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Thread: no problem with youngsters in the bullpen

  1. #1
    Member icehole3's Avatar
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    no problem with youngsters in the bullpen

    Let them take their lumps now, youve got Weathers, Everyday Eddie coaching them... I've got no problem with them learning on the job at this point. I wouldve like to have Burton instead of Stone but whatever give Ricky a shot too, see if he still has it. Bray and Burton need to be up here soon IMO. We are 20 games out it's extended spring training time. Belisle IMO should continue his development in the rotation.

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  3. #2
    nothing more than a fan Always Red's Avatar
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    Re: no problem with youngsters in the bullpen

    I agree.

    I'm glad Narron got Arroyo out of there when he did last night; JN even mentioned pitch counts in the paper this morning, saying he wished Arroyo had about 10 less pitches than he did last evening, so JN is paying better attention to that, IMO.

    Brantley made an excellent point again last night about the young guys. Something to the effect that they have great arms, but they need to (all of them) have a second pitch they can throw for strikes, something offspeed to keep the hitters off stride. Even if they can throw a 110 mph fastball, a major league hitter will be able to hit it if he knows it's coming (I'd like to see that!).

    Now, that's not rocket science, and many here have said the same thing.

    Todd Coffey suffers from this same thing; he needs to mix it up a bit. McBeth needs to use the change a little more than he has, but I like his tendency to keep the ball down. Salmon seems to throw harder than all of them, but is a little bit too much in love with his FB. Cooter may ultimately be a LOOGY; I'm not sure yet.

    They all need work and repetition. This season is lost, so I'd get everybody up here who will be expected to produce in 2008 and get on with it. That includes Votto, I expect him to be here after the trade deadline, and playing some in 1B, and some in LF. And Dumatrait, too.

    Here's a question (off-topic): what do you do with Freel, who is ready to comeback soon? I'd rather have Hammy in there everyday, playing against RH and LH pitching.

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    Member Sea Ray's Avatar
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    Re: no problem with youngsters in the bullpen

    I have no problem with letting the youngsters take their lumps either but I don't like how Narron is using them. He gets his relievers up just about every night and he often pitches them an inning or less. I think he'd be better off to give them a few more nights off. When a guy pitches a good 7th leave him in another inning rather than burning through another pitcher to pitch the 8th. I think these relievers need the break for both physical and mental reasons. This goes for all the relievers, not just the rookies.

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    Re: no problem with youngsters in the bullpen

    You have to go with the youngsters. They're likely not the answer, but maybe you get one arm out of it.

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    You're being very UnDude. sonny's Avatar
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    Re: no problem with youngsters in the bullpen

    Quote Originally Posted by Falls City Beer View Post
    You have to go with the youngsters. They're likely not the answer, but maybe you get one arm out of it.
    At the least. I think we may have 3 fine arms who will grow and learn and be a part of a solid bullpen in the near future.
    Witty signature.

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    Re: no problem with youngsters in the bullpen

    Quote Originally Posted by sonny View Post
    At the least. I think we may have 3 fine arms who will grow and learn and be a part of a solid bullpen in the near future.
    I hear this every year. I don't mean any particular offense to you, sonny, but I hear this every single year. And each time it's no less true that they fail to be a solution.

  8. #7
    You're being very UnDude. sonny's Avatar
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    Re: no problem with youngsters in the bullpen

    I should have said "Best possible scenario..." At very least we could have 1 arm out of it. By no means am I that optimistic!
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    Member icehole3's Avatar
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    Re: no problem with youngsters in the bullpen

    hopefully we use the rest of the season to develop a legit reliever and then thats one less arm to worry about in the off season. I too dont trust Narron's handling of the bullpen. I think if one of the youngster's light bulbs goes off Narron will turn around and ride the horse into the ground and up the hill until the arm burns off.

  10. #9
    The Lineups stink. KronoRed's Avatar
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    Re: no problem with youngsters in the bullpen

    Quote Originally Posted by Falls City Beer View Post
    You have to go with the youngsters. They're likely not the answer, but maybe you get one arm out of it.
    Agreed, this is where still having Narron on board is a problem, he's going to go with sure things to win games and of course keep his job, he doesn't care about next year, of course any interim manager would be the same.
    Go Gators!

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    Knowledge Is Good Big Klu's Avatar
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    Re: no problem with youngsters in the bullpen

    Quote Originally Posted by KronoRed View Post
    Agreed, this is where still having Narron on board is a problem, he's going to go with sure things to win games and of course keep his job, he doesn't care about next year, of course any interim manager would be the same.
    Unless the interim manager is someone who has no aspirations of keeping the job fulltime--someone from the front office who knows something about handling pitchers. Maybe someone like Johnny Bench.

    No, I am not necessarily advocating Bench as a manager. (I don't know what kind of manager he would be.) But he is someone who could serve as caretaker for the pitching staff. I am fairly confident that he has no interest in a career as a manager (he has said as much in the past), but he might fill in as an interim manager--in the best interests of the club.
    Last edited by Big Klu; 06-30-2007 at 01:28 PM.
    Eric Stratton, Rush Chairman. Damn glad to meet ya.

  12. #11
    Member icehole3's Avatar
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    Re: no problem with youngsters in the bullpen

    what about Pole sliding over as manager, he certainly can handle the pitching staff and understand you can run a hot pitcher into the ground. With Narron his light doesnt click on until a couple of weeks later. Today's Cincy Post he finally says he pitched Arroyo to many pitchs a few starts ago.

    Narron's quote about Arroyo:
    Narron said. "We would have liked to see him get out of there with about 10 pitches less, no question. We've pushed him at times, more than we probably should have. I wasn't going to take that chance."

    http://news.cincypost.com/apps/pbcs....706300374/1027

  13. #12
    Making sense of it all Matt700wlw's Avatar
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    Re: no problem with youngsters in the bullpen

    Quote Originally Posted by Falls City Beer View Post
    You have to go with the youngsters. They're likely not the answer, but maybe you get one arm out of it.
    You don't know until you try.


    Time to try it out.

  14. #13
    The Lineups stink. KronoRed's Avatar
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    Re: no problem with youngsters in the bullpen

    Quote Originally Posted by Big Klu View Post
    Unless the interim manager is someone who has no aspirations of keeping the job fulltime--someone from the front office who knows something about handling pitchers. Maybe someone like Johnny Bench.

    No, I am not necessarily advocating Bench as a manager. (I don't know what kind of manager he would be.) But he is someone who could serve as caretaker for the pitching staff. I am fairly confident that he has no interest in a career as a manager (he has said as much in the past), but he might fill in as an interim manager--in the best interests of the club.
    Not bad thinking, I was thinking Tony Perez
    Go Gators!

  15. #14
    Redsmetz redsmetz's Avatar
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    Re: no problem with youngsters in the bullpen

    Quote Originally Posted by icehole3 View Post
    Let them take their lumps now, youve got Weathers, Everyday Eddie coaching them... I've got no problem with them learning on the job at this point. I wouldve like to have Burton instead of Stone but whatever give Ricky a shot too, see if he still has it. Bray and Burton need to be up here soon IMO. We are 20 games out it's extended spring training time. Belisle IMO should continue his development in the rotation.
    I agree. For all the crying about vet love and all, we've got some very young guys who very well could help this club for years to come. They're not getting the job done much of the time now, but I think we can find a good core of pitchers to grow with this team. And the limited number of veterans we currently have (and I'll include Guardado on the DL in this), helps these pitchers learn the ropes.

  16. #15
    Redsmetz redsmetz's Avatar
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    Re: no problem with youngsters in the bullpen

    Quote Originally Posted by KronoRed View Post
    Agreed, this is where still having Narron on board is a problem, he's going to go with sure things to win games and of course keep his job, he doesn't care about next year, of course any interim manager would be the same.
    Is there a manager alive who isn't managing to win games; sure things or not?

    I've been thinking about this and I'll probably get crucified for this, but I looked at the game logs back when Sparky (aka Captain Hook) was managing, and he used pitchers galore game after game after game. So how's this any different, other than our pitchers haven't been getting the job done?


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