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Thread: Taking Stock- The State of Reds Organizational Pitching

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    Taking Stock- The State of Reds Organizational Pitching

    STARTING PITCHING

    The way I see it, four of the five rotation spots are locked up for the next four years. Harang and Arroyo are signed through 2011, and Bailey is here to stay. I think most are in agreement that Matt Belisle has shown that he can be a very competitive #5 starter at the big league level for the forseeable future. That leaves one spot available, barring trades and injury. Here's how it shakes down:

    (lefties in ALL CAPS)

    MAJOR LEAGUE LEVEL

    Aaron Harang 29
    Bronson Arroyo 30
    Homer Bailey 21
    Matt Belisle 27

    MINOR LEAGUE LEVEL (in order of present prospect status)

    Johnny Cueto, 21 A+
    Sean Watson, 21 A
    Daryl Thompson, 21 A+
    Carlos Fisher, 24 AA
    Richie Gardner, 25 AAA
    TRAVIS WOOD, 20 A+
    Sam LeCure, 22 AA
    Rafael Gonzalez, 21 A
    TZU-KAI CHIU, 19, Rookie
    Josh Ravin, 19 Rookie
    Kyle Lotzkar 17, Rookie


    LONG RELIEVERS/SPOT STARTERS

    The following pitchers, while not strong candidates to be quality starters for years to come, have the potential to provide solid long relief/spot starting duty.

    Elizardo Ramirez, 24
    PHIL DUMATRAIT, 25
    Bobby Livingston, 25


    RELIEF PITCHERS

    In my opinion, the sooner the Reds are able to trade the likes of David Weathers and Mike Stanton, the better for the development of the youngsters and the outlook of the future. The Reds currently have several guys both at the minor and major league levels that are ready to be battle tested with the big club. I say we let these guys take their lumps and then see what remains. I believe there are two tiers of the major league guys, with Bray, McBeth and Coffey in a higher class than Coutlangous, Burton and Salmon. Regardless, when you throw in the minor league guys, there are enough arms here to go forward without the veterans that just clog the payroll. Let's see what we got:

    MAJOR LEAGUE LEVEL

    BILL BRAY, 24
    Marcus McBeth, 26
    Todd Coffey, 26
    JARED COUTLANGOUS, 26
    Jared Burton, 26
    Brad Salmon, 27

    MINOR LEAGUE LEVEL (by present prospect status)

    Tyler Pelland, 23 AA
    Calvin Medlock, 24 AA
    Carlos Guevara, 25 AA
    Last edited by Benihana; 06-14-2007 at 12:55 PM.
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    He has the Evil Eye! flyer85's Avatar
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    Re: Taking Stock- The State of Reds Organizational Pitching

    I would throw Roenicke in the relief mix.
    What are you, people? On dope? - Mr Hand

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    Re: Taking Stock- The State of Reds Organizational Pitching

    Good points but if you trade all of the vetreans then the oldest guy in the bullpen is 27 and in his first full season with the reds.

    Are we even sure that the minor league bullpen guys are ready to contribute because aren't they all at AA or lower.

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    Re: Taking Stock- The State of Reds Organizational Pitching

    Quote Originally Posted by flyer85 View Post
    I would throw Roenicke in the relief mix.
    Isnt he only in single A?

    Does he deserve a shot right now, Im not sure but maybe in Sept.

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    Re: Taking Stock- The State of Reds Organizational Pitching

    Quote Originally Posted by Benihana View Post

    LOOGIES

    The following pitchers, while not strong candidates to be quality starters for years to come, have the potential to provide solid long relief/spot starting duty.

    Elizardo Ramirez, 24
    PHIL DUMATRAIT, 25
    Bobby Livingston, 25
    Not to nitpick, but the term LOOGY stands for Lefty One Out GuY. Right-handed pitchers (Lizard) or guys who you project as long relievers / spot starters (Dumatrait, Livingston) should not be lumped under the LOOGY moniker.
    Last edited by Steve4192; 06-14-2007 at 12:49 PM.

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    Re: Taking Stock- The State of Reds Organizational Pitching

    Quote Originally Posted by Steve4192 View Post
    Not to nitpick, but the term LOOGY stands for Lefty One Out GuY. Right-handed pitchers (Lizard) or guys who you project as long relievers / spot starters (Dumatrait, Livingston) should not be lumped under the LOOGY moniker.
    you're right, I had a brain fart. What I meant for that category was Long Relief/Spot starter. Thanks.
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    Re: Taking Stock- The State of Reds Organizational Pitching

    Quote Originally Posted by bearcatfan24 View Post
    Good points but if you trade all of the vetreans then the oldest guy in the bullpen is 27 and in his first full season with the reds.

    Are we even sure that the minor league bullpen guys are ready to contribute because aren't they all at AA or lower.
    I'd keep Guardado around both for his pitching potential, his untradeable status due to his injury, but also for his tutelage to the young guys. Weathers and Stanton both have some trade value, g'bye!

    Medlock and Guevara will probably be ready for a shot in the bigs by September. They should both be promoted to AAA at the break. Pelland needs some more seasoning, since he recently made the switch from starting.
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    Waitin til next year bucksfan2's Avatar
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    Re: Taking Stock- The State of Reds Organizational Pitching

    A lot of people on this board are really high on Belisle. I am not one of those. I think he is a back of the rotation starter. Obviously the reds could do a lot worse back there but the reds hopefully will have better options. I hope that they are able to replace him at some point.

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    Re: Taking Stock- The State of Reds Organizational Pitching

    Quote Originally Posted by bucksfan2 View Post
    A lot of people on this board are really high on Belisle. I am not one of those. I think he is a back of the rotation starter. Obviously the reds could do a lot worse back there but the reds hopefully will have better options. I hope that they are able to replace him at some point.
    that's all I said- that he is a very serviceable #5 starter, and better than league average at that spot. By no means do I suggest he should be anything more, and if two of these guys from the minors end up being better than him, so be it.
    Go BLUE!!!

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    Re: Taking Stock- The State of Reds Organizational Pitching

    In my opinion, the sooner the Reds are able to trade the likes of David Weathers and Mike Stanton, the better for the development of the youngsters and the outlook of the future
    I'm OK with keeping Weathers although he probably will have the most trade value. The pitchers clogging the path for the youngsters are the likes of Stanton and Majewski. Might even add Coffey to that list...

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    Re: Taking Stock- The State of Reds Organizational Pitching

    Quote Originally Posted by Sea Ray View Post
    I'm OK with keeping Weathers although he probably will have the most trade value. The pitchers clogging the path for the youngsters are the likes of Stanton and Majewski. Might even add Coffey to that list...
    Coffey I'd keep. Majewski I'd cut. Try to trade Stanton and Weathers if you can.
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    Re: Taking Stock- The State of Reds Organizational Pitching

    Quote Originally Posted by Benihana View Post
    Coffey I'd keep. Majewski I'd cut. Try to trade Stanton and Weathers if you can.
    Majewski I would send down to AAA and hope he can work out his stuff. Coffey I trade if anyone offeres me anything of value in return. He just doesn't have the stuff to be a late inning reliever and is more suited as a 6th inning pitcher.

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    Re: Taking Stock- The State of Reds Organizational Pitching

    Bobby Livingston is a LH and Coutlangus first name is John I believe. :fineprint
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    Re: Taking Stock- The State of Reds Organizational Pitching

    Quote Originally Posted by bucksfan2 View Post
    Majewski I would send down to AAA and hope he can work out his stuff. Coffey I trade if anyone offeres me anything of value in return. He just doesn't have the stuff to be a late inning reliever and is more suited as a 6th inning pitcher.
    I'm really starting to wonder if Majewski isn't done! He is obviously not injured and he is throwing strikes, but his "stuff" looks to be flat and straight.
    "You can't let praise or criticism get to you. It's a weakness to get caught up in either one."

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