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Thread: 2007 Hall of Fame Ballot Released (let the McGwire controversy begin)

  1. #16
    Member Jpup's Avatar
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    Re: 2007 Hall of Fame Ballot Released (let the McGwire controversy begin)

    Quote Originally Posted by dougflynn23 View Post
    Bert Blyleven...would those who are not voting for him explain why you are leaving a 280 game winner with 3,700 career strikeouts off your ballots?

    Rich Gossage, Tony Gwynn, and Cal Ripken.
    300 is the magic number for wins, not 280.
    "My mission is to be the ray of hope, the guy who stands out there on that beautiful field and owns up to his mistakes and lets people know it's never completely hopeless, no matter how bad it seems at the time. I have a platform and a message, and now I go to bed at night, sober and happy, praying I can be a good messenger." -Josh Hamilton

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  3. #17
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    Re: 2007 Hall of Fame Ballot Released (let the McGwire controversy begin)

    Quote Originally Posted by Aceking View Post
    Wow, can I ask Slyder why he passed on Gwynn?
    He played in a lot of games, but by doing so he played with a lot of nagging injuries that kept his numbers very pedestrian. Plus a lot of that I just wanted a 'Homer' post and vote all the Reds in.

    Honestly though my prediction:
    Gwynn
    Rice
    Blyleven
    Cal (on the back of his games played streak)

    After this I think there will be enough splitting of votes that there wont be a fifth member inducted. But if there is I think it comes down to Goose and Dawson.
    I think enough people will leave McGwire off their ballots because of the "questions" to leave him out in the cold this year.
    Last edited by Slyder; 11-27-2006 at 06:45 PM.

  4. #18
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    Re: 2007 Hall of Fame Ballot Released (let the McGwire controversy begin)

    [QUOTE=dougflynn23;1200164] Bert Blyleven...would those who are not voting for him explain why you are leaving a 280 game winner with 3,700 career strikeouts off your ballots?

    He won 20 games once he lost 250 games. Good pitcher yes, HOF no. I don't understand why people want to dilute what the HOF is all about. I think a player shoud get one chance at it from the writers then another with the Veterans Committee.

  5. #19
    Harry Chiti Fan registerthis's Avatar
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    Re: 2007 Hall of Fame Ballot Released (let the McGwire controversy begin)

    Quote Originally Posted by terminator View Post
    I'd vote for him. We don't know what he did or didn't take. At the time, it wasn't a violation of league rules and there was no testing.
    ...and HoF ballot voting isn't coupled with any rule that states players who technically broke no rules must be voted for, all other things being equal. HoF voters may vote for whomever on the list they feel is deserving, for whatever reason they deem acceptable.

    Somehow I doubt that most people's feelings about McGwire will be tempered with the "he didn't technically break any rules" line of thought. My guess is, most people view McGwire as a steroid user. And most people view that as a negative attribute.
    We'll burn that bridge when we get to it.

  6. #20
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    Re: 2007 Hall of Fame Ballot Released (let the McGwire controversy begin)

    Quote Originally Posted by Red in Chicago View Post
    i absolutely agree with keeping mcgwire off the first year ballot...while some say your either a hall of famer or you're not, there is something special about making it your first year and i don't think he deserves this...

    my ballot would be:
    gwynn
    ripken
    concepcion
    trammell
    dawson
    Either McGwire is a hall of famer or not, whats the point of not voting him in on the first ballot. Personally I dont think he merits being in the hall, he was basically a one trick pony.
    I was in the ORG once, best 6 months of my life.

  7. #21
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    Re: 2007 Hall of Fame Ballot Released (let the McGwire controversy begin)

    Gwynn
    Gossage
    Ripken
    Dawson
    Concepcion

    Those would be my votes...

  8. #22
    Maple SERP savafan's Avatar
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    Re: 2007 Hall of Fame Ballot Released (let the McGwire controversy begin)

    Quote Originally Posted by Col_ IN Reds fan View Post

    He won 20 games once he lost 250 games. Good pitcher yes, HOF no. I don't understand why people want to dilute what the HOF is all about. I think a player shoud get one chance at it from the writers then another with the Veterans Committee.
    I don't exactly think wins and losses is the best way to rate pitchers.
    My dad got to enjoy 3 Reds World Championships by the time he was my age. So far, I've only gotten to enjoy one. Step it up Redlegs!

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    Re: 2007 Hall of Fame Ballot Released (let the McGwire controversy begin)

    The person that brought his name up first here used the 280 wins. I just used the 250 losses. I didn't say it was a good way to rate them , but it is a pretty important stat. If we have to debate about if a player belongs in the HOF and many people are on both sides of this issue , then do you think maybe that player is not a HOFer? Every good player should not get into the HOF. IF Blyleven goes then why not Tommy John or Jim Kaat? These are also pitchers that played forever. And finally sava, if we don't use wons and losses as a guage then what would you suggest?

  10. #24
    Hey Cubs Fans RFS62's Avatar
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    Re: 2007 Hall of Fame Ballot Released (let the McGwire controversy begin)

    Blyleven has been getting jobbed for years. It's time to put him in.

    Gwynn and Ripken are no brainers.

    McGwire...... I'm not here to talk about the past.
    "Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover."
    ~ Mark Twain

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    Re: 2007 Hall of Fame Ballot Released (let the McGwire controversy begin)

    Quote Originally Posted by RFS62 View Post

    McGwire...... I'm not here to talk about the past.
    Well said!

    When he does get in, that should be the only thing on his placque
    My dad got to enjoy 3 Reds World Championships by the time he was my age. So far, I've only gotten to enjoy one. Step it up Redlegs!

  12. #26
    Potential Lunch Winner Dom Heffner's Avatar
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    Re: 2007 Hall of Fame Ballot Released (let the McGwire controversy begin)

    he was basically a one trick pony.
    It just happened to be the most important trick in terms of offense.

    The guy produced runs at an incredible rate.

    I wouldn't vote for him, though.

    On this ballot, for me, it's Ripken and Gwynn.

    Blyleven is deserving, too.
    If you're watchin' a parade, make sure you stand in one spot, don't follow it, it never changes. And if the parade is boring, run in the opposite direction, you will fast-foward the parade. --Mitch Hedberg

  13. #27
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    Re: 2007 Hall of Fame Ballot Released (let the McGwire controversy begin)

    Quote Originally Posted by savafan View Post

    The complete ballot:

    Harold Baines, Albert Belle, Dante Bichette, Bert Blyleven, Bobby Bonilla, Scott Brosius, Jay Buhner, Ken Caminiti, Jose Canseco, Dave Concepcion, Eric Davis, Andre Dawson, Tony Fernandez, Steve Garvey, Rich "Goose" Gossage, Tony Gwynn, Orel Hershiser, Tommy John, Wally Joyner, Don Mattingly, Mark McGwire, Jack Morris, Dale Murphy, Paul O'Neill, Dave Parker, Jim Rice, Cal Ripken Jr., Bret Saberhagen, Lee Smith, Alan Trammell, Devon White, Bobby Witt.
    Andre Dawson, Alan Trammell, and Dale Murphy should get in before Ripken IMO.

  14. #28
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    Re: 2007 Hall of Fame Ballot Released (let the McGwire controversy begin)

    Quote Originally Posted by Patpacillosjock View Post
    Andre Dawson, Alan Trammell, and Dale Murphy should get in before Ripken IMO.
    It's sad that Murphy will probably never make it in, as he was always one of my favorites to watch and was dominant for quite a while.
    My dad got to enjoy 3 Reds World Championships by the time he was my age. So far, I've only gotten to enjoy one. Step it up Redlegs!

  15. #29
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    Re: 2007 Hall of Fame Ballot Released (let the McGwire controversy begin)

    The AP polled 125 out of approximately 575 eligible HOF voters regarding McGwire, asking if they would select McGwire for the HOF. 18% responded "yes", 59% responded "no or probably no", and 22% "other." I have no idea what "other" meant, but if the poll acurately predicts HOF voting this year, McGwire shouldn't plan on a trip to Cooperstwon anytime soon.
    "Hey...Dad. Wanna Have A Catch?" Kevin Costner in "Field Of Dreams."

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    Re: 2007 Hall of Fame Ballot Released (let the McGwire controversy begin)

    Quote Originally Posted by redsfanmia View Post
    Ripken=overrated IMO
    For all his consistency in showing up to play, Ripken was often very inconsistent season to season in his offensive contribution, but in his best seasons he was very, very good, and a great shortstop. He had seasons with Win Share totals of 23,35,37,25,28,20,25,26,20,34,21,17,18,16,22,18,13 ,12 on his way to a career total of 427. By way of comparsion, Barry Larkin had Win Share seasons of 6,11,28,15,25,26,32,18,19,30,31,12,25 and 24 on his way to a career total, through 2001, of 320.
    "Hey...Dad. Wanna Have A Catch?" Kevin Costner in "Field Of Dreams."


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