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Thread: NFL Playoffs = crapfest

  1. #31
    For a Level Playing Field RedFanAlways1966's Avatar
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    Re: NFL Playoffs = crapfest

    Quote Originally Posted by redsfanmia View Post
    A good start would be to get guys who dont get arrested every other week. Character matters and Marvin needs to learn that. Bad character guys ruin teams, see T.O., Artest, and Isiah Rider.
    I don't like trouble-makers. However, relative to the Bengals, I am not sure this cost the Bengals the playoffs. Things that were more detrimental to not making the playoffs (only took one more win to get there):

    (1) A horrific roughing the passer call in Tampa Bay.
    (2) A bad defense (something Bengals fans are all too used to). 42 points to San Diego in the 2nd half... no NFL defense should be that bad (L.T. or not).
    (3) A bad snap on an extra point.
    (4) A missed 39-yd. FG on their last offensive play of the season.

    Trouble-makers are not good things. But a trouble-maker off the field (getting arrested) is different than a trouble-maker in the lockerroom (T.O. or Carl Pickens) relative to the team's psyche. Execution killed the Bengals playoff chances, not trouble-makers. Oh, and one terrible call by a referee named Mike Carey.
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  3. #32
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    Re: NFL Playoffs = crapfest

    Quote Originally Posted by RedFanAlways1966 View Post
    I don't like trouble-makers. However, relative to the Bengals, I am not sure this cost the Bengals the playoffs. Things that were more detrimental to not making the playoffs (only took one more win to get there):

    (1) A horrific roughing the passer call in Tampa Bay.
    (2) A bad defense (something Bengals fans are all too used to). 42 points to San Diego in the 2nd half... no NFL defense should be that bad (L.T. or not).
    (3) A bad snap on an extra point.
    (4) A missed 39-yd. FG on their last offensive play of the season.

    Trouble-makers are not good things. But a trouble-maker off the field (getting arrested) is different than a trouble-maker in the lockerroom (T.O. or Carl Pickens) relative to the team's psyche. Execution killed the Bengals playoff chances, not trouble-makers. Oh, and one terrible call by a referee named Mike Carey.
    Sounds like a discipline problem to me, lack of discipline off the field creeps onto the field. Marvin needs to get control asap. If say the Colts or Browns had the legal problems the Bengals have had Bengal fans would be all up in arms or if the team was 3-13 Bengal fans would be all up in arms. You can have 2 or 3 bad guys on your team not 10 or 12.
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  4. #33
    Member Razor Shines's Avatar
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    Re: NFL Playoffs = crapfest

    Quote Originally Posted by Mutaman View Post
    3 interceptions at home in a dome against an average team? Not exactly what I'd call a "great" quarterback. A typical mediocre Peyton postseason performance.

    On the other hand, that guy playing against the Jets on Sunday, now thats a great quarterback. A typical incredible Brady postseason performance.
    I'm sorry but two of those INT's were just plain not his fault. Ty Law is in Marvin Harrison's head not Manning's. Marvin broke into the D both times, when 9 times out of 10 (or 8 I guess) Marvin breaks to the outside on those plays. Marvin does weird things against Ty Law, and I am just as big of a Marvin Harrison fan as a Peyton Manning fan. And again 30 of 38 and throwing the TD when they really needed it after the Chiefs cut the lead to 8, and having long drives to keep the D on the bench and rested. Manning has had his struggles in the playoffs but Saturday was not one of those days.

  5. #34
    Potential Lunch Winner Dom Heffner's Avatar
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    Re: NFL Playoffs = crapfest

    Next week we'll see it when the best offense in the NFL is shut down and lucky to score 13 points.
    I'll believe that when I see it. New England is out after this week, I think.

    3 interceptions at home in a dome against an average team? Not exactly what I'd call a "great" quarterback. A typical mediocre Peyton postseason performance.
    Manning is a great quarterback. His performance wasn't that great on Sunday, but only a fool thinks Manning is anything less than superb at his position.

    Character matters
    There have been some real jerks and disruptions who win and there have been some terrific people who lose.

    The Bengals awful season had nothing to do with character issues. There were 4 games they could have won with or without the arrests off the field.

  6. #35
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    Re: NFL Playoffs = crapfest

    [QUOTE=Dom Heffner;1223596]

    Manning is a great quarterback. His performance wasn't that great on Sunday, but only a fool thinks Manning is anything less than superb at his position.
    QUOTE]


    Manning in postseason: 10 games 4 wins 6 losses 16 td passes 11 interceptions

    Brady in postseason: 12 games 11 wins 1 loss 17 td passes 5 interceptions

    If Manning is a "great" quarterback, what do call Brady?

    Although i know its all subjective , just watch these guys in the postseason, Manning always looks tenative, uncomfortable, and uptight. Brady absolutely relishes postseason play. No ifs, ands, or buts. No excuses. No talk about coaching or defense. Tom Brady is the best quarteback in the NFL, and its not even close. Manning has not proven that he can get it done when the money is on the line.

  7. #36
    Making sense of it all Matt700wlw's Avatar
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    Re: NFL Playoffs = crapfest

    Quote Originally Posted by Chip R View Post
    what was Romo's excuse?
    Thinking about going home to Carrie Underwood?

    I could buy that.

  8. #37
    Potential Lunch Winner Dom Heffner's Avatar
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    Re: NFL Playoffs = crapfest

    Manning in postseason: 10 games 4 wins 6 losses 16 td passes 11 interceptions

    Brady in postseason: 12 games 11 wins 1 loss 17 td passes 5 interceptions

    If Manning is a "great" quarterback, what do call Brady?
    A quarterback is not a major league pitcher.

    What is the starting right tackle's for the Colts record as a starter? What is the punter's record?

    Stop treating the quarterback like he is the only player on the field.

    John Elway was better than Joe Montana. Montana played for the better team.

    Last time I checked football is a team sport. Trent Dilfer won a Superbowl. Doug Williams did, too. Are they better than Peyton Manning?

    Stop it with this QB stuff. Anthony Munoz is considered the greatest tackle of all time: how many Super Bowls did he win?

    The QB can be a more prominent position, yes, but there are 21 other guys on the field. Do they count? Or do we just look at the QB?

    Brady is a terrific quarterback, but he has had the better supporting cast over the years: his coach, the defense.

    Is he better than Manning? I think its close. I'd rather have Manning, but I think you can make an argument either way.

    But to lay the post season as the only litmus test on a player is naive.
    Using your logic, John Elway lost four SuperBowls all by himself and then suddenly turned into a great quarterback 10 years later when he "found a way to win and relished the post season..."

    Ya ever think the Broncos won a Super Bowl with Elway as their quarterback when they finally had a real running back and a defense?

    Or did John just go from someone who hated the postseason to somebody who relished it?

    Although i know its all subjective , just watch these guys in the postseason, Manning always looks tenative, uncomfortable, and uptight. Brady absolutely relishes postseason play.
    Wow, you are amazing. You can see that with your own eyes? Is there a "relish" meter I can buy somewhere?

    What does "uncomfortable" look like for a quarterback? Can you also tell me what "scrappy" looks like? Is Brady a "go-getter" too? Does he "hustle"?

  9. #38
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    Re: NFL Playoffs = crapfest

    Trent Dilfer, coaching, Defense, blah, blah, blah. I hate to break it to you buddy, but in the NFL the quarterback has a much bigger bearing on the outcome of a game than the left tackle or the punter. And at least Elway got his team to the Supper Bowl, despite having the hugh homefield advantage produced by a dome and artificial turf, Manning can't even do that.

    Anyhow talk is cheap. Over the last few years the best bet in sports is to go with Brady and against Manning in a big game. Thats why on Sunday I will take Baltimore and give the 4, and take the 5 with New England. With both hands! I'd advise you to do the same.

  10. #39
    Potential Lunch Winner Dom Heffner's Avatar
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    Re: NFL Playoffs = crapfest

    And at least Elway got his team to the Supper Bowl, despite having the hugh homefield advantage produced by a dome and artificial turf, Manning can't even do that.
    John Elway did not get his team to the Super Bowl by himself the years they won it. Terrell Davis helped tremendously along with a great coaching staff and a pretty good defense.

    The years they lost they did so to much better teams. Everybody used to say Elway choked, but it's hard to choke when you are the underdog (and you aren't even the reason). Denver wasn't favored in a single Super Bowl they lost, were they?

    And if I remember correctly, weren't the Broncos the underdog versus the Packers in a dome? I dunno, I'd have to Google it.

    Anyhow talk is cheap. Over the last few years the best bet in sports is to go with Brady and against Manning in a big game. Thats why on Sunday I will take Baltimore and give the 4, and take the 5 with New England. With both hands! I'd advise you to do the same.
    Sigh. You may be right but for the wrong reasons. You go with the Patriots, not Tom Brady. Yu go against the Colts, not because of Maning but becuase the entire team simply isn't that good as a whole. Manning isn't the problem with that team.

    If the Pats lose, you'll be blaming everybody but Brady, I guess, but if the Colts lose, it will be Manning.

    You've been listening to too much Jim Rome or watching ESPN, one or the other.

  11. #40
    Pre-tty, pre-tty good!! MWM's Avatar
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    Re: NFL Playoffs = crapfest

    Was that "relishing the playoffs" last year when he threw a interception in the endzone that cost his team the game? Brady's a great QB, but the Pats are all about Bellicheck.
    Grape works as a soda. Sort of as a gum. I wonder why it doesn't work as a pie. Grape pie? There's no grape pie. - Larry David

  12. #41
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    Re: NFL Playoffs = crapfest

    Quote Originally Posted by MWM View Post
    Was that "relishing the playoffs" last year when he threw a interception in the endzone that cost his team the game? Brady's a great QB, but the Pats are all about Bellicheck.
    Gee MWM, I guess you've given up on the OSU game too. Talk about leaving a very sinking ship.

    Bellicheck before Brady post season: 1 win 1 loss, 5 no appearances.
    Bellicheck after Brady postseason : 11 wins 1 loss 3 rings. 1 no appearance.

    Bellicheck's overall record before Brady: 41 wins 55 losses
    Bellicheck's overall record after Brady: 71 wins 26 losses


    Hmmmmm!

    Lets see, Brady plays 13 postseason games during which he makes a total of one bad mistake, and you take that mistake to support your argument. Now thats real logic.
    Last edited by Mutaman; 01-09-2007 at 01:12 AM.

  13. #42
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    Re: NFL Playoffs = crapfest

    Quote Originally Posted by Dom Heffner View Post
    John Elway did not get his team to the Super Bowl by himself the years they won it. Terrell Davis helped tremendously along with a great coaching staff and a pretty good defense.

    The years they lost they did so to much better teams. Everybody used to say Elway choked, but it's hard to choke when you are the underdog (and you aren't even the reason). Denver wasn't favored in a single Super Bowl they lost, were they?

    And if I remember correctly, weren't the Broncos the underdog versus the Packers in a dome? I dunno, I'd have to Google it.



    Sigh. You may be right but for the wrong reasons. You go with the Patriots, not Tom Brady. Yu go against the Colts, not because of Maning but becuase the entire team simply isn't that good as a whole. Manning isn't the problem with that team.

    If the Pats lose, you'll be blaming everybody but Brady, I guess, but if the Colts lose, it will be Manning.

    You've been listening to too much Jim Rome or watching ESPN, one or the other.
    I can't figure out your point but the Packers lost to Denver in San Diego on natural surface. One of the main reasons they lost was because Holmgrin geared his defense to stop Denver's passing attack and conceeded the ground game. Considering that Elway was on the decline and Davis was at his peak, that was a really dumb mistake as Holgrin has since admitted on many occassions. Denver won the following year against a very medicore Atlanta team.

    No if the Patriots lose on Sunday, I won't blame Brady because he has done very nicely for me over the years and nothing is a sure thing. But the odds are really in my favor. If the Colts lose and Manning has his typical mediocre game, it will confirm once again an opinion that I formed about him in college-- that he is "cheap speed" and he spits the bit when he moves up in class.

  14. #43
    Pre-tty, pre-tty good!! MWM's Avatar
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    Re: NFL Playoffs = crapfest

    LAMO. You're supposedly an attorney and that's the best you can do?

    No mention at all that he was with the Browns then, huh. And a sample size of 2 games. He was a different coach then and he will even tell you that.

    Hey, I'm a big fan of Brady. I used to be a skeptic of his, but he's made me a full believer the last couple of years. I have a lot of respect for him and I love the way he carries himself off the field. I also happen to know that it's more than show with him. He's a genuinely good person with integrity. I've become a fan of his. Really, I have. He's a great player. He's a big reason they've been able to sustain the success they've had.

    And it would be different if they were winning primarily because of the offense. But they're winning in the playoffs first because their defense dominates. They completely baffle other team's offenses consistently. Let's be honest, for a QB, the situation they find themself in very important. Tom Brady's a great player, but let's face it, he's been in a damn good situation in his career. Put the NE offense with the Indianapolis defense over the past 5 years, and how many Super Bowls would that team have won? NONE.

    Or do you think that combination would have been able to win?
    Grape works as a soda. Sort of as a gum. I wonder why it doesn't work as a pie. Grape pie? There's no grape pie. - Larry David

  15. #44
    Potential Lunch Winner Dom Heffner's Avatar
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    Re: NFL Playoffs = crapfest

    Bellicheck before Brady post season: 1 win 1 loss, 5 no appearances.
    Bellicheck after Brady postseason : 11 wins 1 loss 3 rings. 1 no appearance.

    Bellicheck's overall record before Brady: 41 wins 55 losses
    Bellicheck's overall record after Brady: 71 wins 26 losses
    This analysis is stunning. I guess the other players on the roster have nothing to do with anything. Brady plays both sides of the ball, I guess.

    Put Brady on any team in the NFL and that team will win every Super Bowl ever played. He's the best football player ever.

    I tell ya, Tom Brady isn't even in the top 5 quarterbacks of all time.

    The point I was making with Elway is moot, since they played on grass. I couldn't remember.

    So when Green Bay loses, it's the coach's fault, when the Pats lose it's everybody but Brady's fault, but when the Colts lose, Peyton Manning sucks.

    That is something that Chris Berman would have us believe.

    Brady is great, but not the sole reason the Pats win. Manning is great and not the sole reason the Colts often lose.

    We can all learn from the example of Elway. For years he was considered a choker until his team got better. That was a very unfair assessment.

    You are only as good as your surrounding cast in many cases. Sometimes good players can get you so far, but ultimately it's a team effort.

  16. #45
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    Re: NFL Playoffs = crapfest

    Quote Originally Posted by MWM View Post
    He was a different coach then and he will even tell you that.

    Yeah, he was a loser.


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