Bronson's tossed two good games for the Reds with nothing to show for it thus far. I remember a few years ago when Paul Wilson went through this for half a season. Hopefully the tide will turn soon. Until then, Bronson gets a big ole' "Hang with 'em".
It wasn't just two games this year...Bronson pitched well with little run support last year as well. He and Harang both could have pushed the twenty win mark with a little support. Hopefully things will turn around for him soon.Originally Posted by Redlegs
The Reds: "We make your #3 look like Clemens"
Ted Lilly and Doug Davis, both crafty lefthanders, did us in even when Bronson was "on" in his starts. Hopefully is next start isn't against a lefty we can't touch.
“I don’t care,” Votto said of passing his friend and former teammate. “He’s in the past. Bye-bye, Jay.”
If I'm not mistaken, that would be one Ted Lilly at Wrigley.
Another quality start today. More non-support and another loss.
why care so much about his record?Another quality start today. More non-support and another loss.
"This isn’t stats vs scouts - this is stats and scouts working together, building an organization that blends the best of both worlds. This is the blueprint for how a baseball organization should be run. And, whether the baseball men of the 20th century like it or not, this is where baseball is going."---Dave Cameron, U.S.S. Mariner
It's not so much Arroyo's record in particular. I just hate it when a pitcher goes out and gives good effort after good effort with nothing to show for it. He's pitching in some tough luck right now and is tagged with an 0-2 start despite giving quality outings every time. It's frustrating.
he's done his job....thats alot to show for it.
"This isn’t stats vs scouts - this is stats and scouts working together, building an organization that blends the best of both worlds. This is the blueprint for how a baseball organization should be run. And, whether the baseball men of the 20th century like it or not, this is where baseball is going."---Dave Cameron, U.S.S. Mariner
Obviously we have talked about the cold weather and the effect on games this season. We hear that it makes it harder for a pitcher to grip the ball. Has this been a problem for Bronson Arroyo? He has been good and deserved better, but he has already walked as many batters (7) in 3 starts as he walked in the entire month of April last season (yes, he had an IBB today, but still). Last year he did not walk a batter until his 3rd start of the season.
REDS Starters, % of strikes thrown
(1) Milton, 72.6%
(2) Belisle, 68.6%
(3) Lohse, 67.8%
(4) Harang, 67.2%
(5) Arroyo, 63.8%
% of strikes is not a tell-tale sign for success (see Milton). But the number of walks by Arroyo has been high for him thus far.
Bronson didn't do himself any favors today. He was okay, but again, if you can't keep this Cubs' outfit in check, maybe the problem lies in the pitching. The Cubs' offense (particularly without Ramirez) is not at all good.
I've said it once, I'll say it again: wait until this pitching faces a real offense; up to this point, they've only faced the dregs of the NL (Pitt, Chicago, Arizona).
Last edited by Falls City Beer; 04-14-2007 at 09:45 PM.
“And when finally they sense that some position cannot be sustained, they do not re-examine their ideas. Instead, they simply change the subject.” Jamie Galbraith
This is why I don't put much stock in won/loss record. It is a team stat, not an individual achievement. Think about it: a few more batters yesterday and Harang would have picked up a win, despite pitching a fairly poor game. Quality starts, WHIP, ERA, etc are much better indicators of pitching prowess.
Quality starts, WHIP, and ERA are severely flawed for similar reasons....
"This isn’t stats vs scouts - this is stats and scouts working together, building an organization that blends the best of both worlds. This is the blueprint for how a baseball organization should be run. And, whether the baseball men of the 20th century like it or not, this is where baseball is going."---Dave Cameron, U.S.S. Mariner
While I acknowledge they have weaknesses (all stats do), they are in no way reliant on the team's offense. You will never have a pitching stat that 100% eliminates team contribution; even ball-strike ratio depends largely on the catcher's call.
No but they are very reliant on the team's defense and their weaknesses basically render them useless-especailly sine there are much better ways. I'd also suggest that the catcher's call is the least of a pitcher's worries...
As pointed out here, there are actually very good ways to evaluate pitching that completely ignore run- and hit-based metrics and thus avoid dilution/masking of the pitcher's true contribution.
"This isn’t stats vs scouts - this is stats and scouts working together, building an organization that blends the best of both worlds. This is the blueprint for how a baseball organization should be run. And, whether the baseball men of the 20th century like it or not, this is where baseball is going."---Dave Cameron, U.S.S. Mariner
Posting Permissions
|
Board Moderators may, at their discretion and judgment, delete and/or edit any messages that violate any of the following guidelines: 1. Explicit references to alleged illegal or unlawful acts. 2. Graphic sexual descriptions. 3. Racial or ethnic slurs. 4. Use of edgy language (including masked profanity). 5. Direct personal attacks, flames, fights, trolling, baiting, name-calling, general nuisance, excessive player criticism or anything along those lines. 6. Posting spam. 7. Each person may have only one user account. It is fine to be critical here - that's what this board is for. But let's not beat a subject or a player to death, please. |
