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Thread: weathers, saarloss, stanton, majewski hammond etc

  1. #1
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    weathers, saarloss, stanton, majewski hammond etc

    all the same dross

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    Bread Gloves Razor Shines's Avatar
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    Re: weathers, saarloss, stanton, majewski hammond etc

    Given enough chances Santos could be just as bad.
    "three dimes, a one hundred dollar bill and and 87 ones..."

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    Member CTA513's Avatar
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    Re: weathers, saarloss, stanton, majewski hammond etc

    Quote Originally Posted by Razor Shines View Post
    Given enough chances Santos could be just as bad.
    Victor Santos is the best player ever to wear a baseball uniform.

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    Re: weathers, saarloss, stanton, majewski hammond etc

    whats your alternative weathers or maybe stanton yeah they are proven major league pyromaniacs whose best performance was with reagan as president

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    Worst Behavior. reds44's Avatar
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    Re: weathers, saarloss, stanton, majewski hammond etc

    Quote Originally Posted by redsupport View Post
    whats your alternative weathers or maybe stanton yeah they are proven major league pyromaniacs whose best performance was with reagan as president
    Victor Santos has never had a best perfomance. He's just had least horrible ones.

    Victor Santos is no better (and probably worse) then Weathers, and made even Stanton.
    "The guy I think could be really good in center is Adam Dunn. If someone asked me if Dunn could be a center fielder for the next 10 years, if he started working on it, no one could explain to me why he couldn’t do it." - Brad Kullman

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    Re: weathers, saarloss, stanton, majewski hammond etc

    are you the oracle of delphi. If you are let me know how the stock market is going to do on Monday

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    Worst Behavior. reds44's Avatar
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    Re: weathers, saarloss, stanton, majewski hammond etc

    Quote Originally Posted by redsupport View Post
    are you the oracle of delphi. If you are let me know how the stock market is going to do on Monday
    It doesn't take the oracle of delphi to know Victor Santos is a bad pitcher.
    "The guy I think could be really good in center is Adam Dunn. If someone asked me if Dunn could be a center fielder for the next 10 years, if he started working on it, no one could explain to me why he couldn’t do it." - Brad Kullman

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    Re: weathers, saarloss, stanton, majewski hammond etc

    Quote Originally Posted by redsupport View Post
    are you the oracle of delphi. If you are let me know how the stock market is going to do on Monday
    Judging by past trends it will go up.
    Judging by Santos' past trends so will his ERA.

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    He has the Evil Eye! flyer85's Avatar
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    Re: weathers, saarloss, stanton, majewski hammond etc

    Santos is basically Weathers 7-8 years ago. A failed starter he will likely turn into a decent middle reliever. Might as well go with the younger guys as opposed to the Sunshine Boys.
    What are you, people? On dope? - Mr Hand

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    Bread Gloves Razor Shines's Avatar
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    Re: weathers, saarloss, stanton, majewski hammond etc

    Quote Originally Posted by redsupport View Post
    are you the oracle of delphi. If you are let me know how the stock market is going to do on Monday
    Well here's their career numbers:

    Santos: ERA 5.07, WHIP 1.57, K/9 6.25

    Saarloos: ERA 4.78, WHIP 1.50, K/9 6.28

    Majewski: ERA 3.70, WHIP 1.45, K/9 5.33

    Weathers: 4.35, 1.50, 6.52

    Stanton: 3.84, 1.34, 7.28

    Why doesn't Santos belong in that group? Maybe because his numbers are the worst? Granted the only reason Weathers and Stanton's numbers are better are because their best days are far behind them.

    I don't see anyone claiming that theses guys are good, it's just that Santos isn't the answer for this pen either.

    I'd rather see Coffey, Salmon and some other AAA guys at this point.
    Last edited by Razor Shines; 05-05-2007 at 12:03 AM.
    "three dimes, a one hundred dollar bill and and 87 ones..."

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    He has the Evil Eye! flyer85's Avatar
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    Re: weathers, saarloss, stanton, majewski hammond etc

    Quote Originally Posted by Razor Shines View Post
    Well here's their career numbers:

    Santos: ERA 5.07, WHIP 1.57, K/9 6.25

    Saarloos: ERA 4.78, WHIP 1.50, K/9 6.28

    Majewski: ERA 3.70, WHIP 1.45, K/9 5.33

    Weathers: 4.35, 1.50, 6.52

    Stanton: 3.84, 1.34, 7.28
    and what do they have in common?

    They are middle relievers on their best day and should only pitch in low leverage situations. The problems is that when you have a pen full of those types somebody has to pitch the high leverage innings and at this point in their careers, Stanton and Weathers are really poor bets.

    Santos still has an inflated ERA from pitching a lot of his innings a a starter.
    What are you, people? On dope? - Mr Hand

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    Re: weathers, saarloss, stanton, majewski hammond etc

    Quote Originally Posted by Razor Shines View Post
    Well here's their career numbers:

    Santos: ERA 5.07, WHIP 1.57, K/9 6.25

    Saarloos: ERA 4.78, WHIP 1.50, K/9 6.28

    Majewski: ERA 3.70, WHIP 1.45, K/9 5.33

    Weathers: 4.35, 1.50, 6.52

    Stanton: 3.84, 1.34, 7.28
    Wow that a bad pen. It can't be this bad can it?
    Don't smoke'em if you got'em

  14. #13
    One and a half men Patrick Bateman's Avatar
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    Re: weathers, saarloss, stanton, majewski hammond etc

    Santos is more of the same. He could probably get his ERA in the 4.50 type of range as a reliever, but that's about it.

    He has been a abelow average pitcher his entire career, and other than a string of fortunate luck he has been a below average reliever since joining the Reds IMO.

    You are kidding yourself if you think Santos is the answer in stabilizing the back end of the bullpen.

  15. #14
    SSG, Red Army Choir Guacarock's Avatar
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    Re: weathers, saarloss, stanton, majewski hammond etc

    Stabilizing the backend of the bullpen is really what's keeping us from being a stronger, contending team. We're simply losing too many late and close heartbreakers.

    The stats tell the tale of the tape.

    Our hurlers so far in 2007 have posted a cumulative 3.82 ERA, 10th best among all 30 teams. We have given up a stingy 75 walks, the lowest total for any squad. We have surrendered only 19 HRs, which is just amazing considering we play in a homerun haven and still have Eric Milton assigned to starting duties. The only NL squads that have allowed fewer home runs -- Los Angeles, San Diego and San Francisco -- play in caverns instead of band boxes.

    So, why, with our overall pitching performance having improved so markedly from past years, are we still coming up short, posting a frustrating 13-15 record?

    Beyond the usual flukes, injuries and statistical variations, you have to finger the bullpen. Our pitchers have a cumulative 3.48 ERA over the first 6 innings of play, good enough for 5th best among the 30 teams. But starting from the 7th inning on, the ERA mushrooms to 4.52, knocking us down to 22nd, meaning only 8 teams are doing worse.

    Get even deeper into the games and we deteriorate further. The Reds now have collected five saves, same as the Nationals. Only the Yankees have fewer saves -- three.

    The lessons to be drawn from this.

    1. Probably wasn't a wise decision to enter the season without a designated closer.

    2. It's likely asking too much to rely on Weathers and Stanton for high-pressure situations, either closing out games or setting up same. Their experience suggests they can be reliable middle relievers, but their lack of juice warrants keeping them out of the kitchen when it's the hottest.

    3. If they can't do it, who can? Should we bring on the kids for tryouts, or else hope either Bray or Majewski can return to form and good health, or Guardado is bionic, or Coffey isn't too snakebit from being overly stretched and used as elastically as Scott Sullivan used to be?

    Krivsky, for all his prowess elsewhere, hasn't succeeded yet in placing this last puzzle piece. And Narron, I suspect, is just too enamored with his quest to find interchangeable, one-size-fits-all players. I don't understand his reluctance to assign specific roles for each reliever, just as I can't make heads or cents out of his ever-evolving lineup cards.

    Don't get me wrong. Overall, I see some signs of hope for the team's future, which is saying something considering how many years we have been churning, and toiling in the wilderness, and losing, losing, flat-out losing.

    Still, having been spoiled by Franco, Dibble, Shaw, Charlton, Murphy, Granger and company, it's frustrating to see the bullpen become our Achilles heel. How could our base of strength become such a sore point and weakness so quickly?
    Last edited by Guacarock; 05-06-2007 at 02:10 AM.

  16. #15
    Rally Onion! Chip R's Avatar
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    Re: weathers, saarloss, stanton, majewski hammond etc

    Quote Originally Posted by Guacarock View Post
    3. If they can't do it, who can? Should we bring on the kids for tryouts, or else hope either Bray or Majewski can return to form and good health, or Guardado is bionic, or Coffey isn't too snakebit from being overly stretched and used as elastically as Scott Sullivan used to be?
    Naw, we can't use the kids in pressure situations. They might walk guys and give up hits.
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