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Thread: NASCAR Haters?

  1. #16
    Big Red Machine RedsBaron's Avatar
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    Re: NASCAR Haters?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cedric View Post
    I'm worried about all unjustified labels.

    And that's all GAC was talking about in his first post. There is no excuse for generalized stereotyping.

    It's possible that we all have done it, doesn't make it more justified or right.
    I agree totally. Yes, I suspect pretty much everyone, me included, has engaged in unjustified stereotyping.
    "Hey...Dad. Wanna Have A Catch?" Kevin Costner in "Field Of Dreams."

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  3. #17
    For a Level Playing Field RedFanAlways1966's Avatar
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    Re: NASCAR Haters?

    Quote Originally Posted by GAC View Post
    But what amazed me were the "on the street" interviews they showed, and the people's perception and stereotyping of Nascar and it's fans. Conversations peppered with terminology such as redneck, pot-bellied, toothless losers, and white trash.
    Really? If I not mistaken, Seattle has a MLB team, an NFL team and an NBA team. Not sure b/c I am an occasional NASCAR watcher (not a huge fan), but I cannot recall any riots or disruptions due to fans in NASCAR. Maybe it has happened, but not anymore than the sports that Seattle has today. The pro sports that Seattle has (to name a few)...

    MLB: Geez... anyone remember Dodgers at Cubs in the bullpen?
    NFL: Geez... anyone remember the beer bottle melee at Cleveland?
    NBA: Geez... anyone remember Indiana (Ron Artest) at Detroit?

    I wonder if these on the street people also wish that the Mariners, the Seahawks and the Sonics get out of town due to unruly fans that like those sports?

    I am sure all pro sports have crimes around their events... muggings, etc. However, I'd say it is safe to say that NASCAR events do not have many more than other pro sports in the course of an entire season of each sport. It also seems that the NASCAR drivers live more of a crime-free life than players in the Seattle sports. Granted there are a lot fewer drivers than members of other sports, but I'd like to see the percentage of NASCAR drivers who have been arrested vs. the percentage of other pro sports athletes. Believe it or not the players/drivers are seen as idols by the youth of society (sorry, Sir Charles!).
    Small market fan... always hoping, but never expecting.

  4. #18
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    Re: NASCAR Haters?

    Quote Originally Posted by GAC View Post
    Do you wake up everyday with guilt, and lamenting the fact you were born Caucasian?
    There is no defined genetic definition of race, let alone a Caucasian race,
    With the turn away from racial theory in the late 20th century the term "Caucasian" as a racial classification fell into disuse in Europe. Thus, in The United Kingdom, "Caucasian" is more likely than in the United States to refer to people from the Caucasus.
    In Canada, the term "Caucasian" is known, but rarely used as a description of white people. In Australia and New Zealand, the term "Caucasian" is mainly used in police offender descriptions. In New Zealand, the terms more commonly used to describe white people are Pākehā, European New Zealander, or simply New Zealander (although in theory this should include all citizens or residents of the country).
    In the United States, "Caucasian" has primarily been used as a distinction based on skin color, for a group commonly referred to as White Americans, as defined by the government and Census Bureau.

  5. #19
    breath westofyou's Avatar
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    Re: NASCAR Haters?

    http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/opinion/304276_edit2.html

    NASCAR Track: Crash and burn

    House Bill 2062 -- aka the NASCAR bill -- will finally get a hearing today, and we sincerely hope it crashes and burns. And no, this wish has nothing to do with any sort of high brow, Seattle snobbery.

    The request that Washington state kick in millions in public funding (as much as $145 million) for a professional motor-sports track while letting the International Speedway Corp. off the hook for forest land compensation taxes is a huge concern. It seems the bill's backers are willing to let some important things slide in an effort to bring us NASCAR, which Lt. Gov. Brad Owen has compared to "bringing two Super Bowls" to Kitsap County. Sure, bringing the loud, polluting 83,000-seat NASCAR track might be an economic boost, but at what expense? And, all this work and expense for two races a year? Is it worth it to protect the serenity and beauty of an area in exchange for more jobs? And why is it that a fat-cat entity such as the ISC, which for this fiscal year expects to earn close to $820 million (never mind the billions it is projected to earn in broadcast agreements), requires public funding?

    We really don't see why the Legislature should invoke the emergency clause attached to HB2062, which states that the "act is necessary for the immediate preservation of the public peace, health, or safety, or support of the state government," rushing the measure into effect by July. What's the rush?
    FYI here's the county that the proposal targets as the location


  6. #20
    For a Level Playing Field RedFanAlways1966's Avatar
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    Re: NASCAR Haters?

    Sure, bringing the loud, polluting 83,000-seat NASCAR track might be an economic boost, but at what expense? And, all this work and expense for two races a year?
    Sounds kind of contradictory... loud and polluting, but only two races. How loud and how polluting can two races per year bring to the area? The article brings in loudness and pollution to say no to the bill, but then also tries to say no to the bill by saying it will only have two races. Contradictory? Will there be more noise in one race than the Seattle airport has in a single day of airline flights? Will there be more pollution in one race than the congested traffic brings at rush hour on each Friday afternoon?

    I am not for it or against it. Frankly I do not care. But I do not like the contradictions in the article. I also do not think the state should have to pay for this. If they want it in Seattle and need cash to do it, then that county should pay that money. And the people in that county should have it on their ballot. Not the state and not the legislators for the whole state. It should be like it is done for most of the new NFL and MLB stadiums. People in Columbus and Cleveland (technically) did not pay or vote for GABP or PBS in Cincy.
    Small market fan... always hoping, but never expecting.

  7. #21
    breath westofyou's Avatar
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    Re: NASCAR Haters?

    How loud and how polluting can two races per year bring to the area?
    Well there will be 83 thousand people hitting the area on those two days, that is probably the generator of more waste and pollution then the actual car race. Plus it being a peninsula that is more known for its coastline and nature there is limited areas that will be taking most of the impact of the visitors, that includes the limited roads that go up there.

  8. #22
    For a Level Playing Field RedFanAlways1966's Avatar
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    Re: NASCAR Haters?

    Quote Originally Posted by westofyou View Post
    Well there will be 83 thousand people hitting the area on those two days, that is probably the generator of more waste and pollution then the actual car race. Plus it being a peninsula that is more known for its coastline and nature there is limited areas that will be taking most of the impact of the visitors, that includes the limited roads that go up there.
    Good points, woy. I am not sure of the Seahawks stadium capacity, but I do know that they play 8 regular season games and 2 pre-season games at home each year. And perhaps a playoff game or two at home in recent years. My guess would be a minumum of 60,000 people in that stadium for each game. At that number it would equate to over a half million people per year. Makes 166,000 seem rather small.

    The peninsula thing with the traffic problem is one that I cannot refute. And nothing should interfere with the main reasons that visitors come to a certain area. We don't have those problems with I-70 and I-75 in my neck of the woods... and only a great Air Force museum to visit!
    Small market fan... always hoping, but never expecting.

  9. #23
    The rest is drama. marcshoe's Avatar
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    Re: NASCAR Haters?

    fwiw, I've heard the exact things said about a proposed WalMart Supercenter.

    Oh, and I don't like NASCAR because it's a slick, Literally ad-driven pseudo-sport. It reminds me of the MOR junk they pass off as country music these days.

    When they took points away from Dale Junior for cussing in an after-race interview a couple of years ago, that pretty much did it for me. Fine him, but don't do something that negates what he did on the "playing field". When you do things like this, your product (good word for NASCAR) ceases being a sport.

    And I'm from rural West Virginia (Lincoln County, even), so I'm not exactly going to be repelled because of the so-called white trash element (and no, I don't care for the label either--I could tell some stories of real discrimination beacuse of these assumptions, even though it's nothing that even approaches the extremes of racial discrimination).

  10. #24
    For a Level Playing Field RedFanAlways1966's Avatar
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    Re: NASCAR Haters?

    Quote Originally Posted by tixe View Post
    When they took points away from Dale Junior for cussing in an after-race interview a couple of years ago, that pretty much did it for me. Fine him, but don't do something that negates what he did on the "playing field". When you do things like this, your product (good word for NASCAR) ceases being a sport.
    Not that I disagree with MLB, but they did the "same sort of thing" to John Rocker after his SI ignorance. Nothing happened on the field, but he got suspended (and fined).

    I guess NASCAR tends to lean towards the family-friendly image thing. I didn't think the point deuction was justified on Dale Jr. either, but I think NASCAR lets their participants know about the public-image thing each season. Kind of like MLB lets it's participants know about the penalty for gambling on MLB (oops... don't go there!).
    Small market fan... always hoping, but never expecting.

  11. #25
    The rest is drama. marcshoe's Avatar
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    Re: NASCAR Haters?

    They didn't take runs away from the Braves in the previous game they had played. That's what NASCAR did. Fine all you want; suspend for future races if you want, but don't change the results of a completed race for a non-race related incident.

    btw, I mentioned on another board that I was feeling very grouchy tonight; I dont' know why. Now I'm proving it.

  12. #26
    For a Level Playing Field RedFanAlways1966's Avatar
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    Re: NASCAR Haters?

    Ah... if this is grumpy, you aren't that bad. You are right about the runs taken vs. the points taken. And the way Rocker was going at that point in his career it probably kept the Braves runs allowed down!
    Small market fan... always hoping, but never expecting.

  13. #27
    SERP Emeritus paintmered's Avatar
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    Re: NASCAR Haters?

    The day NASCAR starts turning right on a regular basis is the day I start liking it.

    Signed,
    Open wheel racing fan.
    What if this wasn't a rhetorical question?

    All models are wrong. Some of them are useful.

  14. #28
    Just The Big Picture macro's Avatar
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    Re: NASCAR Haters?

    As for there being only two events a year at a given track...many of the new tracks are set up to host several events featuring different types of vehicles and different types of racing. Some have road courses built into the infield and others have smaller ovals within the main oval. I find it hard to believe that this wouldn't be the case at this facility, as well.

  15. #29
    Beer is good!! George Anderson's Avatar
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    Re: NASCAR Haters?

    Quote Originally Posted by GAC View Post
    I was just watching the local news and they had a story on the "fight" in Seattle over building a proposed Nascar track. There are of course pros and cons to the issue. Many protest it because of the pollution they say it will bring, as well as disturbing the peace, tranquility, and the quality of life. Others argue the economic impact and job creation, as well as the entertainment aspect (fans).

    But what amazed me were the "on the street" interviews they showed, and the people's perception and stereotyping of Nascar and it's fans. Conversations peppered with terminology such as redneck, pot-bellied, toothless losers, and white trash.

    If any other group or class of people were described and stereotyped in that way there would be outrage.

    I haven't followed Nascar in over 30 years. I was a huge Petty fan, and my brother (who is still an avid fan, and still has all his teeth) was a David Pearson fan. Some of the above may have been true then, since it's origins are from the south, and that was where a majority of the races/tracks were located. But it's now become the fastest growing sport in the US, and has really expanded/broadened it's fan base.
    I think if you havent noticed by now there is a huge double standard in society today when dealing with certain racial groups and classes of people. As long as the media in this country and that includes the sports reporters let this double standard exist, there is little we can do about it except try to educate the masses as best we can.
    "Boys, I'm one of those umpires that misses 'em every once in a while so if it's close, you'd better hit it." Cal Hubbard

  16. #30
    Please come again pedro's Avatar
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    Re: NASCAR Haters?

    Quote Originally Posted by GAC View Post

    Do you wake up everyday with guilt, and lamenting the fact you were born Caucasian?
    I think you'd be surprised just how guilt free I feel GAC.
    Get your nunchucks and the keys to your dad's car. I know where we can get a gun


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