I thought Jay Bilas' editorial on this was spot on.
I thought Jay Bilas' editorial on this was spot on.
Grape works as a soda. Sort of as a gum. I wonder why it doesn't work as a pie. Grape pie? There's no grape pie. - Larry David
Originally Posted by George Foster
I like you a lot, George..you know that. Please just take a second and explain to me why UK is a lock to be top dog again in the SEC, especially now that Billy's back. Is it a birthright? Just the natural order of things? Really, that's the only argument you have.
I know you've got a pretty good class coming in next year but, your returning players are not exactly legendary. I know you guys all think Billy Gillespie is the next Rupp but, he has yet to coach one game for you. Look at the rest of the SEC. It's not the doormat it once was. Billy Donovan is back. UF's won 2 NC's in a row. Our incoming class is ranked #1 by many respected recruiting services. Tennessee and Bruce Pearl are likely next year's SEC faves. They'll likely get better and better under The Sweaty One. Dennis Felton's slowly but surely building a very solid Georgia program. Alabama and Mark Gottfried are always in the mix. UK fave Pelphrey should turn Arkansas into a contender as soon as next season. Vandy almost made the Elite 8 this year. Former Beatcat Coach Andy Kennedy has Ole Miss moving in the right direction.
Point is, UK can no longer simply regain dominance simply because it wants to do so.
AFA your points on Donovan, Billy's had more than just a "good run." A "good run" is making the NCAA's a few consecutive seasons and making the occasional Sweet 16/Elite 8 while being in the mix for conference championships and even winning a couple. Billy taking this program where he has and winning BACK TO BACK National Championships is the stuff of legend and it has only been done by a few coaches.
Furthermore, Billy having all 5 of his starters return was not luck. Not at all. First of all, he took those guys - mostly sophomores getting their first meaningful PT in '06 - and won a title in 2006. Those guys all loved each other so much that they wanted to try to do it again. You have to credit Donovan for not only recognizing their talent (Only player in the 2004 class of Noah/Horford/Green/Brewer that was recognized as a 5 star recruit was Corey Brewer) but recruiting kids who had high character and great chemistry. Those 4 guys will be great friends the rest of their lives.
Lastly, methinks you would not question Donovan nor his character ONE BIT had he reconsidered his position on the Kentucky job.
“The crows seem to be calling my name,” thought Caw.
Your corollary about Donovan and the UK job is inaccurate.
If Donovan was the head coach at UK, had just won back to back championships, accepted the head coaching job at Orlando and then changed his mind and decided to stay with UK, would my opinion of his character have been affected?
You bet it would have.
Last edited by WMR; 06-06-2007 at 09:54 PM.
Firstly, I disagree about that..if Billy G is all you guys think he will be, takes you back to the top of the mountain, accepts a position with the NBA then changes his mind a day later, you'd forgive him. Especially once you really get to know the man and his family. Let's not forget, folks - this type of stuff is faaaar from unprecedented.
What I meant when I referenced Billy and UK was that if Billy changed his mind after turning UK down and decided that was what he wanted 2 days later, UK fans would not be nearly as critical, if at all.
“The crows seem to be calling my name,” thought Caw.
There is a difference, and I think it has to do with the history of the program.
Kentucky fans were willing to let Pitino go because in our eyes, he was not bigger than the program.(Of course, when you have had Adolph Rupp and Joe B Hall, you can do that). On the other hand, at Florida, Billy Donovan IS the program.
Its like the Duke UNC comparison I used in the other thread. Donovan has Florida moving in the same direction Coach K did at Duke, and its all because of one man's success. On the other hand, Kentucky fits the mold as UNC due to the prestige and history.
I've gotta get to work, but i'll post more later on tonight.
Nor should it to a 18 year old kid who may be in the position of declaring for the NBA draft one day and then a month later decide to come back to school the next year.
Apples and oranges.
Huge difference between a contract and a grant-in-aid.
Plus, the coach gets paid big $ either way.
When all is said and done more is said than done.
To you and me, maybe. But not to an 18 year old kid. If a kid wants to play for Florida and Donovan, he knows Donovan's not going to the NBA now and probably not to any other college job during his time there.
Donovan officially released from the Magic today and will remain at Florida
In other news, Paris Hilton was released from jail after 3 days because of a rash......I doubt the rash had anything to do with jail.......
Last edited by Matt700wlw; 06-07-2007 at 06:21 PM.
Finishing my thoughts from earlier.
About Billy G. I know a lot of Kentucky fans (including myself) are excited about the progress that has been made so far, especially on the recruiting trail. Since coming to Lexington, the guy has done nothing but recruit. Its sad, but I think most Kentucky fans are so used to the Academic All Americans that Tubby recruited that when Billy started talking to all of these names, those who had praised Tubby are now eating their words.
Kentucky will make significant progress under Billy G. Unlike Tubby, Gillispie models his system to fit the players, not the players to fit the system. Those who didn't fit Tubby's slow down system didn't play, and it also scared off potential recruits such as Brandan Wright. I look for Derrick Jasper and Jodie Meeks to both take off this year under Billy G.
All of the keys are in place and there has been talk that Gillispie is going to go with a four guard offense similar to the Golden St Warriors.(Jasper, Meeks, Bradley, and Crawford). The only glaring need on this team is help in the frontcourt, especially when your center is Jared Carter, who spent most of last season in Tubby's doghouse.
One thing concerns me about Billy Gillispie that I don't hear a lot of Kentucky fans mention, and that is the same thing being discussed about Donovan right now, character. While I have issues with OTS as a coach, he was a family man and was loyal to a fault. If the man said he had your back, he had your back, and I believe that is why he took the Minnesota job(Barnhardt had ordered him to clean house and he refused).
Gillispie though has a history of DUI's that are rarely mentioned, and I am worried what the reaction will be if he picks one up while in Lexington. While I feel that the program is moving in the right direction, I could see reason for concern if he turns into the next Bob Huggins or Eddie Sutton.
Billy G: I'm in Cleveland, but if you need a ride, CALL ME and I WILL FIND ONE FOR YOU IN LEX!!!
I think Billy G. is a lot smarter than Sutton about drinking. The DUI was in 2002, there is not a pattern. Sutton was stoped numerous times while in Lex. for drinking and taken home. He had (has) a problem that is well documented.
After the DUI charge, Billy G. wrote a personal hand written note to each season ticket holder apologizing for his actions.
1st pick of the 2023 baseball amateur draft
UK will be a SEC powerhouse again. We will be a lot better next season and the future is bright because we have a new coach, that has a very good record of recruiting and winning at programs that are not known for there basketball programs. Like Pitino did at Providence, and taking the Knicks back to the playoffs after years of losing. The past is a good predictor of the future. We are Kentucky. One of the best basketball programs ever. Winning breads winning. Just like Ohio State football, they were down. They got a great coach who can recruit and they are in the hunt for a ring most every year. If you were a great high school player in football would you rather go to Ohio State or the Cincinnati Bearcats? Why did you pick Ohio State? They win, and the tradition. It takes both however. Tradition alone will not get you recruits now-adays. They both feed on each other. Houston had a pretty good few years in the 80's with a strong recruiting class. Why didn't it last? No tradition.
They same with basketball. If you could go to Kentucky or Alabama which would you go to? With Tubby, the program went down because of his laziness in recruiting, and his style of play. We starting losing, and no one wanted to go play for Kentucky. Heck I told my wife, if I had a kid who could play, he would not go to Kentucky if Tubby was still around. He'd be wearing Orange.
When we start getting recruits again like Patterson and Legion, we will start winning. When we start winning, we will get more recruits easier because we are Kentucky...and winning again. Just like Ohio State football. They get to the kitchen table easier with recruits because they are who they are and they are winning. Even if the Bearcats had a few good years, they are still the Bearcats and would have a lot harder time getting the same recruit.
It was a "good run" that Florida had, or is on. They don't last forever..Take Duke for instance. The stuff of legends is doing what Pitino did after probation, Kentucky was the college team of the 90's. I think the sporting news or SI game them that title, not me. It was a good run, we are due for another one.
It was very lucky that Donovan had the entire starting 5 coming back. Most championship teams are senior rich. And most under classmen who dominate in college after a ring go pro. It's a credit to Donovan that he won it with under classman. Kentucky lost several key players after 96, and made it to the championship game in 97, lost several more and won it again in 98. Dick Vitalle(sp?) said if Derek Anderson was healthy, we would of won 3 in a row. He could not play in the NCAA tournament because of knee surgery.
I would of questioned Donovan's character if he had signed a new contract with Florida and 2 days later, cryed and tried to get out of it to come to Kentucky. That is not what a man does. You honor your word. Circumstances don't change in 2 or 3 days. 2 or 3 years....yes. If he had signed with Orlando and in 2 or 3 seasons hated it, then you have a right to change jobs, just like we do.
If you hired someone to take a job after a long interview process, they took the job and 2 days later quit...would you question their thought process and character? I would. Under the same circumstances, if they quit after 2 years would you question them? I would not. I would figure they wanted to move on.
1st pick of the 2023 baseball amateur draft
Great post all around, GF.
Actually Gillespie had 2 DUIs. One in 99, one in 03.
http://www.courier-journal.com/apps/...TS03/704070505
When all is said and done more is said than done.
Posting Permissions
|
Board Moderators may, at their discretion and judgment, delete and/or edit any messages that violate any of the following guidelines: 1. Explicit references to alleged illegal or unlawful acts. 2. Graphic sexual descriptions. 3. Racial or ethnic slurs. 4. Use of edgy language (including masked profanity). 5. Direct personal attacks, flames, fights, trolling, baiting, name-calling, general nuisance, excessive player criticism or anything along those lines. 6. Posting spam. 7. Each person may have only one user account. It is fine to be critical here - that's what this board is for. But let's not beat a subject or a player to death, please. |
Reply With Quote