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Thread: 2007 Hall of Fame Ballot Released (let the McGwire controversy begin)

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  1. #1
    Maple SERP savafan's Avatar
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    2007 Hall of Fame Ballot Released (let the McGwire controversy begin)

    http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/...l/4362090.html

    NEW YORK Mark McGwire, Tony Gwynn and Cal Ripken Jr. headline the first-time candidates on the 2007 baseball writers' Hall of Fame ballot released Monday, sure to spark debate on Big Mac's place in history as the steroid era comes under renewed scrutiny.

    Jose Canseco, whose book last year led to a congressional hearing on steroid use in baseball, also is on the ballot for the first time. Canseco said he used steroids along with McGwire when they were teammates.

    McGwire denied using illegal performance-enhancing substances, but when he appeared before a congressional committee, he evaded questions. "I'm not here to talk about the past," was his repeated response.

    McGwire finished his career with 583 home runs, seventh in baseball history while Canseco, a former MVP, is 30th at 462. Dave Kingman, 34th with 442, has the most home runs for a player who has been on the Hall of Fame ballot and was not elected.

    Gwynn, an eight-time batting champion with San Diego, and Ripken, a two-time MVP with Baltimore, are considered likely to gain election on the first ballot. Ripken played in 2,632 consecutive games, breaking Lou Gehrig's record.

    Bret Saberhagen, a two-time Cy Young Award winner, and former MVP Ken Caminiti also are among 17 players on the ballot for the first time along with Harold Baines, Dante Bichette, Bobby Bonilla, Scott Brosius, Jay Buhner, Eric Davis, Tony Fernandez, Wally Joyner, Paul O'Neill, Devon White and Bobby Witt.

    Jim Rice, who was 53 votes short of election last year, heads the 15 holdovers. Rich Gossage finished one vote behind Rice.

    Reporters who have been in the BBWAA for 10 or more consecutive years are eligible to vote, and the totals will be announced Jan. 9.

    The complete ballot:

    Harold Baines, Albert Belle, Dante Bichette, Bert Blyleven, Bobby Bonilla, Scott Brosius, Jay Buhner, Ken Caminiti, Jose Canseco, Dave Concepcion, Eric Davis, Andre Dawson, Tony Fernandez, Steve Garvey, Rich "Goose" Gossage, Tony Gwynn, Orel Hershiser, Tommy John, Wally Joyner, Don Mattingly, Mark McGwire, Jack Morris, Dale Murphy, Paul O'Neill, Dave Parker, Jim Rice, Cal Ripken Jr., Bret Saberhagen, Lee Smith, Alan Trammell, Devon White, Bobby Witt.
    My dad got to enjoy 3 Reds World Championships by the time he was my age. So far, I've only gotten to enjoy one. Step it up Redlegs!

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    Re: 2007 Hall of Fame Ballot Released (let the McGwire controversy begin)

    Bert "Be home" Blyleven
    Goose
    Eric
    Dave Concepcion
    Paul O'Neil
    Cal
    Lee Smith

    would be my picks.

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    Re: 2007 Hall of Fame Ballot Released (let the McGwire controversy begin)

    I'd vote for him. We don't know what he did or didn't take. At the time, it wasn't a violation of league rules and there was no testing. He obviously had a lot of natural talent anyway since steroids don't magically make you able to hit a baseball. Some of his historical predecessors were taking greenies and we don't hold that against them.

    (Anyway, Maybe Dunn should talk to him. Up until age 27, his career numbers look very similar to Dunn's.)

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    Big Red Machine RedsBaron's Avatar
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    Re: 2007 Hall of Fame Ballot Released (let the McGwire controversy begin)

    Gossage, Gwynn and Ripken are the three guys I would definitely vote for.
    There are a host of guys on that ballot that I would seriously consider, including Belle, Blyleven, Concepcion, Dawson, John, Mattingly, Morris, Murphy, Parker, Rice, Smith and Trammell. In each case, there is already one or more players or pitchers in the Hall of Fame who was less deserving of enshrinement than each of those guys are--not that that is enough to necessarily justify inducting them into the HOF, but it is enough to at least give each of them a look.
    McGwire? Were I allowed to vote, I would refuse to elect on the first ballot anybody whom I suspected of having used steroids or other chemical enhancements. I'd still have another 14 chances to reconsider, but not on the first ballot. Wait your turn, McGwire.
    "Hey...Dad. Wanna Have A Catch?" Kevin Costner in "Field Of Dreams."

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    Oy Vey! Red in Chicago's Avatar
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    Re: 2007 Hall of Fame Ballot Released (let the McGwire controversy begin)

    Quote Originally Posted by RedsBaron View Post
    McGwire? Were I allowed to vote, I would refuse to elect on the first ballot anybody whom I suspected of having used steroids or other chemical enhancements. I'd still have another 14 chances to reconsider, but not on the first ballot. Wait your turn, McGwire.
    i absolutely agree with keeping mcgwire off the first year ballot...while some say your either a hall of famer or you're not, there is something special about making it your first year and i don't think he deserves this...

    my ballot would be:
    gwynn
    ripken
    concepcion
    trammell
    dawson

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    Member Jpup's Avatar
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    Re: 2007 Hall of Fame Ballot Released (let the McGwire controversy begin)

    McGwire
    Ripken
    Gwynn
    Dawson
    Gossage
    John
    Smith
    "My mission is to be the ray of hope, the guy who stands out there on that beautiful field and owns up to his mistakes and lets people know it's never completely hopeless, no matter how bad it seems at the time. I have a platform and a message, and now I go to bed at night, sober and happy, praying I can be a good messenger." -Josh Hamilton

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    Re: 2007 Hall of Fame Ballot Released (let the McGwire controversy begin)

    Quote Originally Posted by Red in Chicago View Post
    i absolutely agree with keeping mcgwire off the first year ballot...while some say your either a hall of famer or you're not, there is something special about making it your first year and i don't think he deserves this...

    my ballot would be:
    gwynn
    ripken
    concepcion
    trammell
    dawson
    Either McGwire is a hall of famer or not, whats the point of not voting him in on the first ballot. Personally I dont think he merits being in the hall, he was basically a one trick pony.
    I was in the ORG once, best 6 months of my life.

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    Harry Chiti Fan registerthis's Avatar
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    Re: 2007 Hall of Fame Ballot Released (let the McGwire controversy begin)

    Quote Originally Posted by terminator View Post
    I'd vote for him. We don't know what he did or didn't take. At the time, it wasn't a violation of league rules and there was no testing.
    ...and HoF ballot voting isn't coupled with any rule that states players who technically broke no rules must be voted for, all other things being equal. HoF voters may vote for whomever on the list they feel is deserving, for whatever reason they deem acceptable.

    Somehow I doubt that most people's feelings about McGwire will be tempered with the "he didn't technically break any rules" line of thought. My guess is, most people view McGwire as a steroid user. And most people view that as a negative attribute.
    We'll burn that bridge when we get to it.

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    Kmac5 KoryMac5's Avatar
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    Re: 2007 Hall of Fame Ballot Released (let the McGwire controversy begin)

    Quote Originally Posted by registerthis View Post
    ...and HoF ballot voting isn't coupled with any rule that states players who technically broke no rules must be voted for, all other things being equal. HoF voters may vote for whomever on the list they feel is deserving, for whatever reason they deem acceptable.

    Somehow I doubt that most people's feelings about McGwire will be tempered with the "he didn't technically break any rules" line of thought. My guess is, most people view McGwire as a steroid user. And most people view that as a negative attribute.
    If that's the case can we remove Don Sutton from enshrinement.

  10. #10
    Member Redny's Avatar
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    Re: 2007 Hall of Fame Ballot Released (let the McGwire controversy begin)

    Ripken, Gwynn, Gossage, John, Smith, Concepcion

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    Re: 2007 Hall of Fame Ballot Released (let the McGwire controversy begin)

    Andre Dawson
    Cal Ripken
    Gwynn
    http://www.ohiosportsfans.com
    GREAT BENGALS FORUM!

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    Re: 2007 Hall of Fame Ballot Released (let the McGwire controversy begin)

    Wow, can I ask Slyder why he passed on Gwynn?
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    Re: 2007 Hall of Fame Ballot Released (let the McGwire controversy begin)

    Quote Originally Posted by Aceking View Post
    Wow, can I ask Slyder why he passed on Gwynn?
    He played in a lot of games, but by doing so he played with a lot of nagging injuries that kept his numbers very pedestrian. Plus a lot of that I just wanted a 'Homer' post and vote all the Reds in.

    Honestly though my prediction:
    Gwynn
    Rice
    Blyleven
    Cal (on the back of his games played streak)

    After this I think there will be enough splitting of votes that there wont be a fifth member inducted. But if there is I think it comes down to Goose and Dawson.
    I think enough people will leave McGwire off their ballots because of the "questions" to leave him out in the cold this year.
    Last edited by Slyder; 11-27-2006 at 07:45 PM.

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    Re: 2007 Hall of Fame Ballot Released (let the McGwire controversy begin)

    Ripken=overrated IMO
    I was in the ORG once, best 6 months of my life.

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    Member Number_Fourteen's Avatar
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    Re: 2007 Hall of Fame Ballot Released (let the McGwire controversy begin)

    Quote Originally Posted by redsfanmia View Post
    Ripken=overrated IMO
    The Streak=overrated


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