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Thread: Reds acquire Saarloos, sign Bellhorn

  1. #31
    15 game winner Danny Serafini's Avatar
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    Re: Reds acquire Saarloos, sign Bellhorn

    Only if they try and take him off the 40 man. If he's got options they can send him down.

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  3. #32
    Tired of talk. Win! Joseph's Avatar
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    Re: Reds acquire Saarloos, sign Bellhorn

    Quote Originally Posted by Red Daddy View Post
    The Sporting News says, "Saarloos is a control pitcher who gets a tone of grounders with his sinker."

    That sounds so much better than them saying he gives up 40 homers a year!!
    Didn't someone say that about Dave Williams too?

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  4. #33
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    Re: Reds acquire Saarloos, sign Bellhorn

    As of now, I don't like it... I think Shafer was going to be pretty good for us in the future. Having Saarloos takes up a spot in our rotation that could have gone to EZ, Wilson, or Belisle could have taken. I think one of those guys would have stepped up (probably EZ) and been better what Saarloos is going to give us. But we'll see.

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    Re: Reds acquire Saarloos, sign Bellhorn

    I'd like to see the Reds give Saarloos a definitive role and see what he can do. I like the pickup as long as they use him correctly. I've can't think of a pitcher who was shuttled from the pen to the rotation, throughout the same season, ever consistantly doing well. Maybe a closer? with the 9th inning defense the Reds could put on the field, I like his sinker.

  6. #35
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    Re: Reds acquire Saarloos, sign Bellhorn

    Ok with this guy who gets the boot?

    Arroyo, Harang, Lohse, Milton, Coffey, Cormier, Majewski, Stanton, and Weathers are locks for the staff. - 9

    Saarloos, Belisle, Bray, Ramirez and Shack all seem to be out of options or likely to be on the staff...That is 2 over...

    I think Bray is going down but who is the other one (Shack?) and what about Dumatrait? Is he out of options? What about the Rule V guy? Don't we have a pitcher there (rule V)?

    Bowden use to invite 20 pitchers to camp and hope that one sticks but they would be non-roster. WayneK signs them as free agents and or trades for guys with ML contracts. I guess produce man has more money than banana man and Marge...
    Tim McCarver: Baseball Quotes
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  7. #36
    15 game winner Danny Serafini's Avatar
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    Re: Reds acquire Saarloos, sign Bellhorn

    I'm pretty sure Shackelford has an option left, and even if he didn't I don't see him making the Opening Day roster. If I had to guess now I'd say Belisle and Bray to the pen, Saarloos as the 5th starter and the rest on the bus to Louisville.

  8. #37
    Redsmetz redsmetz's Avatar
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    Re: Reds acquire Saarloos, sign Bellhorn

    Quote Originally Posted by paulrichjr View Post
    Ok with this guy who gets the boot?

    Arroyo, Harang, Lohse, Milton, Coffey, Cormier, Majewski, Stanton, and Weathers are locks for the staff. - 9

    Saarloos, Belisle, Bray, Ramirez and Shack all seem to be out of options or likely to be on the staff...That is 2 over...

    I think Bray is going down but who is the other one (Shack?) and what about Dumatrait? Is he out of options? What about the Rule V guy? Don't we have a pitcher there (rule V)?

    Bowden use to invite 20 pitchers to camp and hope that one sticks but they would be non-roster. WayneK signs them as free agents and or trades for guys with ML contracts. I guess produce man has more money than banana man and Marge...
    Is it a new week? Okay, here it is for this week - I think Cormier will be moved before the start of the season. I would agree, too, with those who suggest that Livingston will be the PTBNL coming from the A's) which should allow us to send him down to the minors (assuming that he still has options; I'm guessing he does).

  9. #38
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    Re: Reds acquire Saarloos, sign Bellhorn

    Quote Originally Posted by dfs View Post
    My first thought was "well, there's your number 5 starter. You don't trade Shafer for a guy you want to slip through waivers." and then I thought a bit and looked.

    From Baseball reference.
    PHP Code:
    I Split          G   GS  GF  W   L   S   CG SHO   IP     ERA   
     
    +-+------------+----+---+---+---+---+---+---+---+------+-
       as 
    Starter     69  69   0  24  23   0   3   2  368     5.04  427   
       
    as Reliever    54   0  19   3   2   2   0   0   72     3.50   74 
    I wonder if Wayne just got his closer. As a reliever his K/9 is around 7.
    Very interesting point. Not sure if that will be the case, but it's certainly an interesting thought/idea.

    Also, nobody should overlook the fact that he's coming over from the AL. Surely he should see some sort of drop in ERA. I see this as a pretty low risk, possibly high return move. You can't blame Wayne for trying to make one of those under the radar deals. That is where he has traditionally shined.

  10. #39
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    Re: Reds acquire Saarloos, sign Bellhorn

    I like the trade. We got a #5 starter who should play well to our improved infield defense for a minor league reliever.

  11. #40
    part of BBN jmac's Avatar
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    Re: Reds acquire Saarloos, sign Bellhorn

    For lilly, meche, and marquis money....I would take Saarloos any day.
    Wouldnt it be nice if kirk is this year's version of Bronson ?

  12. #41
    Mon chou Choo vaticanplum's Avatar
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    Re: Reds acquire Saarloos, sign Bellhorn

    Quote Originally Posted by flyer85 View Post
    Interesting signing of Bellhorn, he Ks at a higher rate than Dunn. He is right behind him(less BBs and HRs) as the king of TTO.
    I honestly don't believe that strikeouts are a serious concern of Krivsky's if they're balanced by other things...any idea otherwise is an assumption a lot of people have made, i think. I've never heard him say a negative word about strikeouts, and on two occasions that I can remember off the top of my head he's told people to ignore strikeouts. Narron may be a different story, but this is the guy making the trades.

    So we have Lohse and 'Loos. One step closer to Loss! (Kidding.)
    There is no such thing as a pitching prospect.

  13. #42
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    Re: Reds acquire Saarloos, sign Bellhorn

    Quote Originally Posted by vaticanplum View Post
    I honestly don't believe that strikeouts are a serious concern of Krivsky's if they're balanced by other things...any idea otherwise is an assumption a lot of people have made, i think. I've never heard him say a negative word about strikeouts, and on two occasions that I can remember off the top of my head he's told people to ignore strikeouts. Narron may be a different story, but this is the guy making the trades.

    So we have Lohse and 'Loos. One step closer to Loss! (Kidding.)
    Okay, let's not bring any bad karma around - you may be required to say a Novena to undo that!

  14. #43
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    Re: Reds acquire Saarloos, sign Bellhorn

    Quote Originally Posted by Dracodave View Post
    Saarloos?? If he is insterted into our rotation he easily becomes a number 3/4 without a doubt. He's better than both Milton and Loshe.
    I am AMAZED. I like this trade!!!

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  15. #44
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    Re: Reds acquire Saarloos, sign Bellhorn

    I absolutely love this trade. This is going to make the AGon signing look even better. Instead of using his 2006 stats when he went back and forth between starting and relief let's look at his 2005 stats when he was almost exclusively a starter. 10-9 4.17 ERA and 2 complete games. When you translate that into NL numbers where you don't have the DH, you are looking at a 12 game winner with a sub 4.00 ERA. Gil Meche had almost the same numbers this past season and he's getting paid 10 times what Saarloos will get. That is why it was a good idea for WK to not be jumping into the Free Agent market. When I look at his stats his K/9 numbers are interesting. He was a strikeout pitcher at Cal-State Fullerton and he was in the Houston organization including the times he spent with the Astros. It was only when he started pitching for the A's that his K numbers went down. It might have been a coaching/philosophical thing. It might have been what the A's wanted him to do. Just induce the groundball and let the defense do their jobs and it worked pretty well in Oakland. He had success as both kinds of pitchers so it will interesting to see what Pole has him do. To give up a good, but not great prospect who's never pitched above AA for one of the better bottom of the rotation pitchers in the AL is a steal. Congrats to WK on this one.

  16. #45
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    Re: Reds acquire Saarloos, sign Bellhorn

    Quote Originally Posted by Handofdeath View Post
    I absolutely love this trade. This is going to make the AGon signing look even better. Instead of using his 2006 stats when he went back and forth between starting and relief let's look at his 2005 stats when he was almost exclusively a starter. 10-9 4.17 ERA and 2 complete games. When you translate that into NL numbers where you don't have the DH, you are looking at a 12 game winner with a sub 4.00 ERA. Gil Meche had almost the same numbers this past season and he's getting paid 10 times what Saarloos will get. That is why it was a good idea for WK to not be jumping into the Free Agent market. When I look at his stats his K/9 numbers are interesting. He was a strikeout pitcher at Cal-State Fullerton and he was in the Houston organization including the times he spent with the Astros. It was only when he started pitching for the A's that his K numbers went down. It might have been a coaching/philosophical thing. It might have been what the A's wanted him to do. Just induce the groundball and let the defense do their jobs and it worked pretty well in Oakland. He had success as both kinds of pitchers so it will interesting to see what Pole has him do. To give up a good, but not great prospect who's never pitched above AA for one of the better bottom of the rotation pitchers in the AL is a steal. Congrats to WK on this one.
    I'm as stoked about this as its humanly possible to be stoked about a guy who has walked more guys than he's struck out over his last three years as a pro while posting stellar xFIPS as 6.19 and 5.75..... woohoooo!!!!!!!!!!

    wow! cool! yaaaaaahhhhhhh! Get ready for a cartwheel.....

    Quote Originally Posted by Handofdeath View Post
    DH, you are looking at a 12 game winner with a sub 4.00 ERA.
    Ouch! (bottom jaw just hit the floor)......

    Yep, there was a whole chapter in Moneyball devoted to how Beane gives away quality starters...

    Seriously, he's much closer to back end fodder that will be sweating to beat out Elizardo as the number 5 placeholder until Homer shows up in July. This gives the Reds some depth...think Linvingston, Elizardo....Saarloos....
    "This isnít stats vs scouts - this is stats and scouts working together, building an organization that blends the best of both worlds. This is the blueprint for how a baseball organization should be run. And, whether the baseball men of the 20th century like it or not, this is where baseball is going."---Dave Cameron, U.S.S. Mariner


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