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Thread: Why things happen

  1. #1
    Dunnilicious creek14's Avatar
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    Why things happen

    So this sad and untimely death of Josh Hancock got me thinking about predetermination. Basically (and not trying to sound crude) but when your number is up, is it up?

    If Josh was still with the Reds would be still be alive? Or was today his day to die? He would have been in Pittsburgh with the Reds and not driving himself. Maybe he would have been in a cab and it wrecked.

    And what about Lidle? If he had been with the Reds he wouldn't have been flying a plane that day in NYC. Or would he have crashed out of some municipal airport in KY.

    So did these deaths happen due to a long string of events, or was it just the day they were set to die?

    I can think of a couple close calls I probably shouldn't have survived. Was it luck or fate that spared me?
    Will trade this space for a #1 starter.

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  3. #2
    Manliness Personified HumnHilghtFreel's Avatar
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    Re: Why things happen

    These are the kinds of things that I think about allll the time.

    It's weird to me to say "well, this was so and so's greater plan." It's intriguing though, maybe it all is just a grand scheme, but I don't think that is what it is. I think we all choose the paths that take us to wherever we end up. It'd be a boring show for the big man upstairs if he always knew how the story was going to end.

  4. #3
    You know his story Redsland's Avatar
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    Re: Why things happen

    Stephen Hawking's name came up in another thread recently, about a newly found planet and the likelihood that humans might someday visit it.

    Hawking has spoken at length about determinism, thanks in part to his role in helping formulate a Grand Unified Theory that would reduce the workings of the universe to a set of equations. These equations, some think, would suggest that free will is an illusion, since outcomes could be determined merely by knowing the initial conditions and then applying the proper equation.

    Hawking doesn't buy that. He's even stated that one of the things he's noticed about people who believe in predestination is that they still look both ways before crossing the street.
    Makes all the routine posts.

  5. #4
    THAT'S A FACT JACK!! GAC's Avatar
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    Re: Why things happen

    Quote Originally Posted by Redsland View Post
    Hawking doesn't buy that. He's even stated that one of the things he's noticed about people who believe in predestination is that they still look both ways before crossing the street.
    Because it doesn't mean that you then act foolishly with your life.

    I personally believe that God obviously knows the day you'll die (omniscience); but he doesn't set that day. I'd state more on the subject matter, but it then would become a religious thread.
    "panic" only comes from having real expectations

  6. #5
    Member dman's Avatar
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    Re: Why things happen

    Creek, I have to chime in on this one. The Highway Patrol has a very successful traffic enforcement program called LifeStat 1.0 where we are attempting to reduce traffic related deaths in Ohio to 1 per 100 million vehicle miles traveled in Ohio by the end of this year.

    Part of that program has us putting troopers in the areas where we have the most fatal crashes, no matter how much, or in some cases how little traffic passes through the area.

    I want to concentrate on that second part of the last paragraph, the how little traffic passes through. I was at a meeting last week listening to the district commander tear apart some of his post commanders' efforts because people were still getting killed on these roads, even though troopers were actively patrolling these roads when the fatal crashes occurred. In one instance, there was a trooper that passed by a soon to be victim and not even 5 minutes later was trying, albeit unsuccessfully, to give CPR until volunteer medics could be called out.

    So, a short answer to a long explanation, is I believe when your time is up, then your time is up, with certain exceptions thrown in.

    I do however, believe that there are choices and actions we can make to keep ourselves out of harms way and keep our number from being called earlier than what it's supposed to.
    Last edited by dman; 04-29-2007 at 08:47 PM.

  7. #6
    Member 15fan's Avatar
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    Re: Why things happen

    If you stop and think about the sequence of events that has unfolded since the beginning of time, it's rather humbling. The odds of any of us even occupying a slot in the space-time continuum is less likely than winning mega millions (or powerball) 100 times in a row.

    I'm only here because (1) my father survived a horrific car crash only because he wasn't wearing his seatbelt, and (2) my mother had a miscarriage with her first pregnancy. And those are just two things that happened to my parents. Go back generation after generation after generation and any of us can start to see that we are here despite the odds.

    I believe in free will. But what's fascinating is how the combination of random events as well as conscientious decisions has combined to produce the present.

    I'd have to say that dman's last 2 lines do a pretty good job of summing up my take on things, too.

  8. #7
    Manliness Personified HumnHilghtFreel's Avatar
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    Re: Why things happen

    Quote Originally Posted by 15fan View Post
    If you stop and think about the sequence of events that has unfolded since the beginning of time, it's rather humbling. The odds of any of us even occupying a slot in the space-time continuum is less likely than winning mega millions (or powerball) 100 times in a row.

    I'm only here because (1) my father survived a horrific car crash only because he wasn't wearing his seatbelt, and (2) my mother had a miscarriage with her first pregnancy. And those are just two things that happened to my parents. Go back generation after generation after generation and any of us can start to see that we are here despite the odds.

    I believe in free will. But what's fascinating is how the combination of random events as well as conscientious decisions has combined to produce the present.

    I'd have to say that dman's last 2 lines do a pretty good job of summing up my take on things, too.
    My history teacher in highschool talked about this quite a bit.

    He always talked about how his grandfather served in WWII and had he ever been one step in the wrong direction, we might not be getting this lecture.

    It really is mindblowing to sit and think back on the chronology of life.

  9. #8
    Charlie Brown All-Star IslandRed's Avatar
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    Re: Why things happen

    He always talked about how his grandfather served in WWII and had he ever been one step in the wrong direction, we might not be getting this lecture.
    That reminds me of the famous Civil War historian Bruce Catton writing about the trajectory of a bullet and the trajectory of a man.

    I agree with GAC, God may know it but we don't. Whether it's nine months or 90 years, it's all a blink of an eye in the big picture. All we can do is live life the best we can. And hopefully leave the world just a little bit better, in some tiny way, for our being here.
    Not all who wander are lost

  10. #9
    Resident optimist OldRightHander's Avatar
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    Re: Why things happen

    Without taking this too far into a religious thread, I do believe that to a certain degree your number comes up and there's not a whole lot you can do about it. That doesn't mean that we can't take reasonable precautions in order to avoid certain types of deaths. I'm not likely to die in a skydiving accident if I don't skydive. On the other hand, death is a natural part of life that none of us can avoid indefinitely. Our part, and this is where this post could get dangerously close to a religious one, is simply to be ready for the inevitable. Life is full of a certain amount of randomness that is beyond our control. Perhaps Josh's death was along those lines, a case of wrong place in the wrong time. A couple minutes later or earlier along that stretch of road and he possibly might have avoided the accident all together. Or if there hadn't been the earlier accident that the wrecker was responding to, he would not have had anything there to run into.

    Now whether or not he still would have died some other way is a question whose answer depends to a large part on whatever faith you adhere to. It's probably not something we have the answer to now, or will ever come close to figuring out in this lifetime. All we can do is be ready, and I hope Josh was.
    Last edited by OldRightHander; 04-30-2007 at 06:58 AM.

  11. #10
    Hisssssssss Yachtzee's Avatar
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    Re: Why things happen

    They just do. Now turn off the light and get to sleep. It's way past your bedtime.
    Burn down the disco. Hang the blessed DJ. Because the music that he constantly plays, it says nothing to me about my life.

  12. #11
    1st pick 2022 B.B. draft George Foster's Avatar
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    Re: Why things happen

    A couple of years ago, on vacation, I was pissed because my family was taking so long at a rest area. It took them forever to go pee, wash their hands, etc. 20 miles down the road, we came upon a horrible accident, before the police had a chance to get there. Made me think about if we left the rest area when I wanted to, what would of happened?
    Not this year...maybe a Wild Card

  13. #12
    1st pick 2022 B.B. draft George Foster's Avatar
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    Re: Why things happen

    Last year in Lexington, a 8 month pregnant lady had just parked her car and was walking to work down the side walk. She was walking beside a 5 floor parking structure when a 15ft by 10ft piece of concreate fell from the 3rd floor killing her and her child instantly. Man....if she would of just checked her hair in the rear view mirror for 5 seconds, or brushed her teeth for 5 more seconds, etc., she would be alive today. Horrible story.
    Not this year...maybe a Wild Card

  14. #13
    Member harangatang's Avatar
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    Re: Why things happen

    All I can say is live your life like Ryan Freel plays baseball. You never know what's coming tomorrow.
    Last edited by harangatang; 04-30-2007 at 01:04 AM.

  15. #14
    Member Ron Madden's Avatar
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    Re: Why things happen

    I believe our days are numbered.

    We ourselves or others can lessen those numbers but we can't add to them.

    I just beliieve that.

  16. #15
    Hey Cubs Fans RFS62's Avatar
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    Re: Why things happen

    If you've read any Castenada, you might be familiar with a concept he discussed with Don Juan.

    "Using death as an advisor".

    Basically, it's imagining that today would be your last day on earth, and you know it.

    How differently we'd approach each passing moment. There would be no time for petty moods. No time for inconsequential arguments over material things. No time for all the trappings of modern society which get in our way, each and every day.

    There would only be time for the essence of life. Our relationships with our loved ones. Our spiritual lives, or lack thereof.

    How powerful it would be to live life like that. The only thing we really have any control over is the "now". Worrying about the future or agonizing over the past disappears.

    The next time you want to blow your horn at someone in traffic or get angry at someone's petty or ignorant actions, use death as your advisor. I'll bet your mood changes immediately.
    "Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover."
    ~ Mark Twain


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