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Thread: Why no Bruce??

  1. #76
    2009: Fail Ltlabner's Avatar
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    Re: Why no Bruce??

    Quote Originally Posted by mth123 View Post
    Again, this discussion is about keeping Griffey around and delaying the time for the Jay Bruce era to begin so that the Reds can "cash in" on the fanfare that Griffey's pursuit of 600 will create. I think the amount of airplay on Sportscenter and the other media coverage and attention surrounding the event is a pretty good measuring stick of how much fanfare there is. The more the hype, the greater the windfall for the organization. I still don't see much hype surrounding it or any major windfall occurring. The organization should not be considering number 600 at all in terms of future roster decisions.

    I think you agree.
    Since Sportscenter isn't even sure Cincinnati is a city in the state of Ohio, I'm not sure you can draw any correlation between the amount of airtime given to how the fans in Cincy would react in terms of attendnce.

    Doesn't mean there will be a huge groundswell of attendence (I don't think there will be) but drawing any correlation between what is seen on SportsCenter and relality is risky at best. That's like saying if the City goes bonkers and really supports the march to #600 but SportsCenter doesn't air it, it never really happened. All that matters is how many fans walk through the turnstyles at GABP. Again, I agree 100% that the increased attendence will likely pale in stratigic implications of a good trade (assuming one is offered) but I think your logic is faulty in getting there.

    And yes, the discussion is about Bruce and what to do with Jr vis a vis the 600 mark. But you were the one who opened the door to the idea that passing 600 was a ho-hum event that didn't mean much to sports history.
    Last edited by Ltlabner; 09-08-2007 at 08:39 AM.
    a super volcano of ridonkulous suckitude.

    I simply don't have access to a "cares about RBI" place in my psyche. There is a "mildly curious about OBI%" alcove just before the acid filled lake guarded by robot snipers with lasers which leads to the "cares about RBI" antechamber though. - Nate

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  3. #77
    Redsmetz redsmetz's Avatar
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    Re: Why no Bruce??

    Quote Originally Posted by Ltlabner View Post
    Doesn't mean there will be a huge groundswell of attendence (I don't think there will be) but drawing any correlation between what is seen on SportsCenter and relality is risky at best. That's like saying if the City goes bonkers and really supports the march to #600 but SportsCenter doesn't air it, it never really happened. All that matters is how many fans walk through the turnstyles at GABP. Again, I agree 100% that the increased attendence will likely pale in stratigic implications of a good trade (assuming one is offered) but I think your logic is faulty in getting there.
    And I think this was the point in Wheeler's column; i.e. that Griffey getting to 600 this season gives the Reds a bit more off-season leeway for moving Griffey. I doubt they expect a surge in attendance should it come down to it, but any spike is a good thing.

    Coupling that with the fact that there's no harm in not bringing Bruce up this season (particularly in light of him continuing to play in the offseason, even for a bit) makes this a win/win for the organization, IMO.

  4. #78
    Red's fan mbgrayson's Avatar
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    Re: Why no Bruce??

    Quote Originally Posted by Ltlabner View Post
    Since Sportscenter isn't even sure Cincinnati is a city in the state of Ohio....
    IS Cincinnati in Ohio? Last time I flew into the Cincinnati airport, they said "welcome to Kentucky".....
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  5. #79
    Matt's Dad RANDY IN INDY's Avatar
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    Re: Why no Bruce??

    Griffey certainly hasn't hurt the team this season.
    Talent is God Given: be humble.
    Fame is man given: be thankful.
    Conceit is self given: be careful.

    John Wooden

  6. #80
    Pre-tty, pre-tty good!! MWM's Avatar
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    Re: Why no Bruce??

    Quote Originally Posted by RANDY IN CHAR NC View Post
    Griffey certainly hasn't hurt the team this season.
    Exactly what I was thinking. This isn't about the fanfare around 600. It's about the fact that Griffey is still a damn good player. What are they going to do with him if Bruce is called up? Sit him on the bench? I don't see the need to get Bruce up here now.
    Grape works as a soda. Sort of as a gum. I wonder why it doesn't work as a pie. Grape pie? There's no grape pie. - Larry David

  7. #81
    Matt's Dad RANDY IN INDY's Avatar
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    Re: Why no Bruce??

    Agree, MWM. You just can't write off what Griffey has accomplished this season. Bruce is young and there is no need to rush him, not to mention that replacing the kind of numbers that Griffey has put up this season is no small task and full of pressure. I hope Bruce turns into a really good major league player, but there are certainly no guarantees. The Major League game is not easy and full of adjustments.
    Talent is God Given: be humble.
    Fame is man given: be thankful.
    Conceit is self given: be careful.

    John Wooden

  8. #82
    The Big Dog mth123's Avatar
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    Re: Why no Bruce??

    Quote Originally Posted by MWM View Post
    Exactly what I was thinking. This isn't about the fanfare around 600. It's about the fact that Griffey is still a damn good player. What are they going to do with him if Bruce is called up? Sit him on the bench? I don't see the need to get Bruce up here now.
    I don't disagree that Griffey has had a good year offensively. I've said many times that he and Dunn drive the offense no matter what everyone else is doing right now. But he's gone in a year anyway. All I am saying is if the Reds have a chance to move him and let Bruce play it shouldn't be passed by for some percieved need to let him hit number 600 as a red. Subtracting Griffey also has an immediate positive impact on team defense and will help every pitcher on the staff. The choice is really trade him while his value is better than at any time during his tenure here and hopefully acquire some organizational benefit beyond 2008 or keep him another year and then pay him $4 Million to walk when its done. Seems like a no brainer to me.
    "All I can tell them is pick a good one and sock it." --BABE RUTH

    Having better players makes "the right time" or "the big hit" happen a lot more often. PLUS PLUS

  9. #83
    The Boss dougdirt's Avatar
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    Re: Why no Bruce??

    Quote Originally Posted by mth123 View Post
    Anyone remember who the second guy to run a 4 minute mile was? How about the 3rd guy to clear 10 feet on the pole vault? Who was the 5th black player to cross the color barrier? Who was the second guy to throw a curve ball? These are all major accomplishments and fantastic feats in their own right. But none are opening new ground and as a result are minor footnotes in the scheme of things. From now on, a player hitting his 600th HR is in the same category. Bonds was the first guy in generations to do it, so it was somewhat noteworthy. Sosa was a complete afterthought. Griffey is close but, as the third guy this decade to do it, its old hat by now. That's a minor footnote in my book.
    Horrible comparison. You can't begin to try and compare track and field records to baseball ones. I can tell you the first, second, third, fourth, fifth and sixth player to reach almost all big milestones.
    Maybe Sosa was an afterthought because of the controversy surrounding him and a lot of his home runs that he hit. Did that ever cross your mind?

    Sure, if the right deal comes around for Griffey the Reds have to take it. They know that. I can't imagine Cast or Krivksy are that stupid that they wouldn't understand that.

  10. #84
    The Big Dog mth123's Avatar
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    Re: Why no Bruce??

    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    Horrible comparison. You can't begin to try and compare track and field records to baseball ones. I can tell you the first, second, third, fourth, fifth and sixth player to reach almost all big milestones.
    Maybe Sosa was an afterthought because of the controversy surrounding him and a lot of his home runs that he hit. Did that ever cross your mind?

    Sure, if the right deal comes around for Griffey the Reds have to take it. They know that. I can't imagine Cast or Krivksy are that stupid that they wouldn't understand that.
    Firstly, there is a difference between remembering Griffey as an elite player with X number of lifetime Home Runs and the actual impact of the specific game where he he hits said homer being anything major. That game will not be one that everyone remembers or IMO goes out of their way to attend. I'm sure some will, but not enough to make Griffey hitting number 600 as any part of marketing strategy or even register as much of a blip on the attendance meter. I guess it would allow them to get a big crowd one day w/o having to bribe the fans and they can save a few bobbleheads or $1 hot dogs for another day. A winning team on the field is the only strategy that should be considered.

    Secondly, I agree that if the right deal "comes along" this regime would probably take it. But righting this ship is going to take considerable effort and I hope that the Reds are seeking the right deals rather than waiting for them to "come along." This team needs to leave no stone unturned in its attempts to right itself. For the record, I am concerned that the Reds may not try real hard to move Griffey this offsesason solely for the purpose of letting him hit 600 as a red and in the process could lose the opportunity for improvement that a well transitioned changing of the guard could bring. That would be a failing IMO.
    "All I can tell them is pick a good one and sock it." --BABE RUTH

    Having better players makes "the right time" or "the big hit" happen a lot more often. PLUS PLUS


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