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Thread: Biggio to Announce Retirement

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    Tired of talk. Win! Joseph's Avatar
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    Biggio to Announce Retirement

    Just heard this on the radio as I was at lunch. Presser in about an hour.

    Let me just say that while I never rooted for the opposition, watching Biggio and Bagwell all those years in Houston was nice as a baseball fan.

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    Posting in Dynarama M2's Avatar
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    Re: Biggio to Announce Retirement

    Effective immediately or after the season?

    For his sake, I hope it's immediately. He's not doing his team or his legacy any favors hanging around playing as poorly as he is at this moment.
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    Playoffs Cyclone792's Avatar
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    Re: Biggio to Announce Retirement

    One of the five greatest second basemen in the history of the game, IMO.

    I hated watching the Astros beat the Reds, but I loved watching Craig Biggio play. Biggio's 1997 season itself is one of the greatest and most underrated and underappreciated seasons of this generation.
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    Rally Onion! Chip R's Avatar
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    Re: Biggio to Announce Retirement

    Quote Originally Posted by M2 View Post
    Effective immediately or after the season?

    For his sake, I hope it's immediately. He's not doing his team or his legacy any favors hanging around playing as poorly as he is at this moment.

    I just read the article and it's after the season.
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    Waitin til next year bucksfan2's Avatar
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    Re: Biggio to Announce Retirement

    Quote Originally Posted by Cyclone792 View Post
    One of the five greatest second basemen in the history of the game, IMO.

    I hated watching the Astros beat the Reds, but I loved watching Craig Biggio play. Biggio's 1997 season itself is one of the greatest and most underrated and underappreciated seasons of this generation.
    He was a good ball player but in his prime he wasn't even in the top 2. I would take both Alamor and Kent over Biggio any day.

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    Churlish Johnny Footstool's Avatar
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    Re: Biggio to Announce Retirement

    Biggio is a sure-fire HOF'er at 2B.

    He's still hitting lefties very well this season (318/.351/.489) and he's only 3 HBPs away from the all-time record. I say the Reds should help him break that record the next time they face the Astros. C'mon, Craig, lean into a couple more for the record books.
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    Re: Biggio to Announce Retirement

    Quote Originally Posted by Johnny Footstool View Post
    Biggio is a sure-fire HOF'er at 2B.

    He's still hitting lefties very well this season (318/.351/.489) and he's only 3 HBPs away from the all-time record. I say the Reds should help him break that record the next time they face the Astros. C'mon, Craig, lean into a couple more for the record books.
    My bet is he never once was denied 1st base because he didn't try to get out of the way. That's a rule I've never seen enforced

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    Re: Biggio to Announce Retirement

    Quote Originally Posted by bucksfan2 View Post
    He was a good ball player but in his prime he wasn't even in the top 2. I would take both Alamor and Kent over Biggio any day.

    Unless your going for team wins.
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    Waitin til next year bucksfan2's Avatar
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    Re: Biggio to Announce Retirement

    Quote Originally Posted by Rojo View Post
    Unless your going for team wins.
    huh?

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    Re: Biggio to Announce Retirement

    Biggio was one of three dominant 2Bs during the bulk of the 1990s. The other two, Robbie Alomar and Chuck Knoblauch, saw their careers ram into walls. Jeff Kent was a late bloomer, who's been far better in his 30s (over the past decade) than he was in his 20s during the bulk of the 1990s.

    For the 10 seasons from 1992-2001, Biggio and Alomar were nothing short of stellar. Along with Barry Bonds, Ken Griffey Jr., Barry Larkin, Larry Walker and Jeff Bagwell, they were on the short list of best all-around players in baseball during those years.
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    Greatness In The Making RedLegSuperStar's Avatar
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    Re: Biggio to Announce Retirement

    For someone who has been a catcher, a center fielder, and a second baseman.. and who played them above average.. amazing!

    Truly one of the class acts
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    Re: Biggio to Announce Retirement

    If you look at his "most similar" lists on BaseballReference.com you get some pretty impressive comps, including Morgan, but also Alomar, Lou Whitaker, and even Pete. Actually Rose, another multi-position guy, might be a better all-around comp than the pure second basemen. It would be interesting to compare their win shares season-by-season.
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    Re: Biggio to Announce Retirement

    Quote Originally Posted by bucksfan2 View Post
    He was a good ball player but in his prime he wasn't even in the top 2. I would take both Alamor and Kent over Biggio any day.
    I wouldn't. Biggio in his prime was better than Alomar or Kent, and his career has better, too. Other than having a greater peak value than Alomar and Kent, and a greater career value than Alomar and Kent, Biggio was inferior to them.
    "Hey...Dad. Wanna Have A Catch?" Kevin Costner in "Field Of Dreams."

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    The Lineups stink. KronoRed's Avatar
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    Re: Biggio to Announce Retirement

    Quote Originally Posted by Sea Ray View Post
    My bet is he never once was denied 1st base because he didn't try to get out of the way. That's a rule I've never seen enforced
    Never a fan of the armor either.

    Still, great player
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  16. #15
    Big Red Machine RedsBaron's Avatar
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    Re: Biggio to Announce Retirement

    Quote Originally Posted by chicoruiz View Post
    If you look at his "most similar" lists on BaseballReference.com you get some pretty impressive comps, including Morgan, but also Alomar, Lou Whitaker, and even Pete. Actually Rose, another multi-position guy, might be a better all-around comp than the pure second basemen. It would be interesting to compare their win shares season-by-season.
    I can quickly give you their Win Shares from 1990 through 2001, but I don't have a book with the post-2001 numbers, which doesn't greatly matter for Biggio and Alomar, since 1990-2001 covers their prime:
    Biggio: 18, 20, 32, 26, 26, 29, 32, 38, 35, 31, 11, 25-Career 342
    Alomar: 19, 25, 24, 30, 13, 16, 31, 21, 19, 35, 20, 37-Career 345
    Kent: 0, 0, 10, 13, 18, 11, 11, 22, 25, 23, 37, 27- Career 197
    I assume that by now Biggio's career Win Shares total exceeds Alomar's, since I do not believe Almoar significantly added to his total after 2001, since his career fell off a cliff after that. Before that, they were very close. Kent has probably significantly increased his career total.
    I would defintiely vote to induct Biggio and Alomar into the Hall of Fame, and probably Kent as well. In his "New Historical Baseball Abstract" published in 2001, Bill James ranked Biggio no. 5, Alomar no. 10 and Kent no. 48 among all second basemen. I would assume that Kent would be in James's top twenty if he made the list now.
    If you want to add Rose and Morgan to the list, here's Pete's Win Shares from 1963 through 1986:
    19, 12, 27, 25, 24, 32, 37, 29, 28, 32, 34, 27, 31, 30, 23, 27, 27, 17, 17, 17, 7, 8, 14, 3-Career 547
    Joe's Win Shares from 1963 through 1984:
    1, 0, 30, 19, 26, 2, 24, 24, 29, 39, 40, 37, 44, 37, 30, 17, 18, 21, 14, 29, 19, 12-Career 512
    During the 1970s, Joe Morgan lead all major league players with 315 Win Shares for the decade. Pete Rose was second with 288. Johnny Bench was third with 263. The Reds had some decent players then.
    Last edited by RedsBaron; 07-24-2007 at 10:40 PM. Reason: Added Pete and Joe's Win Shares
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