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Thread: Need help researching an "out"

  1. #1
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    Need help researching an "out"

    If a linedrive is hit to a fielder, and it hits his glove and knocks it off but stays in his glove the whole time, is it an out? The ball never touches the ground and stays in the glove the whole time. What is the ruling?

    I'm about 90% sure that it is an out, but a friend of mine feels he has to have his glove on to be an out. Can anyone find the ruling?

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  3. #2
    Puffy's Daddy Red Leader's Avatar
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    Re: Need help researching an "out"

    I'll look for the ruling but I'm 99.9999999 sure it's an out.

    Edit: Hindsight:
    Last edited by Red Leader; 03-02-2007 at 05:48 PM.
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    Re: Need help researching an "out"

    Here's what I have found about a catch, but nothing that tells me it's an out:

    A CATCH is the act of a fielder in getting secure possession in his hand or glove of a ball in flight and firmly holding it; providing he does not use his cap, protector, pocket or any other part of his uniform in getting possession. It is not a catch, however, if simultaneously or immediately following his contact with the ball, he collides with a player, or with a wall, or if he falls down, and as a result of such collision or falling, drops the ball. It is not a catch if a fielder touches a fly ball which then hits a member of the offensive team or an umpire and then is caught by another defensive player. If the fielder has made the catch and drops the ball while in the act of making a throw following the catch, the ball shall be adjudged to have been caught. In establishing the validity of the catch, the fielder shall hold the ball long enough to prove that he has complete control of the ball and that his release of the ball is voluntary and intentional.
    Rule 2.00 (Catch) Comment: A catch is legal if the ball is finally held by any fielder, even though juggled, or held by another fielder before it touches the ground. Runners may leave their bases the instant the first fielder touches the ball. A fielder may reach over a fence, railing, rope or other line of demarcation to make a catch. He may jump on top of a railing, or canvas that may be in foul ground. No interference should be allowed when a fielder reaches over a fence, railing, rope or into a stand to catch a ball. He does so at his own risk.
    If a fielder, attempting a catch at the edge of the dugout, is “held up” and kept from an apparent fall by a player or players of either team and the catch is made, it shall be allowed.

  5. #4
    Manliness Personified HumnHilghtFreel's Avatar
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    Re: Need help researching an "out"

    I'd say it's not an out then, since technically, the fielder himself wouldn't be in control of the ball.

  6. #5
    Matt's Dad RANDY IN INDY's Avatar
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    Re: Need help researching an "out"

    I would think, by that definition, that if the player does not control the ball in his possession for a set amount of time, it is not an out.
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    First Time Caller SunDeck's Avatar
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    Re: Need help researching an "out"

    It seems to me that the ball knocking a glove out of one's hand would be a ball that is not under control. The glove can't do that, only the player can.
    Next Reds manager, second shooter. --Confirmed on Redszone.

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    Puffy's Daddy Red Leader's Avatar
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    Re: Need help researching an "out"

    I stand corrected. Haven't found the actual rule yet but found this forum with fans asking MLB umpires questions. Here's one:

    The batter hit a wicked line drive back to the pitcher. The ball was hit so hard, that the glove fell off the pitchers hand and landed on the mound.
    Then the ball rolled out of the glove, so it was no catch, but the runner was still out at first from the throw.

    My question is, what if the ball stayed in the glove? Is that an out? Or does the glove have to be on the fielder's hand?




    Once the pitcher's mitt became separated from his person and hit the ground, the ball was no longer considered in flight and therefore could not be caught. Therefore, in your situation, the ball had to be thrown to first base for the putout of the batter-runner. BTW, if the ball/mitt combo was thrown to first (because the ball became stuck in it, for example), it would be a legal putout provided the ball/mitt combo didn't become loose in the first baseman's mitt.

    Weird, but it's happened.
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    Member Reds Fanatic's Avatar
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    Re: Need help researching an "out"

    The part of that rule that says firmly holding it would make me say it would not be a catch because if it came right off his hand I would think he would not be firmly holding it.

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    Re: Need help researching an "out"

    Once the pitcher's mitt became separated from his person and hit the ground, the ball was no longer considered in flight and therefore could not be caught.
    There it is, thanks!

    SAFE!

  11. #10
    Beer is good!! George Anderson's Avatar
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    Re: Need help researching an "out"

    I think it would be awfully hard for a ball to be hit hard enought to knock a glove off a hand and still stay in the glove unless the ball got somehow lodged in the mitt.

    So ok amateur umpires, what would be the call if under the same circumstances the ball knocked the glove off the fielders hand but it was stuck in the webbing of the glove?? Whats the call and do the runners advance???
    "Boys, I'm one of those umpires that misses 'em every once in a while so if it's close, you'd better hit it." Cal Hubbard

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    Re: Need help researching an "out"

    Quote Originally Posted by George Anderson View Post
    I think it would be awfully hard for a ball to be hit hard enought to knock a glove off a hand and still stay in the glove unless the ball got somehow lodged in the mitt.
    At work, we saw a play like that today from 2004, and no one knew the ruling, so that is why I asked. The ball rolled out at after tumbling twice.

  13. #12
    Puffy's Daddy Red Leader's Avatar
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    Re: Need help researching an "out"

    Quote Originally Posted by George Anderson View Post

    So ok amateur umpires, what would be the call if under the same circumstances the ball knocked the glove off the fielders hand but it was stuck in the webbing of the glove?? Whats the call and do the runners advance???
    Same applies. Ball is in play and not ruled an out. Runners advance at their own risk (ie, they are not "awarded" a base as no penalty has been accessed because they didn't purposely throw their glove).
    'When I'm not longer rapping, I want to open up an ice cream parlor and call myself Scoop Dogg.'
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  14. #13
    Zoinks!
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    Re: Need help researching an "out"

    So when Bugs Bunny threw his glove up in the air to catch a ball, it wasn't an out? Man, that really changes the outcome of that game with the Gashouse Gorillas.


  15. #14
    Beer is good!! George Anderson's Avatar
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    Re: Need help researching an "out"

    Quote Originally Posted by Red Leader View Post
    Same applies. Ball is in play and not ruled an out. Runners advance at their own risk (ie, they are not "awarded" a base as no penalty has been accessed because they didn't purposely throw their glove).
    Nope
    "Boys, I'm one of those umpires that misses 'em every once in a while so if it's close, you'd better hit it." Cal Hubbard

  16. #15
    Puffy's Daddy Red Leader's Avatar
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    Re: Need help researching an "out"

    Quote Originally Posted by minus5 View Post
    So when Bugs Bunny threw his glove up in the air to catch a ball, it wasn't an out? Man, that really changes the outcome of that game with the Gashouse Gorillas.

    Now that I think about it, didn't Bugs' arm "rubberize" like Stretch Armstrong all the way up in the air and actually catch it while it was still on his hand? Or am I thinking of another cartoon. I don't remember Bugs "throwing" his glove in the air.
    'When I'm not longer rapping, I want to open up an ice cream parlor and call myself Scoop Dogg.'
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