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Thread: Duke Players allowed back to class

  1. #16
    MLB Baseball Razor Shines's Avatar
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    Re: Duke Players allowed back to class

    Dam the logic, full spleen ahead. Whatever happened at this stag party, very few people dispute that it involved more than a few fun loving college kids having a couple of beers. In fact members of the Duke La Crosse Team had been out of control for quite some time- they had been involved in 36 on campus incidents since 2003 (SI, 6/06). Fifteen players have been cited by Durham police for offenses over the last three years. One of them had been charged with assulting a man for being a homosexual. One of the players apparently sent an e-mail after the party saying he wanted to invite more strippers to his dorm room, kill them and skin them.
    Ok so you've never quoted things from a movie that you didn't actually mean, just messing around with your friends? Because I'm pretty sure that's from American Psycho.


    Does such dangerous out of control conduct justify false accusations by government authorities? Of course not.
    I do agree that they put themselves in that position and if it were my son I'd be plenty pissed at him.
    "I know a lot about the law and various other lawyerings."

    Hitters who avoid outs are the funnest.


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  3. #17
    MLB Baseball Razor Shines's Avatar
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    Re: Duke Players allowed back to class

    Quote Originally Posted by RedsBaron View Post
    He is under investigation. That investigation should be allowed to take its course, but it certainly appears that Nifong was playing politics when he charged the players; if he knowingly withheld evidence, as has been alleged, he should be disbarred IMO.
    Well as of two months ago he admitted in court that he had not actually interviewed the accuser about the events of that night. He said he'd talked to her but not about what happened that night. And while I don't think that's breaking any law, it does seem extremely lazy at the very least.
    "I know a lot about the law and various other lawyerings."

    Hitters who avoid outs are the funnest.

  4. #18
    Class of 2023 George Foster's Avatar
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    Re: Duke Players allowed back to class

    You should not be allowed to erase your post because someone "won the debate." That's cowardly.:thumbdown
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  5. #19
    Class of 2023 George Foster's Avatar
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    Re: Duke Players allowed back to class

    [QUOTE=Mutaman;1221691]
    Quote Originally Posted by George Foster View Post
    Let me get this straight. If your rich it's ok to accuse you of rape.

    How would you like to be charged with rape at age 20, just because you had a couple of beers at a "stag party?" QUOTE]


    Dam the logic, full spleen ahead. Whatever happened at this stag party, very few people dispute that it involved more than a few fun loving college kids having a couple of beers. In fact members of the Duke La Crosse Team had been out of control for quite some time- they had been involved in 36 on campus incidents since 2003 (SI, 6/06). Fifteen players have been cited by Durham police for offenses over the last three years. One of them had been charged with assulting a man for being a homosexual. One of the players apparently sent an e-mail after the party saying he wanted to invite more strippers to his dorm room, kill them and skin them.

    Many Duke authorities felt that this situation boiled over because the teams coach too often looked the other way. "Do you think [Duke basketball coach] Mike Krzyzewski would've put up with this s--- for five seconds?" says one university official. "The answer is no." (SI,June 2006).

    Does such dangerous out of control conduct justify false accusations by government authorities? Of course not.

    If these kids suffered damages, should they be allowed to pursue their remedies? Of course they should and most of them have the means to do so. My bet is they won't because its in their interest to let sleeping dogs lie.

    So while I'd like to feel sympathy for these poor damaged kids ( I mean you spend $1,600 for a couple of strippers to show up at your party and this is what you get for your investment), I have a feeling they will make out just fine.
    I agree these guys obviously did not attend Sunday school, but A does not
    =B. Just because your a rich jerk, does not mean you can get charged with rape, and people should have the attitude "you got what was coming to you." Thats just a wrong attitude to have. If you have that attitude, you have some issues of bitterness towards people with more money than yourself.
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  6. #20
    Smooth WMR's Avatar
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    Re: Duke Players allowed back to class

    It's alright. There's a contingent of liberals out there who have made it their personal goal to carry political correctness to its logical conclusion and make anyone who has achieved any measure of success in their lives somehow not worthy of the same rights and protections afforded the F-ups of the world.
    Last edited by WMR; 01-04-2007 at 01:21 PM.

  7. #21
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    Re: Duke Players allowed back to class

    Quote Originally Posted by WilyMoROCKS View Post
    It's alright. There's a contingent of liberals out there who have made it their personal goal to carry political correctness to its logical conclusion and make anyone who has achieved any measure of success in their lives somehow not worthy of the same rights and protections afforded the F-ups of the world.
    Or, Nifong is just a bad guy.

    Personally, I think everyone in this scenario (DA, players, "entertainers") are world-class piles of crap and I wish it would just be resolved through the courts and go the hell away.

    Nifong should be disbarred and removed from office.
    The players should be entitled to pursue their remedies against the strippers (although there is no money there, they can at least get legal vindication which counts for a lot) and the school.
    The coach should be allowed to go after the school for wrongful termination.
    The strippers should be subject to criminal charges for filing false police reports.
    The players can go back to being the same sort of disgusting privileged meatheads they were before the incident.

    What people don't need to do is use it to make blanket assumptions about "liberals" or "reactionaries" or use it as a way to paint sexual assault victims as liars.

    We had a situation in Nevada where the governor-elect was accused of sexual assault for attacking a woman in a parking garage after hammering about a million glasses of wine at a Vegas restaurant. He got off, largely because his rich friends (aka political donors) in the Clark County DA's office, on the editorial board of the LV Review-Journal and elsewhere covered it up (including "misplacing" the security video for two weeks) and turned it into a blame the victim spectacle, using this Duke debacle as justification. Now, that's disgusting.

  8. #22
    Smooth WMR's Avatar
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    Re: Duke Players allowed back to class

    Quote Originally Posted by dsmith421 View Post
    Or, Nifong is just a bad guy.

    Personally, I think everyone in this scenario (DA, players, "entertainers") are world-class piles of crap and I wish it would just be resolved through the courts and go the hell away.

    Nifong should be disbarred and removed from office.
    The players should be entitled to pursue their remedies against the strippers (although there is no money there, they can at least get legal vindication which counts for a lot) and the school.
    The coach should be allowed to go after the school for wrongful termination.
    The strippers should be subject to criminal charges for filing false police reports.
    The players can go back to being the same sort of disgusting privileged meatheads they were before the incident.

    What people don't need to do is use it to make blanket assumptions about "liberals" or "reactionaries" or use it as a way to paint sexual assault victims as liars.

    We had a situation in Nevada where the governor-elect was accused of sexual assault for attacking a woman in a parking garage after hammering about a million glasses of wine at a Vegas restaurant. He got off, largely because his rich friends (aka political donors) in the Clark County DA's office, on the editorial board of the LV Review-Journal and elsewhere covered it up (including "misplacing" the security video for two weeks) and turned it into a blame the victim spectacle, using this Duke debacle as justification. Now, that's disgusting.
    The issues I was addressing are larger and much more systemic in American culture rather than any sort of implied blanket commentary on sexual assault victims.
    Last edited by WMR; 01-04-2007 at 01:54 PM.

  9. #23
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    Re: Duke Players allowed back to class

    Let me make this perfectly clear. I have no problems with rich people. Hell, some of my best friends are rich people. It's the Republicans I have a problem with.

  10. #24
    SERP Emeritus paintmered's Avatar
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    Re: Duke Players allowed back to class

    Ahem.....

    Political discussion and flash photography are prohibited inside the thread.
    All models are wrong. Some of them are useful.

  11. #25
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    Re: Duke Players allowed back to class

    Quote Originally Posted by paintmered View Post
    Ahem.....

    Political discussion and flash photography are prohibited inside the thread.
    OK fine...I'll put the camera away.

  12. #26
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    Re: Duke Players allowed back to class

    Quote Originally Posted by Mutaman View Post
    Let me make this perfectly clear. I have no problems with rich people. Hell, some of my best friends are rich people. It's the Republicans I have a problem with.
    I'm a libertarian and I dislike them both nowadays. Without creating a political debate, it's just really amazing how the Republican party has changed the past 25 or so years.

  13. #27
    Passion for the game Team Clark's Avatar
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    Re: Duke Players allowed back to class

    Quote Originally Posted by dsmith421 View Post
    Or, Nifong is just a bad guy.

    Personally, I think everyone in this scenario (DA, players, "entertainers") are world-class piles of crap and I wish it would just be resolved through the courts and go the hell away.

    Nifong should be disbarred and removed from office.
    The players should be entitled to pursue their remedies against the strippers (although there is no money there, they can at least get legal vindication which counts for a lot) and the school.
    The coach should be allowed to go after the school for wrongful termination.
    The strippers should be subject to criminal charges for filing false police reports.
    The players can go back to being the same sort of disgusting privileged meatheads they were before the incident.

    What people don't need to do is use it to make blanket assumptions about "liberals" or "reactionaries" or use it as a way to paint sexual assault victims as liars.

    We had a situation in Nevada where the governor-elect was accused of sexual assault for attacking a woman in a parking garage after hammering about a million glasses of wine at a Vegas restaurant. He got off, largely because his rich friends (aka political donors) in the Clark County DA's office, on the editorial board of the LV Review-Journal and elsewhere covered it up (including "misplacing" the security video for two weeks) and turned it into a blame the victim spectacle, using this Duke debacle as justification. Now, that's disgusting.

    I certainly agree with the Mods that we need to keep the Political Discussion out of this conversation. A bit difficult I know, but not impossible.

    Rich, Poor, Black, White, whatever we can discuss this without an agenda.

    I started this thread because this subject has bothered me something awful and I am glad these kids are getting some justification. I was leary of the charges in the beginning because of the lack of evidence. Not to say I was right or anything like that. Just because I didn't "hear" or "see" anything did not equal a hill of beans. I reserved judgement on any one of the LAX players or the strippers because I know that I was in no way Privy to the Investigation or the evidence. NOW, that the information is coming out in a factual manner I can make a better informed opinion.

    They may still be guilty of crimes but it is becoming more and more clear that a "rape" did not take place. I do find it strange that the Crimes they are still being charged with carry the same or worse penalties.
    It's absolutely pathetic that people can't have an opinion from actually watching games and supplementing that with stats. If you voice an opinion that doesn't fit into a black/white box you will get completely misrepresented and basically called a tobacco chewing traditionalist...
    Cedric 3/24/08

  14. #28
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    Re: Duke Players allowed back to class

    Quote Originally Posted by Team Clark View Post
    I certainly agree with the Mods that we need to keep the Political Discussion out of this conversation. A bit difficult I know, but not impossible.

    Rich, Poor, Black, White, whatever we can discuss this without an agenda.

    I started this thread because this subject has bothered me something awful and I am glad these kids are getting some justification. I was leary of the charges in the beginning because of the lack of evidence. Not to say I was right or anything like that. Just because I didn't "hear" or "see" anything did not equal a hill of beans. I reserved judgement on any one of the LAX players or the strippers because I know that I was in no way Privy to the Investigation or the evidence. NOW, that the information is coming out in a factual manner I can make a better informed opinion.

    They may still be guilty of crimes but it is becoming more and more clear that a "rape" did not take place. I do find it strange that the Crimes they are still being charged with carry the same or worse penalties.
    It's called "CYA."

    The prosecutor doesn't want to get disbarred, getting ANYTHING against these guys would go a long way towards ensuring that doesn't happen.

    I think he's up S-creek w/o a paddle. JMO.

  15. #29
    Passion for the game Team Clark's Avatar
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    Re: Duke Players allowed back to class

    Quote Originally Posted by WilyMoROCKS View Post
    I'm a libertarian and I dislike them both nowadays. Without creating a political debate, it's just really amazing how the Republican party has changed the past 25 or so years.
    Just think what the Federalists and the Labour Party would say...
    It's absolutely pathetic that people can't have an opinion from actually watching games and supplementing that with stats. If you voice an opinion that doesn't fit into a black/white box you will get completely misrepresented and basically called a tobacco chewing traditionalist...
    Cedric 3/24/08

  16. #30
    Passion for the game Team Clark's Avatar
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    Re: Duke Players allowed back to class

    Quote Originally Posted by WilyMoROCKS View Post
    It's called "CYA."

    The prosecutor doesn't want to get disbarred, getting ANYTHING against these guys would go a long way towards ensuring that doesn't happen.

    I think he's up S-creek w/o a paddle. JMO.
    I bet he's mighty PO'd that the LAB came out against him. Doooh!! Makes you wonder how many times that he has ordered that same lab to do it in the past. As Velma would say "Jinkies"...
    It's absolutely pathetic that people can't have an opinion from actually watching games and supplementing that with stats. If you voice an opinion that doesn't fit into a black/white box you will get completely misrepresented and basically called a tobacco chewing traditionalist...
    Cedric 3/24/08


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