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Thread: Wheeler on Saarlos trade

  1. #1
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    Wheeler on Saarlos trade

    Interesting paragraph from Lonnie Wheeler article in the Post:


    "Some folks were displeased to see the Reds part this week with the youth (24) and Double-A numbers of reliever David Shafer in return for veteran Kirk Saarloos. They argue that Saarloos is just another .500 pitcher - but hey, at 27, he can be a .500 pitcher for years to come. Besides that, when he was 23, working the Texas League, the right-hander went 10-1 with a 1.40 earned run average, giving up only 48 hits in 83 innings. Those are Homer Bailey numbers. And you get five bonus years of big-league experience."

    IMHO, that is a great way to look at this deal. WK took a chance with minimal risk. Cincy doesn't have the resources for Barry Zito, but smarts in the front office can make up for some of the lack of cash.

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    Let's ride BRM's Avatar
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    Re: Wheeler on Saarlos trade

    Saarloos had better numbers than Shafer at AA at a similar age. Interesting.

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    Tired of talk. Win! Joseph's Avatar
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    Re: Wheeler on Saarlos trade

    Shafer was unlikely to ever get a real chance here barring massive injury. Wayne's shown a proclivity for veteran bullpenners and the kids really have to be something special to break that mold apparently.

    This might not help us [I think it might actually] but it does not hurt us either.

    It's a scratch off ticket, let's see if 3 numbers match.

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    Re: Wheeler on Saarlos trade

    Billy Beane coaxed a very nice year out of Mike Neu in 2003 after taking Mike from Cincinnati in the 2002 Rule V draft.

    Those who don't know history are doomed to repeat it.

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    Re: Wheeler on Saarlos trade

    Quote Originally Posted by BRM View Post
    Saarloos had better numbers than Shafer at AA at a similar age. Interesting.
    But worse numbers as a major leaguer than EZ. Just more service time.
    Suck it up cupcake.

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    Re: Wheeler on Saarlos trade

    Quote Originally Posted by TRF View Post
    But worse numbers as a major leaguer than EZ. Just more service time.
    They are both guys that in 30 years no one will remember who they were (Exept us redszoners). They are what they are, guys with live arms who just fill a spot. I would call them serviceable. Soorlos was a good pick up.
    WHEN DOES IT STOP!?!?

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    Re: Wheeler on Saarlos trade

    I have been critical of the Reds sitting on their hands and doing very little to improve this winter. I have to say that I like the pick-up of Saarloos a lot. he is the kind of guy that may just put it all together and help the reds in the #4 or #5 spot in the rotation. He seems to have good stuff...and if he is given a role and not bounced around too much...he could really be a good addition. Good job, Wayne!

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    Re: Wheeler on Saarlos trade

    Quote Originally Posted by Z-Fly View Post
    They are both guys that in 30 years no one will remember who they were (Exept us redszoners). They are what they are, guys with live arms who just fill a spot. I would call them serviceable. Soorlos was a good pick up.
    Maybe, but EZ has some upside to him. He was a markedly different pitcher in 2006 than he was in 2005. He learned the changeup from Soto, and he learned it quick. All he needs is to get some movement on his fastball. He's young enough still (He turns 24 on Sunday) to actually learn how to do that.

    I don't want to hear about how Dick Pole has taken dreck like Saarloos under his wing. I want to hear how he and Soto have noticed a tiny flaw in EZ's delivery that once corrected put some late life on a FB that right now sits in the 92-94 MPH range.

    28 year olds that K no one don't excite me at all. 24 year olds that K close to 6 per game, and show improvement from the year before, in both the majors and the minors, do.
    Suck it up cupcake.

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    Re: Wheeler on Saarlos trade

    The Sarloose(spelling) trade was a good trade no matter how you look at it.

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    Re: Wheeler on Saarlos trade

    Quote Originally Posted by fewfirstchoice View Post
    The Sarloose(spelling) trade was a good trade no matter how you look at it.
    opinion, not fact. And I happen to disagree.
    Suck it up cupcake.

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    Please come again pedro's Avatar
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    Re: Wheeler on Saarlos trade

    TRF, I think you greatly overvalue some of the minor league relievers in the Reds system.
    Get your nunchucks and the keys to your dad's car. I know where we can get a gun

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    Re: Wheeler on Saarlos trade

    Quote Originally Posted by fewfirstchoice View Post
    The Sarloose(spelling) trade was a good trade no matter how you look at it.
    I don't think it was especially good or bad. It's a low risk maneuver. If Saarloos finds some magic (and the odds are strongly against him doing that), it's a big win for the Reds. But if he bombs, the Reds didn't really give up anything extremely valuable for him.
    "I prefer books and movies where the conflict isn't of the extreme cannibal apocalypse variety I guess." Redsfaithful

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    Re: Wheeler on Saarlos trade

    Quote Originally Posted by pedro View Post
    TRF, I think you greatly overvalue some of the minor league relievers in the Reds system.
    And sometimes we have the myopia of why people won't come to Cincinnati to play. It has to be Wayne's fault.

    David Shafer will be a nice 6th or 7th inning guy in Oakland in about 2-3 years. Nothing spectacular.
    Some people play baseball. Baseball plays Jay Bruce.

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    Re: Wheeler on Saarlos trade

    Quote Originally Posted by pedro View Post
    TRF, I think you greatly overvalue some of the minor league relievers in the Reds system.
    Nah. Shafer here or not makes no difference to me. I never really noticed him. I am a Calvin Medlock fan though.

    But Saarloos is just a bad pitcher, who had rate stat last year that made Joe Mays look good.

    Now imagine that in the hitter friendly parks of the NL Central.
    Suck it up cupcake.

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    Re: Wheeler on Saarlos trade

    Quote Originally Posted by Joseph View Post
    Shafer was unlikely to ever get a real chance here barring massive injury. Wayne's shown a proclivity for veteran bullpenners and the kids really have to be something special to break that mold apparently.
    This is OT and I don't know if that's Wayne or not, but it sure as h*ll is Jerry Narron. That's two GM's in a row that have gone out of their way to sign recognizable "major league" bullpen arms for millions of dollars instead of trying to get minor league guys into low leverage bullpen slots.

    I know there are several members who feel the reds have sat on their hands all off-season. I happen to see it from the other way. I think they've had a decent off season where they did a lot to get the talent on the 40 man roster in the form that they want it.

    The two big things I can see them doing is get junior out of center field and to get Jerry Narron to use his bullpen in a consistant situational model. If he can do that, learn to use guys within their own role and not burn them up and then discard them, the team can take a couple of strides forward this season.

    If he can't do that, If we get to June and the pen is a mess and he continues to make excuses, the team needs to find a manager that can run a bullpen. Organizationally, they are paying too much in terms of talent and money into the bullpen. If he can't make it work AGAIN this year, they need to let him go.
    "Even a bad day at the ballpark beats the snot out of most other good days. I'll take my scorecard and pencil and beer and hot dog and rage at the dips and cheer at the highs, but I'm not ever going to stop loving this game and this team and nobody will ever take that away from me." Roy Tucker October 2010


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