From ORG: The State Of The Reds

[757690]

JoJo posted this on the Old Red Guard, and I thought it deserved some attention by us deemed not worthy enough.

"Hey all. This was posted by Lance McAllister on his blog today:

Quote:
Originally Posted by lance"the counting stats guy"
This Reds job is now more attractive to potential managers than it was two months ago. I was told at the time of Narron's firing that two unemployed "potential" candidates would not touch this situation during the 2007 season because of how big a mess it was. That mess isn't as messy now.
I've enjoyed every second of the Pete Mackanin era so far but I don't think '08 is any brighter now than it was for the team before PM took the helm. I'd argue that the Reds situation today hasn't changed at all from what it was 2 months ago with the exception that now their W-L record is in line with their pythag record. It's the same personnel, same farm, same FO, same prevailing philosophy and MO.

In general we as fans make way too much of results in relatively small time frames. This team after July 3rd is no more fixed/turning a corner this year than the roster that was 12 games over .500 during the first half of the '06 season had turned a corner last season. In essence we're seeing that happy side of random. (BTW, RMR authored a great post on true skill level and randomness here)

I'd submit that any managerial candidate that now would consider the job when he wouldn't have 2 months ago should automatically be crossed off of the list of potential candidates because to have that view necessitates an approach to player evaluation that would make them closer to part of the problem than part of the solution.

So what do you think?"

[uoduck1017]

It's tough because part of me says hire Pete for a one-year deal because the team seems to be showing signs of life. However, it's hard to ignore the Reds interim manager merry-go-round that leaves the fans not so merry.

[ChatterRed]

You win some, you lose some when it comes to personnel and managers.

They just flat out had a lousy team when they hired Miley. I was against hiring Narron based on his previous record as a manager.

I am for hiring Mackanin. I like what he has done.

I disagree that 40 games is a short time frame to see a different team. I can only wonder what this team might have done had Narron not been the manager or fired sooner.

[Chi-Town Red]

give Mack a one year deal...and go from there

[Orenda]

give Mack a one year deal...and go from there

Give him september, and go from there.

[Redhook]

Give him september, and go from there.

Yes. If he has a successful September, then look into giving him a 1 year contract, assuming there are no better candidates.

However, if he miraculously gets this team to the playoffs, then give him the contract he wants.

[Moosie52]

If the Reds had gone .500 in May,they would be in first place now. Heck, if they'd only been 5 games under .500 in May, they would be sitting pretty. I'd expect Pete to get a one year deal to manage the team.

[ThirdBaseCoach]

Pete will have more opportunities after the season. He may not want to come back to the Reds. He could be looking to go with a "proven winner."

[steig]

If we sign Pete then we are repeating history and bound for the same results in the long term. Not just because we hired a bargain basement manager but because management would have again sold us, the fans, on hope without really addressing the problems of the team. If we stand for this again then we are the fools. I want to see the team go after a big time manager as a sign that they are willing to rebuild this team as needed in order to truly compete for a world series.

[ThirdBaseCoach]

If we sign Pete then we are repeating history and bound for the same results in the long term. Not just because we hired a bargain basement manager but because management would have again sold us, the fans, on hope without really addressing the problems of the team. If we stand for this again then we are the fools. I want to see the team go after a big time manager as a sign that they are willing to rebuild this team as needed in order to truly compete for a world series.

Who are your three choices for "big time" manager?

[AmarilloRed]

It is all going to depend on what Pete does in September.

[Jim]

This feels like Miley all over again. Pete finishes off the season and, if he does well, is added to a list of experienced managers to interview. I'm impressed with him so far, but I want to see some level of evidence that whomever we hire will bring the right short term and long term strategy to the club.

[Muggerd]

Give him september, and go from there.

winner

[757690]

I was hoping this thread would be about the state of the Reds, and not Pete's job. Are they really a changed team from the beginning of the season, or the same and we are just seeing them at a different point in their win/lose arc?
And what does it say about a potential manager that he didn't want to manage the team in June, but now wants to?
I think they are a changed team. They have a lot of new talent...Bray Majewski, Burton, Keppinger, Hopper. And have lost some deadwood...Moeller, Coffey, Castro, Lohse, Cormier.
But more importantly, they now seem to be more of a team. Players know their role better, and everyone seems to be happy to play for Pete.

[ThirdBaseCoach]

This feels like Miley all over again. Pete finishes off the season and, if he does well, is added to a list of experienced managers to interview. I'm impressed with him so far, but I want to see some level of evidence that whomever we hire will bring the right short term and long term strategy to the club.

Who is on your list of experienced managers? What have you not seen about Pete's strategies for running the team?