way, they're kind of Angelesque.
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    Re: How to build a franchise (Detroit)

    I think with a good, young rotation they could be around for awhile. Verlander, Zumaya, Bonderman, and others look likely to have bright careers in front of them. Of course, we were saying the same thing about Wood and Prior not too long ago.

    It seems that hitting is the commodity that can be replaced, you can mix and match. Many times it seems that you can catch lightning in a bottle with hitters that have career years.

    So, the question is...will they be the Braves of the 90's, or the Angels of the recent past?
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    Re: How to build a franchise (Detroit)

    On the heels of 12 straight losing seasons, it's a little early to be claiming sustained success.

    That's almost Depression Era Browns and Phillies bad as far as continued losing.

    Code:
    Detroit Tigers
    ----------------------------------
    YEAR  PLACE   W    L   PCT   GB    
    1994  5th     53   62  .461   18
    1995  4th     60   84  .417   26
    1996  5th     53  109  .327   39
    1997  3rd     79   83  .488   19
    1998  5th     65   97  .401   24
    1999  3rd     69   92  .429   27.5
    2000  3rd     79   83  .488   16
    2001  4th     66   96  .407   25
    2002  5th     55  106  .342   39
    2003  5th     43  119  .265   47
    2004  4th     72   90  .444   20
    2005  4th     71   91  .438   28

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    Stat Wanker Hodiernus RedsManRick's Avatar
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    Re: How to build a franchise (Detroit)

    Quote Originally Posted by westofyou View Post
    On the heels of 12 straight losing seasons, it's a little early to be claiming sustained success.

    That's almost Depression Era Browns and Phillies bad as far as continued losing.

    Code:
    Detroit Tigers
    ----------------------------------
    YEAR  PLACE   W    L   PCT   GB    
    1994  5th     53   62  .461   18
    1995  4th     60   84  .417   26
    1996  5th     53  109  .327   39
    1997  3rd     79   83  .488   19
    1998  5th     65   97  .401   24
    1999  3rd     69   92  .429   27.5
    2000  3rd     79   83  .488   16
    2001  4th     66   96  .407   25
    2002  5th     55  106  .342   39
    2003  5th     43  119  .265   47
    2004  4th     72   90  .444   20
    2005  4th     71   91  .438   28
    And though they may have won the pennent, they still haven't won the divison title...
    Games are won on run differential -- scoring more than your opponent. Runs are runs, scored or prevented they all count the same. Worry about scoring more and allowing fewer, not which positions contribute to which side of the equation or how "consistent" you are at your current level of performance.

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    Re: How to build a franchise (Detroit)

    Quote Originally Posted by Rex Argos View Post
    I think with a good, young rotation they could be around for awhile. Verlander, Zumaya, Bonderman, and others look likely to have bright careers in front of them. Of course, we were saying the same thing about Wood and Prior not too long ago.

    It seems that hitting is the commodity that can be replaced, you can mix and match. Many times it seems that you can catch lightning in a bottle with hitters that have career years.

    So, the question is...will they be the Braves of the 90's, or the Angels of the recent past?
    The Tigers seem to resemble the 2005 White Sox. Manager given a lot of credit for motivation and pulling the right strings, very good rotation, hammer bullpen, and enough offense to get by. Of course, Ozzie is probably chewing on his crying towel at the thought of the Cardinals making the World Series when he is sitting at home.

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    Re: How to build a franchise (Detroit)

    Folks, the White Sox STILL won 90 games in the toughest division in all of MLB. If that's a one year wonder, keep the needle on the record.

    There's just an assload of talent in the AL. Sometimes you're on the outside looking in. But winning 99 last year and 90 this year is the dictionary definition of staying successful.

    And I have no doubt in my mind that the Cardinals would trade every last bit of the last six years for the White Sox' 2005.
    Last edited by Falls City Beer; 10-19-2006 at 04:30 PM.

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    Re: How to build a franchise (Detroit)

    Quote Originally Posted by Falls City Beer View Post
    Folks, the White Sox STILL won 90 games in the toughest division in all of MLB. If that's a one year wonder, keep the needle on the record.

    There's just an assload of talent in the AL. Sometimes you're on the outside looking in. But winning 99 last year and 90 this year is the dictionary definition of staying successful.

    And I have no doubt in my mind that the Cardinals would trade every last bit of the last six years for the White Sox' 2005.
    The comparison was made to teams that have been doing it for the entire decade.

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    Re: How to build a franchise (Detroit)

    Quote Originally Posted by traderumor View Post
    The comparison was made to teams that have been doing it for the entire decade.
    What I'm taking exception to is the notion that the White Sox are a one-year wonder. They are clearly a two-wonder so far, and working on more I'm sure. Whether it's sustainable or not is another question altogether.

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    Re: How to build a franchise (Detroit)

    Quote Originally Posted by Falls City Beer View Post
    Folks, the White Sox STILL won 90 games in the toughest division in all of MLB. If that's a one year wonder, keep the needle on the record.
    Sure , but the interesting part is that they did that by adding offense, they allowed almost 150 more runs. The great pitching of the season before wasn't so great in '06, and with almost the same staff and not much in the way of major injuries.
    "Reality tells us there are no guarantees. Except that some day Jon Lester will be on that list of 100-game winners." - Peter Gammons

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    Re: How to build a franchise (Detroit)

    Quote Originally Posted by traderumor View Post
    The same type of articles were written last year about the White Sox, who failed to make the playoffs this year. Making a run in one year is not nearly as impressive as what the Yankees, A's, Cardinals, Braves and Astros have done year after year in the 21st century, with some extending for over a decade of success. The one year wonders seem positioned to become the next model franchise, then next thing you know, they cannot even gain a wildcard birth the following year.

    Yep, every year the same story is written with different names -- Angels, White Sox, now the Tigers.

    It would be nice if the Reds' turn came up soon.
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    Re: How to build a franchise (Detroit)

    Quote Originally Posted by blumj View Post
    Sure , but the interesting part is that they did that by adding offense, they allowed almost 150 more runs. The great pitching of the season before wasn't so great in '06, and with almost the same staff and not much in the way of major injuries.
    Yeah they adjusted. But great teams always do. I'm not saying that I know whether the White Sox will continue their successful run, I'm just saying that looking at longtime dynasties after the fact and comparing them to current teams is a little unfair, considering that those dynasties had to make the same adjustments over the years that the White Sox obviously made between 2005 and 2006. They surrendered 150 MORE runs, yet still they won 90 games--that says to me that their GM had some foresight and made some nice adjustments to pad that predicted spike in RA.

    I have no idea if the White Sox success is sustainable, but they've sustained it over two years. And that's worth something.

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    Re: How to build a franchise (Detroit)

    The White Sox's pitching staff also had a particularly bad year, far below what I would have expected of such a good staff -- they all seemed to happen on a bad year the same year. They've got the bulk of that pitching staff locked up for a few years and they have the money and talent to convince their two free agents to stay when the time does come around. I think that is a very solidly built team that has the potential to remain so for a few years minimum. I know that a lot of people don't agree with me but I think Kenny Williams is one of the better GMs out there right now.
    There is no such thing as a pitching prospect.


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