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Thread: Burning down the pen.....

  1. #1
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    Burning down the pen.....

    Saarloos...8 games...he's been in 6 of them.
    Santos has been in half of them.
    Coffey and Stanton have been in 5 of 8.

    Last Night Coffey threw 5 pitches.
    Stanton threw 4.

    Mind you the wear of warming up is the same. To the arm an appearance is an appearance.

    We're going to get to June and suddenly these guys will start to drop like flies. The media will then talk about how nobody could have seen this coming and what a great job Jerry Narron is doing considering the circumstances and injuries.

    For this organizaiton to succeed, they have to get his bullpen usage tendancies under control. Longer outings. More regular roles.
    "Even a bad day at the ballpark beats the snot out of most other good days. I'll take my scorecard and pencil and beer and hot dog and rage at the dips and cheer at the highs, but I'm not ever going to stop loving this game and this team and nobody will ever take that away from me." Roy Tucker October 2010

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    Re: Burning down the pen.....

    Quote Originally Posted by dfs View Post

    For this organizaiton to succeed, they have to get his bullpen usage tendancies under control. Longer outings. More regular roles.
    Better starters. Guys who will give you 6 innings guaranteed every outing.

  4. #3
    Rally Onion! Chip R's Avatar
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    Re: Burning down the pen.....

    I agree. I made the same point last week. Only then we had only lost once so nobody cared.

    Quote Originally Posted by Falls City Beer View Post
    Better starters. Guys who will give you 6 innings guaranteed every outing.

    But that doesn't solve the problem. Every starter last week till Saturday went at least 6 innings. But Narron was blowing through that bullpen like it was Game 7 of the World Series. I think even LaRussa called him and said, "Dude, you're overusing your bullpen."
    Last edited by Chip R; 04-11-2007 at 10:18 PM.
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    Re: Burning down the pen.....

    Quote Originally Posted by Falls City Beer View Post
    Better starters. Guys who will give you 6 innings guaranteed every outing.
    Uhh, Milton and Harang are the only 2 guys not to go 6 innings so far, and both of them went 5 and 2/3rds.
    Quote Originally Posted by PuffyPig View Post
    Let's face it, you mis-hit the bun with the mustard squirter, no one will really care.

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    Re: Burning down the pen.....

    Quote Originally Posted by reds44 View Post
    Uhh, Milton and Harang are the only 2 guys not to go 6 innings so far, and both of them went 5 and 2/3rds.
    Oh just wait...

    When these starters (Lohse and the untested Belisle) start facing tough offenses, Katie bar the door.

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    Re: Burning down the pen.....

    Quote Originally Posted by Falls City Beer View Post
    Oh just wait...

    When these starters (Lohse and the untested Belisle) start facing tough offenses, Katie bar the door.
    That's fine if and when that happens, but it hasn't yet.
    Quote Originally Posted by PuffyPig View Post
    Let's face it, you mis-hit the bun with the mustard squirter, no one will really care.

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    Re: Burning down the pen.....

    Quote Originally Posted by reds44 View Post
    That's fine if and when that happens, but it hasn't yet.
    You mean in the way it hadn't happened in all those other Aprils in this decade?

    Three real starters = stability. Two = constantly flirting with entropy.

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    Re: Burning down the pen.....

    Quote Originally Posted by Falls City Beer View Post
    You mean in the way it hadn't happened in all those other Aprils in this decade?

    Three real starters = stability. Two = constantly flirting with entropy.
    True.


  10. #9
    Worst Behavior. reds44's Avatar
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    Re: Burning down the pen.....

    Quote Originally Posted by Falls City Beer View Post
    You mean in the way it hadn't happened in all those other Aprils in this decade?

    Three real starters = stability. Two = constantly flirting with entropy.
    2 is a helluva lot better then we've had for awhile. How many years was none? Matt Belisle is a guy that could make it 3.
    Quote Originally Posted by PuffyPig View Post
    Let's face it, you mis-hit the bun with the mustard squirter, no one will really care.

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    Re: Burning down the pen.....

    Quote Originally Posted by reds44 View Post
    Matt Belisle is a guy that could make it 3.
    And so could Elizardo....

  12. #11
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    Re: Burning down the pen.....

    Quote Originally Posted by reds44 View Post
    2 is a helluva lot better then we've had for awhile. How many years was none? Matt Belisle is a guy that could make it 3.
    I'm not picking on you, but I'm tired of people saying things like "2 is better than what we've had in the past." Be happy with 2 above decent starters. I'm not satisfied with mediocrity.

  13. #12
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    Re: Burning down the pen.....

    Come June we'll swap out some players....

    Bray, Magic will be good to go....

    Call up Livingston and Bailey....

    The Lizzard can be used....
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  14. #13
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    Re: Burning down the pen.....

    3 off days in April can give the staff more flexibility as well. Only one in May, but 4 in June (that's odd).
    When all is said and done more is said than done.

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    Re: Burning down the pen.....

    Our bullpen is currently on pace for the following innings:

    Stanton 54
    Cormier 20
    Santos 54
    Saarloos 76
    Coffey 78
    Weathers 102
    Coutlangus 30

    When your staters are giving you an average of 6.4 innings per start, you can utilize your bullpen much less. At this time, only Weathers has pitched more innings than you would like.

    The reason that Narron can go with shorter outings for his bullpen is because he hasn't needed to use them that much. This gets more relief pitvchers some work (to stay sharp), but more importantly, it has allowed Narron to get favourable matchups (especially with our LH relievers) which has made them more effective.

    I remember last year when the overworked bullpen forced guys like Shackleford to pitch multiple innings against RH hitters. It was courting disaster. As long as Shackleford faced LH hitters only, he was fine. Force him to face RH hitters and the roof will cave in. Same goes for guys like Cormier and Countlangus.
    Last edited by PuffyPig; 04-13-2007 at 12:42 PM.

  16. #15
    Reds 5:11 coachw513's Avatar
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    Re: Burning down the pen.....

    I must confess to not being able to know this answer...are most of these guys capable of more regular, shorter outings or is it indeed more treacherous in the long run???...

    I personally haven't felt the bullpen being overused...you can see a bit of role definition going on (Weathers closer, Saarloos and Stanton 8th inning guys, Coutlangus and Santos LH/RH specialists, Cormier and Coffey 6th-7th inning guys)...I think Santos will be the long guy as needed right now...I think the flexibility of 3 LH is good and gives lots of options...

    I think using guys 2 innings is more taxing over the long run, but smarter minds than mine will know for sure...


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