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View Poll Results: Who Would Make up the All-Time Reds Outfield?

Voters
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  • Gus Bell

    2 1.35%
  • Eric Davis

    79 53.38%
  • Adam Dunn

    6 4.05%
  • George Foster

    49 33.11%
  • Cesar Geronimo

    4 2.70%
  • Ival Goodman

    0 0%
  • Ken Griffey Jr.

    31 20.95%
  • Ken Griffey Sr.

    6 4.05%
  • Paul O'Neill

    3 2.03%
  • Dave Parker

    8 5.41%
  • Vada Pinson

    33 22.30%
  • Wally Post

    3 2.03%
  • Frank Robinson

    122 82.43%
  • Pete Rose

    64 43.24%
  • Edd Roush

    36 24.32%
  • Bobby Tolan

    0 0%
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Thread: Reds All-Time Outfield

  1. #76
    breath westofyou's Avatar
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    Re: Reds All-Time Outfield

    My point is some may think is a good/great player but he doesnt deserve to be included with some of the great Reds of the past.
    Actually his bat makes him part of the group despite his other warts, Foster wasn't a great 5 tooler, nor was Wally Post, Gus Bell, Rose, Parker or Pinson.. if those are the greats we are throwing around.

    BTW Adam Dunn will be in the Reds all time top ten for PA's for OF's by seasons end, so he must be doing something right.
    Code:
    PLATE APPEARANCES               PA     
    1    Vada Pinson                6850   
    2    Edd Roush                  5965   
    3    Pete Rose                  5753   
    4    Frank Robinson             5221   
    5    Gus Bell                   5111   
    6    George Foster              5010   
    7    Ken Griffey Sr.            4596   
    8    Ival Goodman               4020   
    9    Curt Walker                3942   
    10   Eric Davis                 3819   
    11   Cesar Geronimo             3736   
    12   Mike Mitchell              3550   
    13   Adam Dunn                  3466   
    14   Wally Post                 3313   
    15   Bob Bescher                3299

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  3. #77
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    Re: Reds All-Time Outfield

    I can tell one thing from the voting. Most of the voters are young. My 3 picks were Frank Robinson, Wally Post and Gus Bell.
    Maybe they don't have the stats that some of the others have but they played before the ball was juiced and league expansion which dilluted the talent. Some of the players on the list wouldn't even make the team back then.

  4. #78
    Beer is good!! George Anderson's Avatar
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    Re: Reds All-Time Outfield

    Quote Originally Posted by Driver62 View Post
    I can tell one thing from the voting. Most of the voters are young. My 3 picks were Frank Robinson, Wally Post and Gus Bell.
    Maybe they don't have the stats that some of the others have but they played before the ball was juiced and league expansion which dilluted the talent. Some of the players on the list wouldn't even make the team back then.
    I cannot get over the lack of love for Vada Pinson. His numbers are every bit the equivelant if not superior to Eric Davis, but yet Davis is killing him in votes.
    "Boys, I'm one of those umpires that misses 'em every once in a while so if it's close, you'd better hit it." Cal Hubbard

  5. #79
    breath westofyou's Avatar
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    Re: Reds All-Time Outfield

    Maybe they don't have the stats that some of the others have but they played before the ball was juiced and league expansion which dilluted the talent.
    I don't buy the juiced ball argument, sounds like the same old complaint, nary an ounce of proof.

    As for diluted talent I venture that they were playing in a pool that wasn't that deep either, they just played when every team had or two token black players. As for their skill level that's one that I see as being power heavy in a power heavy era (and the 50's were as one dimensional as they come for style of play) Not to mention both made an out 7 times out of every 10 times they came to the dish in their careers.

  6. #80
    Hisssssssss Yachtzee's Avatar
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    Re: Reds All-Time Outfield

    Quote Originally Posted by George Anderson View Post
    I cannot get over the lack of love for Vada Pinson. His numbers are every bit the equivelant if not superior to Eric Davis, but yet Davis is killing him in votes.
    I think that Pinson suffers from the fact that most of us have seen Eric Davis play, but not Pinson. I picked Davis, mainly because I saw how great he was. But it was a tough choice. I think if you had to pick guys based on where they played, you'd have Robinson in RF and Foster in LF, but then you have a log jam in CF with Roush, Pinson, and Davis.
    Burn down the disco. Hang the blessed DJ. Because the music that he constantly plays, it says nothing to me about my life.

  7. #81
    Big Red Machine RedsBaron's Avatar
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    Re: Reds All-Time Outfield

    Quote Originally Posted by George Anderson View Post
    I cannot get over the lack of love for Vada Pinson. His numbers are every bit the equivelant if not superior to Eric Davis, but yet Davis is killing him in votes.
    Pinson had a longer and more productive career than Davis, but I do not believe Vada in his peak seasons of 1959, 1961 and 1963 was quite as great as Eric was in 1986, 1987 and 1989. I haven't run the Stats Neutralizer on those two, nor have I seen Win Shares data on the two, so I could be wrong.
    "Hey...Dad. Wanna Have A Catch?" Kevin Costner in "Field Of Dreams."

  8. #82
    Posting in Dynarama M2's Avatar
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    Re: Reds All-Time Outfield

    Pinson was an old man when I saw him play (with the Royals), but I've never heard anyone call him the most exciting player they ever saw play the game (though one of our crew here did use his name for a handle for a while, might have been Scrap Irony/Biitner Pill). Eric Davis is the most exciting player I ever saw play the game of baseball.
    Baseball isn't a magic trick ... it doesn't get spoiled if you figure out how it works. - gonelong

    I'm witchcrafting everybody.

  9. #83
    Big Red Machine RedsBaron's Avatar
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    Re: Reds All-Time Outfield

    I did run the Stats Neutralizer on Pinson and Davis's best seasons. Pinson's look a bit better, given the era he played in. In 1959 his adjusted numbers include 212 hits, a .313 average, 21 HRs, 86 RBI, 22 SB, a .367 OBP and a .504 SPT. In 1961, the adjusted numbers are 214 hits, a .338 average, 16 HRs, 88 RBI, 24 SB, a .373 OBP and .494 SPT. 1963 produces 220 hits, a .329 average, 24 HRs, 120 RBI, 29 SB, a .364 OBP and .542 SPT.
    Eric Davis's adjusted numbers for 1986 are 116 hits, a .279 average, 27 HRs, 72 RBI, 81 SB, a .380 OBP and a .524 SPT. In 1987 he has 133 hits, a .284 average, 35 HRs, 94 RBI, 48 SB, a .388 OBP and a .573 SPT. In 1989 Davis has 136 hits, a .291 average, 36 HRs, 110 RBI, 22 SB, a .377 OBP and a .562 SPT.
    Pinson's Win Shares in 1959, 1961 and 1963 were 27, 32 and 31.
    Davis's Win Shares for 1986, 1987 and 1989 were 25, 30 and 26.
    I think that George Anderson has a worthy argument.
    "Hey...Dad. Wanna Have A Catch?" Kevin Costner in "Field Of Dreams."

  10. #84
    Beer is good!! George Anderson's Avatar
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    Re: Reds All-Time Outfield

    My biggest issue is Davis has well over twice the vote total that Pinson has. I wouldnt be suprised if Davis had more votes than Pinson considering few on this board myself included saw him play. But if you run the numbers they pretty much favor Pinson. I guess its just a generational thing that few here saw him play and dont appreciate how great he was.

    I'd say a Vada Pinson bobblehead night should be in the works!!
    Last edited by George Anderson; 03-20-2007 at 09:48 AM.
    "Boys, I'm one of those umpires that misses 'em every once in a while so if it's close, you'd better hit it." Cal Hubbard

  11. #85
    Redsmetz redsmetz's Avatar
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    Re: Reds All-Time Outfield

    I thought I'd bump this post up for the last hour of voting.

  12. #86
    Redsmetz redsmetz's Avatar
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    Re: Reds All-Time Outfield

    So here's the finish, the top seven. And frankly I think the top six would make two very good outfield corps. Clearly Edd Roush and Vada Pinson were hurt by folks not being familiar with them and if that's the case, I'd encourage folks to learn more about to steller outfielders for this club.

    I was going to limit it to the top six, but I noticed Junior came in 7th and it should be noted that among this pantheon of outfielders, that's about right. When Griff has been on, he's played very well. The couple of years he's had decent seasons here get overlooked.

    The reality is that this team has had a plethora of excellent outfielders, perhaps too often overlooked. I haven't checked it, but every player on this list have made the All Star game (except for Roush whose career pre-dates the game).

    Thanks to all for participating. It's been fun and it was a very interesting discussion.


    Frank Robinson 82.43%
    Eric Davis 53.38%
    Pete Rose 43.24%

    George Foster 33.11%
    Eddie Roush 24.32%
    Vada Pinson 22.30%

    Ken Griffey Jr. 20.95%


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