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View Poll Results: Which shortstops belong in the RedsZone Hall of Fame?

Voters
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  • Luis Aparicio

    13 41.94%
  • Dave Bancroft

    1 3.23%
  • Bert Campaneris

    4 12.90%
  • Ray Chapman

    0 0%
  • Davey Concepcion

    18 58.06%
  • Al Dark

    0 0%
  • Art Fletcher

    0 0%
  • Jim Fregosi

    2 6.45%
  • Jack Glasscock

    4 12.90%
  • Travis Jackson

    2 6.45%
  • Hughie Jennings

    7 22.58%
  • Eddie Joost

    1 3.23%
  • Pop Lloyd

    10 32.26%
  • Herman Long

    2 6.45%
  • Dick Lundy

    2 6.45%
  • Rabbit Maranville

    15 48.39%
  • Dobie Moore

    1 3.23%
  • Johnny Pesky

    2 6.45%
  • Rico Petrocelli

    0 0%
  • Bill Riggins

    1 3.23%
  • Cal Ripken, Jr.

    31 100.00%
  • Phil Rizzuto

    4 12.90%
  • Joe Sewell

    0 0%
  • Vern Stephens

    1 3.23%
  • Joe Tinker

    2 6.45%
  • Alan Trammell

    18 58.06%
  • Bobby Wallace

    1 3.23%
  • Monte Ward

    7 22.58%
  • Willie Wells

    7 22.58%
  • Maury Wills

    7 22.58%
Multiple Choice Poll.
Results 1 to 9 of 9

Thread: RedsZone Hall of Fame, Version 2006-07 - Shortstops

  1. #1
    Playoffs Cyclone792's Avatar
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    RedsZone Hall of Fame, Version 2006-07 - Shortstops

    Vote for all SHORTSTOPS you believe should be in the RedsZone Hall of Fame. This is a multiple-choice poll so you're allowed to vote for more than one player.

    For reference purposes: Major League Baseball Hall of Fame Shortstops

    Previously Elected Shortstops: Luke Appling, Ernie Banks, Lou Boudreau, Joe Cronin, Bill Dahlen, George Davis, Pee Wee Reese, Ozzie Smith, Arky Vaughan, Honus Wagner, & Robin Yount

    Dropped From Ballot: Dick Bartell, Donie Bush, Dick Groat, Johnny Logan, Marty Marion, Ed McKean, Roger Peckinpaugh, Gary Templeton, & Cecil Travis

    Players from earlier eras may be lesser known among some RedsZone voters, but in the efforts of encouraging everybody to vote while also maintaining a somewhat level playing field for all eligible candidates, we've instituted a tier system for support needed to gain election ...
    • Negro Leaguers: Need 3/8 support
    • 19th century (i.e. pre 1903): Need 2/5 support
    • Early Modern (roughly 1903-1945): Need 1/2 support
    • Integration (roughly 1945-1970): Need 5/8 support
    • Post Integration (roughly 1970-present): Need 2/3 support

    The charts below are win shares data for all candidates. In order from left to right, the columns are career win shares, five-year peak win shares, win shares per 162 games, win shares during a player's top season and the predominant era each player played in (for purposes of the tier voting system). Happy voting!
    Code:
    Player          Career WS   Peak WS   WS per 162  Top Season       Era
    Luis Aparicio       293         92       18.26         22       Integration
    Dave Bancroft       269        115       22.78         31       Early Modern to WWII
    Bert Campaneris     280        109       19.48         29       Post Integration
    Ray Chapman         148         99       22.81         30       Early Modern to WWII
    Dave Concepcion     269        111       17.52         25       Post Integration
    Al Dark             226        118       20.03         28       Integration
    Art Fletcher        218        116       23.04         27       Early Modern to WWII
    Jim Fregosi         261        135       22.23         33       Integration
    Jack Glasscock      261        108       24.36         27       19th Century
    Travis Jackson      211        109       20.64         24       Early Modern to WWII
    Hughie Jennings     214        150       26.98         36       19th Century
    Eddie Joost*        209        126       21.51         35       Integration
    Pop Lloyd           --------------- NEGRO LEAGUES ----------------------------------
    Herman Long         265        120       22.91         29       19th Century
    Dick Lundy          --------------- NEGRO LEAGUES ----------------------------------
    
    * Missed playing time due to WWII
    Code:
    Player          Career WS   Peak WS   WS per 162  Top Season       Era
    Rabbit Maranville   302        110       18.32         27       Early Modern to WWII
    Dobie Moore         --------------- NEGRO LEAGUES ----------------------------------
    Johnny Pesky*       187        130       23.85         34       Integration
    Rico Petrocelli     205        125       21.38         37       Post Integration
    Bill Riggins        --------------- NEGRO LEAGUES ----------------------------------
    Cal Ripken, Jr.     436        160       23.54         37       Post Integration
    Phil Rizzuto*       231        121       22.53         35       Integration
    Joe Sewell          277        125       23.58         29       Early Modern to WWII
    Vern Stephens       265        129       24.96         34       Integration
    Joe Tinker          258        118       23.18         32       Early Modern to WWII
    Alan Trammell       318        132       22.47         35       Post Integration
    Bobby Wallace       345        112       23.45         26       Early Modern to WWII
    Monte Ward**        409        188       36.31         51       19th Century
    Willie Wells        --------------- NEGRO LEAGUES ----------------------------------
    Maury Wills         253        128       21.11         32       Integration
    
    * Missed playing time due to WWII
    ** Accumulated 42 percent of his win shares as a pitcher
    Barry Larkin - HOF, 2012

    Put an end to the Lost Decade.

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  3. #2
    breath westofyou's Avatar
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    Re: RedsZone Hall of Fame, Version 2006-07 - Shortstops

    Monte Ward was more Tony Phillips then a world class SS wouldn't you say? His window as a FT SS was a small window in between pitching and playing league president and second base after that.

    Glasscock, the Judas of the Players League and Rabbit both get my vote.

  4. #3
    Playoffs Cyclone792's Avatar
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    Re: RedsZone Hall of Fame, Version 2006-07 - Shortstops

    Quote Originally Posted by westofyou View Post
    Monte Ward was more Tony Phillips then a world class SS wouldn't you say? His window as a FT SS was a small window in between pitching and playing league president and second base after that.

    Glasscock, the Judas of the Players League and Rabbit both get my vote.
    Yea, I'd say that's pretty much right about Ward. I was just stuck in the conundrum of what position to label him as. He's an odd player with seven seasons as a shortstop, six as a pitcher, and three more as a second baseman. He was above average everywhere he went, though not necessarily terribly dominant anywhere.

    I haven't voted yet, but Pop Lloyd and Willie Wells are the two Negro Leaguers I absolutely plan on voting for. Lloyd may be one of the greatest players in baseball history that many people have never even heard of.
    Barry Larkin - HOF, 2012

    Put an end to the Lost Decade.

  5. #4
    Member chicoruiz's Avatar
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    Re: RedsZone Hall of Fame, Version 2006-07 - Shortstops

    Voted for Ripken, Lloyd, Ward (beacuse I'm guessing this will be my only chance to vote for him), and Herman Long. Long won't make it, and that's OK with me; I'm sure WOY knows more about him than I do and WOY didn't vote for him. But he's an underappreciated player in my book (as are several of the Boston Beaneaters) and I just wanted the opportunity to mention him.
    "In baseball, you don't know nothin'"...Yogi Berra

  6. #5
    breath westofyou's Avatar
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    Re: RedsZone Hall of Fame, Version 2006-07 - Shortstops

    Quote Originally Posted by chicoruiz View Post
    Voted for Ripken, Lloyd, Ward (beacuse I'm guessing this will be my only chance to vote for him), and Herman Long. Long won't make it, and that's OK with me; I'm sure WOY knows more about him than I do and WOY didn't vote for him. But he's an underappreciated player in my book (as are several of the Boston Beaneaters) and I just wanted the opportunity to mention him.
    I would put Long in the Travis Jackson/Cecil Travis range, steady SS who experienced career years in a huge hitters era. But true, he is overlooked. As is the 1890 Beaneaters, how fast they lost the town the Red Sox a decade later.

  7. #6
    Playoffs Cyclone792's Avatar
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    Re: RedsZone Hall of Fame, Version 2006-07 - Shortstops

    There's been lots of discussion about Davey Concepcion's merits for the National Baseball Hall of Fame ... maybe he'll make the RedsZone Hall of Fame.

    Here's my ballot, which includes the two greatest Negro League shortstops in Pop Lloyd and Willie Wells ...

    Davey Concepcion
    Hughie Jennings
    Pop Lloyd
    Rabbit Maranville
    Cal Ripken, Jr.
    Alan Trammell
    Bobby Wallace
    Monte Ward
    Willie Wells

    This poll will be open until January 10th so there's still plenty of time to vote.
    Barry Larkin - HOF, 2012

    Put an end to the Lost Decade.

  8. #7
    Member Highlifeman21's Avatar
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    Re: RedsZone Hall of Fame, Version 2006-07 - Shortstops

    Quote Originally Posted by Cyclone792 View Post
    There's been lots of discussion about Davey Concepcion's merits for the National Baseball Hall of Fame ... maybe he'll make the RedsZone Hall of Fame.

    Here's my ballot, which includes the two greatest Negro League shortstops in Pop Lloyd and Willie Wells ...

    Davey Concepcion
    Hughie Jennings
    Pop Lloyd
    Rabbit Maranville
    Cal Ripken, Jr.
    Alan Trammell
    Bobby Wallace
    Monte Ward
    Willie Wells

    This poll will be open until January 10th so there's still plenty of time to vote.
    IMO, Concepcion was too much a glove man and didn't carry a big enough stick to warrant HOF enshrinement. I just don't think his D was enough to push him over the edge to compensate for the lack of O. His bat was never a liability, but I just don't see him as a top 15 SS of all time, and I think that will ultimately hurt his HOF chances.

  9. #8
    Knowledge Is Good Big Klu's Avatar
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    Re: RedsZone Hall of Fame, Version 2006-07 - Shortstops

    I realize that I am late, and you have every right to throw my ballot out altogether, but if possible I would like to vote for:

    Aparicio, Concepcion, Jennings, Maranville, Pesky, Ripken, Rizzuto, Sewell, Stephens, Trammell, and Ward.


    Again, I'm sorry that I'm late--I've never missed a ballot, and I hope mine can be included.

    Also, I'm saddened by the total lack of support for Joe Sewell, who deserves better than to be shut out.
    Eric Stratton, Rush Chairman. Damn glad to meet ya.

  10. #9
    Playoffs Cyclone792's Avatar
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    Re: RedsZone Hall of Fame, Version 2006-07 - Shortstops

    Quote Originally Posted by Big Klu View Post
    I realize that I am late, and you have every right to throw my ballot out altogether, but if possible I would like to vote for:

    Aparicio, Concepcion, Jennings, Maranville, Pesky, Ripken, Rizzuto, Sewell, Stephens, Trammell, and Ward.


    Again, I'm sorry that I'm late--I've never missed a ballot, and I hope mine can be included.

    Also, I'm saddened by the total lack of support for Joe Sewell, who deserves better than to be shut out.
    No worries, I've included it! Your ballot actually played a pretty big role as your vote for Rabbit Maranville was the vote he needed for election. He was one vote short before your ballot.

    In addition to Maranville being elected, Cal Ripken, Jr. was also elected, and the fine voters at RedsZone elected Cal with a unanimous 100 percent vote. Imagine that, RedsZone voters just did something that the BBWAA couldn't do. Ripken is the third unanimous selection, joining Johnny Bench and Joe Morgan.

    The total number of shortstops in the RedsZone Hall of Fame is now 13:
    Code:
    Shortstops (13)
                    
    Luke Appling          
    Ernie Banks           
    Lou Boudreau          
    Joe Cronin            
    Bill Dahlen           
    George Davis 
    Rabbit Maranville         
    Pee Wee Reese    
    Cal Ripken, Jr.    
    Ozzie Smith           
    Arky Vaughan          
    Honus Wagner          
    Robin Yount
    The Left Fielders Ballot is now open and will remain open until January 22nd. I'll probably get the center fielder ballot up next week also so keep a watch for that.
    Barry Larkin - HOF, 2012

    Put an end to the Lost Decade.


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