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Thread: Is Bobby Livingston "crafty" enough??

  1. #1
    Reds 5:11 coachw513's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2006

    Is Bobby Livingston "crafty" enough??

    On one hand, he's giving his team a chance to win every time out, gets big outs, seems to know how to pitch and has been capable of avoiding the dreaded "crooked number" meltdowns that regularly affect Belisle and Lohse...

    On the other hand, a high WHIP of 1.48, a low K/9 rate of 3.41, and a BAA of .317...

    Are comparisons to Glavine legitimate???...Glavine broke in at 21, Livingston is 24...but Glavine's early numbers were far from dominant...after 3 years (432 innings) he had 1.32 WHIP, a 4.04 k/9 and 1.43 k/bb ratio...

    What are your expectations/thoughts??...could the Reds contend in '08/'09 with Livingston as a solid #4 behind Harang, Arroyo and Bailey (and I will assume Bailey will produce front of staff numbers)???

    You cannot defeat an ignorant man in an argument!
    -William Gibbs McAdoo

    Though many of us here are sure trying

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  3. #2
    Member Eric_Davis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Portland, Or

    Re: Is Bobby Livingston "crafty" enough??

    No. Bobby Livingston has been extremely lucky, as they say. His OPS is absolutely horrible showing he's getting pounded by opposing hitters.

    If he maintains this high of an OPS over the rest of the year and into next year and the REDS do not begin losing most of the games than he starts, then I'll say he may have a bend-don't-break mentality. Those WHIP and BAA numbers are part of what makes up OPS, and neither of them are anything that breeds success.

    I just hope the coaches are seeing from him growth, learning, adjustments, and the aggressiveness that they want to see from him.

    Along those lines, have you noticed Aaron Harang's OPS against this year? The lowest in his career. He's been pitching like an ACE the last 2 months, and if we weren't so dang far away from playoff contention, he's the type of pitcher now that could go against the other team's best pitcher in the World Series and come out the winner.

    I hope a lot of maturing comes from our AAA/AAAA pitchers the next 2 months and over winter ball.
    Rob Neyer: "Any writer who says he'd be a better manager than the worst manager is either 1) lying (i.e. 'using poetic license') or 2) patently delusional. Which isn't to say managers don't do stupid things that you or I wouldn't."

  4. #3
    Probably not Patrick Bateman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Calgary, AB

    Re: Is Bobby Livingston "crafty" enough??

    Livingston has definitely been very fortunate to date and he will need to strikeout hitters to be any bit successful, but I think he can be crafty enough.

    He's not there yet IMO. It's near impossible to be a decent starter with a K/9 under 4. He doesn't have to be a K pitcher to be successful though. If he can work it up towards the mid 5's and can keep the all over the plate, he can work.

    He's a big tall lefty so it's possible that he could still add a couple MPH's on his fastball and get the ball by hitters occasionally. However, in the short term, expect to see him experience some poundings. Luck will catch up to him soon, and it could get ugly. But there is always something worthwhile in a tall lefty that can find a plate. He might surprise you and become a legitamite back of the rotation guy, and considering his low salaries, he could be fairly useful. But he's not there yet. He mostly just needs time to see what kind of improvements he can make, and fortunately for him, he's in a place where there should be plenty of time available for his type.

  5. #4
    Join Date
    Nov 2000

    Re: Is Bobby Livingston "crafty" enough??

    Bobby Livingston is Lance Davis.

  6. #5
    Member cincrazy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    South Vienna, OH

    Re: Is Bobby Livingston "crafty" enough??

    I think it should be illegal in this country to call anyone Lance Davis.

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