Turn Off Ads?
Page 1 of 11 12345 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 160

Thread: Streetcars in Cincy?

  1. #1
    SERP Emeritus paintmered's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2001
    Location
    Cbus
    Posts
    7,054

    Streetcars in Cincy?

    This doesn't sound like all that bad of a proposal. And the bus system really does need addressed here.

    City studies streetcar system
    BY JON NEWBERRY | JNEWBERRY@ENQUIRER.COM

    The city of Cincinnati has hired a national engineering group to study a streetcar link of the riverfront and downtown business district with Over-the-Rhine.

    The initial phase would likely be a three- to four-mile loop. An extension to the University of Cincinnati and city hospital complex could be part of the first phase or come later.

    Future lines could extend into Northern Kentucky and possibly other city neighborhoods to the east and west.

    The concept has been pushed for several years by groups that think Cincinnati's lack of public transportation alternatives is hurting economic development.

    Chris Bortz, chairman of City Council's Economic Development Committee, is a streetcar advocate.

    He said most members of council and Mayor Mark Mallory also favor the idea if it can be financed without additional taxes - which he thinks is feasible.

    "The city has a great need for a more complete, holistic transportation system. Buses and roads just don't get it done," Bortz said.

    "We need to create a city that's easy to get around in."

    The $160,000 study by Omaha, Neb.-based HDR Inc. is to be completed by early May, according to Michael Moore, city architect.

    The project team includes Charles Hales, the "father" of the highly successful streetcar system in Portland, Ore., who's now a principal with HDR's Portland office.

    The Portland system has spurred billions of dollars of economic development over the last five years, most of which is within a block or so of the streetcar line.

    That is what makes the concept so promising for areas such as Over-the-Rhine and the Uptown district.

    Empty lots and redevelopment opportunities abound there.

    Moore said the study is expected to produce "a recommended Phase-One alignment" including projected construction costs, operating costs and potential financing plan. It would then be up to City Council and the city manager to decide if and how to proceed, he said.

    Noting that streetcar systems are much easier and cheaper to build than light rail, Bortz said it's feasible that streetcars could be up and running within two years if the city pursued it aggressively.

    "It seems to be a transportation system that works in a lot of other cities," Moore said.

    Some 50 other cities have studied or are studying similar projects, including Atlanta, where a proposed streetcar line has attracted "so much interest that they can't settle on a plan," he said.

    Architect Denny Dellinger, owner of the former Jackson Brewery building and a founder of the Brewery District community development organization in Over-the-Rhine, said his group supports a streetcar line because of its ability to stimulate economic development.

    "Developers aren't going to build a new development on a bus line, but they will along a streetcar line," he said. The rail in the ground makes all the difference. "That's a permanent, significant improvement that's not going to move," he said.

    "I think it would just change things overnight. I really do."

    HDR and the city began work in November, but it took a while to get going, Moore said. The next meeting is planned for later this month with a 25-to-30 member local advisory panel that's being assembled by the city. With development plans proceeding for the Banks site on Cincinnati's central riverfront and other major development projects, it seemed like the right time to examine a streetcar system, he said.

    The goal, Moore said, is to strike a balance between serving riders who want to travel between existing destinations - the riverfront, downtown employers, convention facilities, entertainment venues, Fountain Square, Findlay Market - and promoting development opportunities in areas that are not already fully built up, particularly in Over-the-Rhine.

    "One of the great things streetcars do is allow folks to not use their cars so much ... (or) not even own cars," he said. "If a streetcar makes the demand for parking less, then that opens the door for redevelopment."

    A lot of proposed residential developments get hung up by the cost of building parking facilities, so if a streetcar system can reduce the number of needed parking spaces from two or three cars per unit to one car per unit, that can close the financing gap and make those projects feasible.

    The idea of a streetcar was appealing to Minyette Burke of Mount Healthy as she waited at a cold Vine Street bus stop downtown on Tuesday afternoon, especially if it reduced the time she'd have to wait for her ride up the hill to Clifton.

    "I would ride it. I think it would be nice," she said.
    What if this wasn't a rhetorical question?

    All models are wrong. Some of them are useful.

  2. Turn Off Ads?
  3. #2
    This one's for you Edd Heath's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Dayton Area
    Posts
    8,471

    Re: Streetcars in Cincy?

    Why don't they just clean out and run subways like they wanted to in the '20's.

    Some people play baseball. Baseball plays Jay Bruce.

  4. #3
    Rally Onion! Chip R's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2000
    Location
    Cincinnati, OH
    Posts
    34,549

    Re: Streetcars in Cincy?

    $160K is chump change to spend. Wait till they start talking in the tens of millions and watch how quickly this idea dies.
    The Rally Onion wants 150 fans before Opening Day.

    http://www.facebook.com/pages/Rally-...24872650873160

  5. #4
    Be the ball Roy Tucker's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2001
    Location
    Mason, OH
    Posts
    12,376

    Re: Streetcars in Cincy?

    I think this is a great idea and it's promising that the city is actually thinking about it. One can hope.

    But I'll be stunned if anything comes of it. The city of Cincinnati can't agree on what soup to have for lunch, let alone a street car system.

    Pay attention to the open sky

  6. #5
    First Time Caller SunDeck's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2000
    Posts
    5,398

    Re: Streetcars in Cincy?

    I think rail makes more sense if the purpose is to move people from the burbs to the core. A rail along the river out to the casinos, a rail up I-71 to King Island, a rail across the river. These forward thinking ideas have been put forward and were of course killed by the voters who, like Steve Chabot insist that "we could buy everybody in the district a car for what this light rail boondoggle would end up costing taxpayers." (hello Steve...that's kind of the point!).

    Light rail is not a bad idea if the purpose is to move people around the metropolitan area efficiently and to improve access to the urban core. But streetcars? I have a hard time understanding how planting tracks in the street A) is more efficient than buses or B) is a better way to spend transportation dollars in a small downtown. This is just an attempt by the OTR development interests to create a novelty that will spur development in their area. While I have no problem with supporting development of OTR and other parts of the downtown core, I think it is folly to believe that streetcars would be anything more than an attraction. Now, if they want to talk about bringing them back and reconstructing the inclines as a way to create a tourism buzz, then I'm all for it. Just don't try to sell it to me as a better alternative to buses. Buses may not be nostalgic, but they work.
    Next Reds manager, second shooter. --Confirmed on Redszone.

  7. #6
    breath westofyou's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2000
    Location
    PDX
    Posts
    43,281

    Re: Streetcars in Cincy?

    Downtown San Francisco has streetcars, they are all painted and designed to represent the streetcars of defunct old lines from other cities

    http://www.sfmuni.com/cms/mms/rider/histcars.htm
    Code:
    Car Number	City 	Paint Scheme
    1007	Philadelphia 	Philadelphia Suburban Transportation Company 
    ("Red Arrow" Lines): maroon & cream
    1010 	San Francisco 	Muni: blue & yellow
    1015	St. Louis 	Illinois Terminal Railroad: green, cream, & gray
    
    Single-ended PCC cars originally built for Philadelphia in 1946 
    with most cars painted to look like streetcars from other cities:
    
    Car Number 	City 	Paint Scheme
    1050 	San Francisco 	Muni: green & cream (original "wing" style)
    1051 	San Francisco 	Muni: green & cream (simplified style)
    1052 	Los Angeles 	Los Angeles Railway: orange & yellow, with silver stripes
    1053 	Brooklyn 	Board of Transportation of the City of New York: blue-green & silver
    1054 	Philadelphia 	Philadelphia Transportation Company: silver & cream, with blue stripes
    1055 	Philadelphia 	Philadelphia Transportation Company: green & cream, with red stripe
    1056 	Kansas City 	Kansas City Public Service Company: cream, black, & silver
    1057 	Cincinnati 	Cincinnati Street Railway: yellow & gray, with green stripes
    1058 	Chicago 	Chicago Transit Authority: green & cream
    1059 	Boston 	Boston Elevated Railway: orange, cream, & silver, with red stripe
    1060 	Newark 	Public Service Coordinated Transport: gray & white, with blue stripes
    1061 	Los Angeles 	Pacific Electric Railway: red, orange, & gray (original style)
    1062 	Louisville 	The Louisville Railway Company: green & cream, with black stripe
    1063 	Baltimore 	Baltimore Transit Company: yellow & gray
    Here's the Cincinnati one


  8. #7
    Rally Onion! Chip R's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2000
    Location
    Cincinnati, OH
    Posts
    34,549

    Re: Streetcars in Cincy?

    You know, we don't need streetcars, we need a monorail.

    The Rally Onion wants 150 fans before Opening Day.

    http://www.facebook.com/pages/Rally-...24872650873160

  9. #8
    The Lineups stink. KronoRed's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    West N. Carolina
    Posts
    55,717

    Re: Streetcars in Cincy?

    I like this idea.

    Of course I like all mass transit ideas, even bus lanes
    Go Gators!

  10. #9
    Rally Onion! Chip R's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2000
    Location
    Cincinnati, OH
    Posts
    34,549

    Re: Streetcars in Cincy?

    Quote Originally Posted by KronoRed View Post
    I like this idea.

    Of course I like all mass transit ideas, even bus lanes

    Says the guy with the Geo.
    The Rally Onion wants 150 fans before Opening Day.

    http://www.facebook.com/pages/Rally-...24872650873160

  11. #10
    The Lineups stink. KronoRed's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    West N. Carolina
    Posts
    55,717

    Re: Streetcars in Cincy?

    It's not my car

    Really..everyone it's not...PLEASE! :runawaycr
    Go Gators!

  12. #11
    Hisssssssss Yachtzee's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    Land of the Lost
    Posts
    7,267

    Re: Streetcars in Cincy?

    If I lived in Cincinnati, I would love the idea of a light rail system that could get me to the downtown nightspots and Newport on the Levee without having to drive a car. Then I could go out with my wife and friends and no one would have to worry about a designated driver. And imagine if you worked downtown, being able to get some work done on the trip in and out. When I lived in Chicago, I lived on the far north side, so that it took me an hour on the El to get to the loop in the morning. I would take work on the train with me so that I could put that time to good use. If I didn't have work to do, I could bring a book to read. If I had a choice of sitting in my car for an hour or riding the train for an hour, I'd pick the train.

    I really wish they would develop a rail network to connect Cleveland, Columbus and Cincinnati. I would love the idea of being able to live in one city and have multiple cities to choose from in which to pursue my career.
    Burn down the disco. Hang the blessed DJ. Because the music that he constantly plays, it says nothing to me about my life.

  13. #12
    Member harangatang's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    1,552

    Re: Streetcars in Cincy?

    Quote Originally Posted by Heath View Post
    Why don't they just clean out and run subways like they wanted to in the '20's.

    That's not possible because the city ran a bunch pipes and lines through the tunnels. I think they could use sections of the tunnel if they wanted to but not the whole thing.

  14. #13
    Making sense of it all Matt700wlw's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    26,519

    Re: Streetcars in Cincy?

    How's the banks project going?

  15. #14
    Redsmetz redsmetz's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Winton Place
    Posts
    11,284

    Re: Streetcars in Cincy?

    Quote Originally Posted by Matt700wlw View Post
    How's the banks project going?
    The Banks project won't go anywhere until the Bengals sign off on it and they won't do that as long as the county is suing them for the awful lease that their shill Bob Bedinghaus (and his cronies) agreed to. That means, unfortunately, that they'll have to drop the suit and let us continue to get hosed by the Bengals. We'll see where it goes when down towards the end of the lease, the county is forced to pay money to the Bengals, something not permitted by state law.

  16. #15
    Rally Onion! Chip R's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2000
    Location
    Cincinnati, OH
    Posts
    34,549

    Re: Streetcars in Cincy?

    Quote Originally Posted by Matt700wlw View Post
    How's the banks project going?

    Whup, forgot about the Banks. Once they get built, Cincinnati will have a cultural rennaisance. We won't need streetcars cause we'll just fly to work under our own power. When the Banks are built, the Reds will begin their run of 20 World Series championships in a row, the Bengals will win the Super Bowl so often they will start calling the playoffs, the Cincinnati Bengals invitational and they will cancel the Crosstown Shootout since the Bearcats and Muskies will meet in the NCAA Finals each year.
    The Rally Onion wants 150 fans before Opening Day.

    http://www.facebook.com/pages/Rally-...24872650873160


Turn Off Ads?

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Board Moderators may, at their discretion and judgment, delete and/or edit any messages that violate any of the following guidelines: 1. Explicit references to alleged illegal or unlawful acts. 2. Graphic sexual descriptions. 3. Racial or ethnic slurs. 4. Use of edgy language (including masked profanity). 5. Direct personal attacks, flames, fights, trolling, baiting, name-calling, general nuisance, excessive player criticism or anything along those lines. 6. Posting spam. 7. Each person may have only one user account. It is fine to be critical here - that's what this board is for. But let's not beat a subject or a player to death, please.

Thank you, and most importantly, enjoy yourselves!


RedsZone.com is a privately owned website and is not affiliated with the Cincinnati Reds or Major League Baseball


Contact us: Boss | GIK | BCubb2003 | dabvu2498 | Gallen5862 | LexRedsFan | Plus Plus | RedlegJake | redsfan1995 | The Operator | Tommyjohn25