Bengals vs. Alka Seltzer Birds

[RedFanAlways1966]

On a different note, did I hear Ed Hochuli (sp?) correctly after the Hasselbeck "incompletion" on that game winning drive? Apparently, the play couldn't be reviewed because the defense recovered the fumble, despite no fumble being ruled on the field. So basically because the defense did its job too well (and not even being credited for it), it couldn't be reviewed. What the hell kind of rule is that?!

I think what Ed the ref was trying to say... since the pass was ruled incomplete, the play is dead. There cannot be a fumble or a recovery when the whistle has blown the play dead. Once the ball came out of Hasselback's hands the whistle was blown. I am guessing that Marvin told Ed that he wanted a review b/c he thought Hasselback caught the ball and fumbled it.

IMO... Hasselback did catch the ball. However, he was down and did not fumble. It should have been ruled a 3 to 5 yard loss.

[sonny]

An incomplete pass cannot be reviewed from what I understand.

BTW, I admit Chuck B. had a pretty good overall gameplan on D. If he could only plan with a chip on his shoulder every week.

[pedro]

Now Palmer is a choker?

The Bengals have a lot of problems but Carson palmer being a choker isn't one of them. That's just ridiculous.

Honestly, though I've come to expect a certain level of psychosis from posters on this site, sometimes I can be surprised when it reaches a new level and here we are.

[Screwball]

I think what Ed the ref was trying to say... since the pass was ruled incomplete, the play is dead. There cannot be a fumble or a recovery when the whistle has blown the play dead. Once the ball came out of Hasselback's hands the whistle was blown. I am guessing that Marvin told Ed that he wanted a review b/c he thought Hasselback caught the ball and fumbled it.

IMO... Hasselback did catch the ball. However, he was down and did not fumble. It should have been ruled a 3 to 5 yard loss.

Yeah, I think I'm starting to get it now. I'm pretty fuzzy on the rules concerning challenges, but I think a play that was ruled an incomplete pass - but ended up with the opposing defense recovering a fumble - cannot be reviewed. If it's ruled a fumble and the defense recovers, the play can be reviewed. I think that's why most referees tend to rule close plays like this one as a fumble on the field.

So basically, it seems that since Hochuli thinks that reversing the call would've resulted in a fumble recovery by the defense, it wasn't eligible to be reviewed (does that make sense?). If Hasselback had just held onto the ball when he was tackled (I think he was down anyway and there was no fumble), the play could've been reviewed, and the Seahawks certainly would've lost yardage.

I'm not sure if it would've mattered given the state of the Bengals' defense, but I found that to be a very important facet in deciding the outcome of the game.

[WMR]

Dhani Jones played himself a hell of a ballgame today. I was very impressed with how he stepped in there with, what, five days to prepare?

[Yachtzee]

Now Palmer is a choker?

The Bengals have a lot of problems but Carson palmer being a choker isn't one of them. That's just ridiculous.

Honestly, though I've come to expect a certain level of psychosis from posters on this site, sometimes I can be surprised when it reaches a new level and here we are.

Blaming Carson Palmer for these losses is like blaming Adam Dunn for the Reds' bullpen.

[MWM]

Blaming Carson Palmer for these losses is like blaming Adam Dunn for the Reds' bullpen.

I was getting ready to say the same thing. I don't know if it's a Cincy thing or not, but whenever things go wrong, they alwasy blame their best player. Carson Palmer is a superb QB. Only Manning and Brady are above him, and I don't think anyone else is even close. Take Palmer out of the mix, and this is a 3-13 team at best.

[guttle11]

Anyone who blames Carson should have their fandom revoked.

This game was lost because of stupid mental errors. Too many penalties and special teams brain lapses. Graham kicking that ball out of bounds is completely inexcusable. You can't win games in the NFL making that many basic fundamental errors.

[macro]

Take Palmer out of the mix, and this is a 3-13 team at best.

Which takes us back to the question of what really seperates Marvin Lewis from David Shula, Bruce Coslet, and Dick Lebeau? Is Lewis really no better than those guys two if we replace Palmer with Blake or Kitna?

Even during the dark ages of the 90s, Shula and Coslet took them to seasons of 7-9, 8-8, and 7-9 in 1995, 1996, and 1997. Lebeau got them to 6-10 in 2002. None of those coaches had one of the top three quarterbacks in the game playing for them. Yet Lewis goes 8-8 three out of four seasons and is regarded as a miracle worker. I'm sorry, but I'm becoming less impressed with each passing .500 season. A 6-10 season should send him packing, and I'm not sure I wouldn't do it at 7-9. 8-8 buys him one more season.

As has been pointed out already, though, this is all just message board chatter. Lewis is going nowhere as long as soP is calling the shots.

[dsmith421]

Carson Palmer is going to end up as the NFL's version of Ernie Banks.

This franchise is a disgrace through and through.

[RedsBaron]

Blaming Carson Palmer for these losses is like blaming Adam Dunn for the Reds' bullpen.

I've been expecting Cincinnati fans to start blaming Palmer for the ineptitude of the Bengals defense. It would indeed be consistent with Reds fans blaming Dunn for the ineptitude of the Reds bullpen. There is probably a Bengals/Reds fan somewhere ready to argue that the Bengals should trade Palmer to free up money to buy a defensive back and that the Bengals should play "small ball."

[RedFanAlways1966]

Graham kicking that ball out of bounds is completely inexcusable. You can't win games in the NFL making that many basic fundamental errors.

Heck, I think giving the opponent the ball on their own 40-yard-line is a moral victory for the Bengals. Their kickoff team really-really sucks. Usually 1st contact (on a good play) is made around the 35-yard-line.

[Razor Shines]

Their ineptitude is amazing. Even Carson contributed today with two bad interceptions.

It's not easy being a QB when you KNOW you have to score every time. Ask Peyton Manning about that. Get a half way decent D in Cincy and watch Carson's INTs almost drop to single digits every year.

Like other's have said Carson is one of the three best QBs in the NFL, no reason to give him any grief because of a bad defense.

[Redhook]

Their ineptitude is amazing. Even Carson contributed today with two bad interceptions.

Yes, their ineptitude is amazing.

However, Carson's interceptions weren't that bad. In fact, I believe they had very little to do with the outcome of the game, if anything. If you were watching the game (earlier you said you weren't) you'd understand why.

On the first one, if incomplete, the Bengals would've had to punt anyway and most likely the Seahawks would've had the same field position. In fact, it would be easy to argue that Carson's interception there saved the Bengals field position due to their piss-poor return coverage team. The second interception wasn't too different from the first one. Seahawks ball on the 31.

Both interceptions were the result of a non-existent running game. Carson played great yesterday. He was forced to throw a lot of deep passes to stretch the field out.

There are many reasons why the Bengals lost this game. Carson wouldn't make the list if it went to 100.

[Reds Freak]

Doc has it right in the Enquirer this morning, they are just good enough to disappoint. However, look at the Bengals remaining schedule for this year:

vs. New England (L)
Bye
@ KC (W)
vs. NY Jets (W)
vs. Pittsburgh (L)
@ Buffalo (W)
@ Baltimore (L)
vs. Arizona (W)
vs. Tennessee (W)
@ Pittsburgh (L)
vs. St. Louis (W)
@ San Fran (W)
vs. Cleveland (W)
@ Miami (W)

After New England, it gets ridiculously soft. At the most, I see four losses in there. If you look at Pittsburgh and Baltimore schedules, they only get tougher. I think the Bengals can get it together and make a run this year but it is tough to make the playoffs if you start out 1-3...