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Thread: Here's Why I Think The Reds Will Have A Tough Time This Winter...

  1. #31
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    Re: Here's Why I Think The Reds Will Have A Tough Time This Winter...

    Quote Originally Posted by wheels View Post
    Yup. Silly as it is, you've got it nailed.

    Even sillier is that some still try to defend the move.

    I desperately want Wayne to succeed, but one more move like this and the club is sunk for years.

    Wayne's pushed the red button once; what makes anyone think he won't do it again? Boy, do I hope he doesn't do it again.
    The trade hasn't panned out, but I think this post overstates the problem. In the old days of baseball, you could have a trade that "sinks a team for years." Today, you can compensate if you are willing to spend money.

    Nobody can convince me that Lopez and Kearns are such great players that the Reds can't replace their production if they boost their payroll.

    This off-season will tell us a lot. Teams in most sports, particularly baseball, can build themselves up quickly by spending. The free agents list may not be ideal, but there is more than enough talent available to improve the Reds in every department.

    Based on everything I've heard from the new ownership's statements, I expect them to go after a couple of major free agents. I also expect them to be active traders.

    Most top tier franchises in 2006 don't just sit around waiting for AA prospects to improve. I hope and expect the Reds to make an effort to reach this level.

    If they do this, I can live with one or two duds. Every player move doesn't pan out. But as a fan I am waiting for the ownership to show they are really trying. The time has come.
    Last edited by Kc61; 11-13-2006 at 11:49 AM.

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  3. #32
    Redsmetz redsmetz's Avatar
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    Re: Here's Why I Think The Reds Will Have A Tough Time This Winter...

    Quote Originally Posted by Kc61 View Post
    The trade hasn't panned out, but I think this post overstates the problem. In the old days of baseball, you could have a trade that "sinks a team for years." Today, you can compensate if you are willing to spend money.

    Nobody can convince me that Lopez and Kearns are such great players that the Reds can't replace their production if they boost their payroll.

    This off-season will tell us a lot. Teams in most sports, particularly baseball, can build themselves up quickly by spending. The free agents list may not be ideal, but there is more than enough talent available to improve the Reds in every department.

    Based on everything I've heard from the new ownership's statements, I expect them to go after a couple of major free agents. I also expect them to be active traders.

    Most top tier franchises in 2006 don't just sit around waiting for AA prospects to improve. I hope and expect the Reds to make an effort to reach this level.

    If they do this, I can live with one or two duds. Every player move doesn't pan out. But as a fan I am waiting for the ownership to show they are really trying. The time has come.
    I believe that Lopez would not have had much more value during the offseason than he did at the time of the trade. Kearns remains another question, although as many of have said, only time will tell. And I continue to believe that the jury remains out on the pitching we received. It's still too early to say whether this was a good trade or not. Yes, it's arguable that it would be helpful to have Kearns as a chip now, but this trade could still pan out for us.

  4. #33
    Churlish Johnny Footstool's Avatar
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    Re: Here's Why I Think The Reds Will Have A Tough Time This Winter...

    Quote Originally Posted by redsmetz View Post
    I believe that Lopez would not have had much more value during the offseason than he did at the time of the trade. Kearns remains another question, although as many of have said, only time will tell. And I continue to believe that the jury remains out on the pitching we received. It's still too early to say whether this was a good trade or not. Yes, it's arguable that it would be helpful to have Kearns as a chip now, but this trade could still pan out for us.
    The jury also remains out on Lopez and Kearns. The trade could still pan out, or it could turn into even more of a disaster.
    "I prefer books and movies where the conflict isn't of the extreme cannibal apocalypse variety I guess." Redsfaithful

  5. #34
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    Re: Here's Why I Think The Reds Will Have A Tough Time This Winter...

    Quote Originally Posted by edabbs44 View Post
    Starting pitching can mask more holes than any other position on the field. It's the best place to start.
    I agree 100% with this statement. You are not reading my quote completely or I wasn't clear. I think overpaying for the quality of pitching that is out there right now is a mixtake not that getting quality starters is a mistake. If we have $15 million to spend this winter and that is all I would rather fix the bullpen and the hitting/defense than spend $12 million for one starter that honestly might not be better than Milton. There isn't a lot of choices out there that are that great and because of this the ones that are decent will be driven sky high in price.

    Trade for starting pitching...build a team to make it so we need it.
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    I remember one time going out to the mound to talk with Bob Gibson. He told me to get back behind the batter, that the only thing I knew about pitching was that it was hard to hit.

  6. #35
    THAT'S A FACT JACK!! GAC's Avatar
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    Re: Here's Why I Think The Reds Will Have A Tough Time This Winter...

    Quote Originally Posted by paulrichjr View Post
    Honestly I think this team's problems are much greater than the starting pitching. My opinion is that this team has so many holes that we should try to fix the others before we "overpay" for some very poor options at starter.
    One of the things I noticed in that article I posted is that it was stated that Suppan is a groundball pitcher, so any team that acquires him had better have the defense behind him. We don't.

    Now, would I rather have a Suppan pitching at GAB vesus a Milton? You bet.

    One of the items I did not like about the trade last year was that we traded away a young player that probably was our best defensive OFer in Kearns. What an arm! And who did we put in his slot? Freel. A scrappy ballplayer, but an obvious downgrade IMO.

    Would the trade have been more palatable if it had been Freel or Deno included other than Kearns?

    It's obvious that we need another SP to shore up this rotation. But we also need, IMO, to go after a solid defensive middle INFer. I'm not so much as concerned that they have a solid bat, though I'm not referring to a Castro/Womack type; but a defensive specialist should be our main objective. Personally, I'd like to keep BP at 2B and find a SS. I think BP has found his nitch there. And I think Wayne wants to keep him at 2B.

    But we have to improve this defense.

    People knocked Hatteberg's defense at 1B last year. But he set a record among all 1bman last year for the number of consecutive games without an error (can't recall what the exact number was). And I'm not opposed to trading Hatteberg at some point next year and moving Dunn to 1B... who is going to be a defensive liability wherever he plays.... if it means getting Jr out of CF. He might be keeping the seat warm for Votto.

    An OF (left to right) of Jr, Deno, Freel would be better defensively, but it still doesn't excite me.
    "panic" only comes from having real expectations

  7. #36
    The Big Dog mth123's Avatar
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    Re: Here's Why I Think The Reds Will Have A Tough Time This Winter...

    Quote Originally Posted by RedsManRick View Post
    For all the worrying about our pitching, and I agree there's still lots of room to improve, we had an above average team ERA and a below average number of runs scored. A singular focus on pitching may not be what's best for us. It's not like there's a ton of high quality free agents, but there's an argument to be made that it would be smart to lay low this year, let everybody else spend their new TV money on inflated contracts. Make a few shrewd value trades to fill the bench and the back of the bullpen and then make a run at some guys next year.
    I agree with this. With the frenzy for mediocre starters, the Reds should be aggresively marketing Kyle Lohse. I think you couple him with a decent pen Arm (Maj, Cormier) you may get a long term solution for somewhere. If Jaret Wright can net Britton, Lohse could net something decent IMO.

  8. #37
    Member membengal's Avatar
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    Re: Here's Why I Think The Reds Will Have A Tough Time This Winter...

    I wouldn't mind them making a run at Adam Eaton. He has more talent, I think, than his numbers have shown.

    The Reds still spit the bit in the Lopez/Kearns trade debacle.

  9. #38
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    Re: Here's Why I Think The Reds Will Have A Tough Time This Winter...

    Quote Originally Posted by RANDY IN CHAR NC View Post
    Add an outfield bat with power to that and I agree.
    As much as I want to, I just cannot agree with this statement.

    If the Reds aren't going to be completely awful....and that is awful'er than last year.....in the OF, JR cannot play CF. So, to me, the OF has to be Dunn in LF (should be at 1B) JR in RF (he will be less than average even ther) and a a very fast CF.....to cover the huge area left between the statues in LF and RF.
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